No point in contacting VOSA (DVSA these days) just yet. I think you've mentioned enough history now for it to be unlikely to be a manufacturing defect. Let your brother-in-law examine it and see what he thinks. IF the car has been poorly maintained in the past and someone has forgotten to tighten up a pinch bolt, that's clearly not Fiat's problem. If, on the other hand, he looks at it and thnks it may have always been like that, then by all means contact them. Send a few photos and a description of the fault. They're quite used to getting defects reported by members of the public so they won't be expecting huge technical detail. They can always send a vehicle examiner up to check it out if they feel it necessary. Don't worry, you won't fall out with Fiat, DVSA will contact them directly and are highly unlikely to pass on your details.
Technical Steering... please help??
- Thread starter Andy In A Grande
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Technical Steering... please help??
No point in contacting VOSA (DVSA these days) just yet. I think you've mentioned enough history now for it to be unlikely to be a manufacturing defect. Let your brother-in-law examine it and see what he thinks. IF the car has been poorly maintained in the past and someone has forgotten to tighten up a pinch bolt, that's clearly not Fiat's problem. If, on the other hand, he looks at it and thnks it may have always been like that, then by all means contact them. Send a few photos and a description of the fault. They're quite used to getting defects reported by members of the public so they won't be expecting huge technical detail. They can always send a vehicle examiner up to check it out if they feel it necessary. Don't worry, you won't fall out with Fiat, DVSA will contact them directly and are highly unlikely to pass on your details.
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Andy In A Grande
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Yeah been kinda getting that niggling feeling that it is more likely to be poor maintentenance rather than a manufacture fault as I started to piece the bits together on here and done that mot check thing etc...
Really I am now just hoping that it's not going to be too much of an expensive job, although at the same time I am willing to pay whatever it costs to make sure it's done properly...
Seems everyone agrees it to do with the pinch bolt coming loose or breaking??
So I assuming I should prepare myself for quite a high bill for this repair??
Just want her back on the road, I'm stuck sharing my wife's automatic zafira till mines fixed lol ??
Really I am now just hoping that it's not going to be too much of an expensive job, although at the same time I am willing to pay whatever it costs to make sure it's done properly...
Seems everyone agrees it to do with the pinch bolt coming loose or breaking??
So I assuming I should prepare myself for quite a high bill for this repair??
Just want her back on the road, I'm stuck sharing my wife's automatic zafira till mines fixed lol ??
"servicing" wouldn't find this..,
an MOT MAY have though.. when was the last one..??
basically your steering wheel is connected via a "solid tube" to the gears of the steering rack,
it's where the tube / column is bolted to the steering rack that has probably come undone..that why there a noise as it TRY's to still drive..,
Charlie
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Andy In A Grande
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No well I don't imagine very much would get noticed on a 'service' really??
But MOT, well that was done in November, and passed with no advisory notes, and was same previous year (November 2014)... only note ever made on an mot was 2013 for play in the wheel, but wasn't noted the following 2 years, despite not being touched or worked on in that time...
Also the 2014 a c the 2015 mot both done at completely different garages in different locations, 2014 was a halfords in reading, south England and it's most recent 2015 mot was done by an independent Mot tester here in Scotland. ..
When you say it like that it doesn't sound like a hideous expensive laborious job I have had in my mind it will be ??
But MOT, well that was done in November, and passed with no advisory notes, and was same previous year (November 2014)... only note ever made on an mot was 2013 for play in the wheel, but wasn't noted the following 2 years, despite not being touched or worked on in that time...
Also the 2014 a c the 2015 mot both done at completely different garages in different locations, 2014 was a halfords in reading, south England and it's most recent 2015 mot was done by an independent Mot tester here in Scotland. ..
When you say it like that it doesn't sound like a hideous expensive laborious job I have had in my mind it will be ??
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Andy In A Grande
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OK so my brother in law was out and checked it out today. ..
Turns out it is the steering column shaft, at the very top end. There is like a cuboid lump where a ball socket goes into, which is tightened on 1 side by a bolt, on the opposing side from the bolt it's snapped, hence loss of steering....
My local dealership has the part in stock, and is a reasonable 80 Inc vat (after negotiating from 90 + vat, so a good saving there)... will getting the part tomorow and hopefully have her back on the road by the weekend...
I will take pics and post tomorow to show the part that I mean as my description is probably really terrible!!
Again thanks to everyone here who has helped with their answers ??
Turns out it is the steering column shaft, at the very top end. There is like a cuboid lump where a ball socket goes into, which is tightened on 1 side by a bolt, on the opposing side from the bolt it's snapped, hence loss of steering....
My local dealership has the part in stock, and is a reasonable 80 Inc vat (after negotiating from 90 + vat, so a good saving there)... will getting the part tomorow and hopefully have her back on the road by the weekend...
I will take pics and post tomorow to show the part that I mean as my description is probably really terrible!!
Again thanks to everyone here who has helped with their answers ??
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Andy In A Grande
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I'm going to guess this is the pinch bolt you have been referring to??
That is the part that has broken, directly opposite the opening where the bolt goes through, as in the that knuckles has essentially broken in half..
Is this the bolt that needs tightened to a specific torque?? If it is, does anyone know the torque for it?? I am as I already said, getting the part from a fiat dealer so I can be sure I'm getting the correct part, but just want to get back on the road, BUT SAFELY!! ??
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Andy In A Grande
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Andy In A Grande
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Probably not the best picture... but the break can be seen...
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stressed - obviously
chances are that WAS picked-up at the old MOT.. but not really OBVIOUS play
http://eper.fiatforum.com/eper/navi...INT_MODE=0&EPER_CAT=SP&WINDOW_ID=1&GUI_LANG=3
it's the top end of part #8 Articulated shaft.. YES..??
there COULD be a quoted figure for the specific part, AndyRKett , cmosfxx
I'd use the general torque figure for the bolt thread..M8 x 1.25 probably,
then add a little Loctite and torque-up - chances are it'll NEVER be touched again in the life of the car
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Andy In A Grande
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Yes it's what's called the articulated shaft, part #8 in the diagram at the top end the connects with the steering column...
Yeah well 'play in the wheel' was noted as advisory in 2013 but wasn't mentioned on either of the 2 mot done since then (2014/2015) ?...
That's useful to know, was looking at torque quids but numbers aren't my strong point lol, so that points me in the right direction at least, although will ask in at the dealership when I collect the part on Saturday morning? They should be able to tell me??
Add a little loctite?? As in the superglue stuff?? ? lol
Yeah well 'play in the wheel' was noted as advisory in 2013 but wasn't mentioned on either of the 2 mot done since then (2014/2015) ?...
That's useful to know, was looking at torque quids but numbers aren't my strong point lol, so that points me in the right direction at least, although will ask in at the dealership when I collect the part on Saturday morning? They should be able to tell me??
Add a little loctite?? As in the superglue stuff?? ? lol
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Andy In A Grande
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Nice 1 cmosfxx cheers for that... have the part ordered from dealership now, will hopefully be getting sorted Saturday. ..
Was speaking with a friend of a friend this evening, who used to work for my local dealership, was saying about the problem and he said he remembered them all coming back in for the recall for faulty steering problems, but never seen a break like that lol... his opinion was that it almost certainly has been worked on in the past, and over tightened...
Was speaking with a friend of a friend this evening, who used to work for my local dealership, was saying about the problem and he said he remembered them all coming back in for the recall for faulty steering problems, but never seen a break like that lol... his opinion was that it almost certainly has been worked on in the past, and over tightened...
Here's my guess as to what has happened. At some point, the pinch bolt has failed - possibly under or over-tightened - perhaps from new. This has meant that whenever the steering is turned, the jaws of the universal joint ("articulated shaft") have been forced open slightly by the flats on the shaft turning within it. Each time the steering is turned the other way, the jaws close up and are then forced open slightly as the torque comes on in the other direction. The slackness in the straight ahead position has been incorrectly diagnosed as play in the rack, during the MOT test. After many thousands of repeated opening and closing actions , the area opposite the gap between the jaws (where the stresses would be highest) develop a fatigue crack, leading to the final failure.
I'd be inclined to replace both the joint and the thing that pushes into it.
I'd be inclined to replace both the joint and the thing that pushes into it.
Looks like a metal fatigue issue, Maybe bolt wasn't tight enough allowing the housing to flex each time the pressure came on. I checked mine and all was OK. A proper splined shaft is much better but obviously costs more!
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Andy In A Grande
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Yeah, the general consensus seems to be that it's either been over or under tightened at at some point, and the pressure has caused the break...
Collecting the part today, and will pick up some of that loctite while I'm at it, assuming I can pick it up from halfords??
Lol sorry to have caused you concern to go out and check your own car, at least it is OK though ??
Collecting the part today, and will pick up some of that loctite while I'm at it, assuming I can pick it up from halfords??
Lol sorry to have caused you concern to go out and check your own car, at least it is OK though ??
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Andy In A Grande
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OK so just been to halfords, they don't stock loctite 243 only 248, this is also a threadlocker...
Is the 248 ok to use or do I specifically need 243?? Please help guys lol
Cheers
Is the 248 ok to use or do I specifically need 243?? Please help guys lol
Cheers
I wouldn't be too fussed about which grade of Loctite, to be honest. That said, I take it you bought a new pinch bolt? Does the pinch bolt not have a locking nut that goes on the end? (Sometimes a nut with a little circle of blue plastic in the end).
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Andy In A Grande
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Yes, I bought the part new from dealership, and it didn't even have the bolts with it, never mind any nuts!! Lol...
I just got the 248 and it bow repaired, but now I have something else going on... the horn has disengaged, and my steering wheel is clicking as I turn, sounds worse and louder when stationary/going slow... I have just had airbag and steering wheel off, but can't see anything obvious ??
I just got the 248 and it bow repaired, but now I have something else going on... the horn has disengaged, and my steering wheel is clicking as I turn, sounds worse and louder when stationary/going slow... I have just had airbag and steering wheel off, but can't see anything obvious ??
Behind the steering wheel, there's a little plastic "cassette" that the wires on the back of the steering wheel and airbag plug into. I think it contains a sort of "ribbon cable" like in a printer. This is supposed to wind and unwind as the steerign goes from lock to lock. Chances are, you've snapped the wire in it when the wheel was just turning continuously in each direction. At least, that's my guess. Might be a dealer job to set it up properly, I'm afraid, unless anyone on here has done it?
