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Old 28-04-2012   #61
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

Quote Originally Posted by D4nny8oy View Post
The complaints should really be directed at those companies-
Why? Legally it's Fiat's responsibility in what parts it used to build their vehicles. In this instance they haven't used due dilligance in noticing a trend (even if the Technians working on them do). BMW's Mini suffers similar problems BMW took hold of the problem and sorted it out weither car was under warranty or not. Stark opposite of what Fiat manage to do.

Quote Originally Posted by D4nny8oy View Post
Many other manufacturers use EPAS too, and have similar issues, why weren't they singled out for a slating?
Very true but most of the others are much more reliable, Hyundai for instance have been using EPAS for about 5 years. No horror stories of them failing yet.... And although it does happen I think the way Fiat are dealing with it is what is leading to the hostility against them. I think the fact they didn't even make an appearance on the show sums up their attitude.
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Last edited by ChrisUK; 28-04-2012 at 10:31.
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Old 28-04-2012   #62
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

Quote Originally Posted by ChrisUK View Post
Hyundai for instance have been using EPAS for about 5 years. No horror stories of them failing yet....
don't they have a 5 or 7 year warranty? so no one will be moaning on forums about them yet
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Old 28-04-2012   #63
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

It would of been pointless for anyone to represent Fiat on the programme. As I mentioned earlier the representative wouldn't get a chance to answer and like all the people that go on the programme would be made to look stupid. I actually liked 'watchdog' but the days of it being a creditable programme are long gone as it tries to inject humour and pretend to be the consumers beacon light. A strongman driving in & out of cones clearly shows the programmes lack of technical research into the actual faults that can occur, did anyone think of asking the technicians that know and work on the systems? Dedicated internet forums can provide you with better advice and background information these days.

Should the EPS systems be failing, no of course not but then again all makes of cars have similar issues some just hide them better than others, also BMW were not that generous in replacing EPS systems.

I would assume Fiat just claim money back from the EPS manufacturer so would not lose out financially anyway but the way 'they' have handled the whole situation since the days of the Mk2 punto has been poor to say the least although my 9 year old punto has it's original EPS system still on it after 90k, might become a collectors item soon
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Old 28-04-2012   #64
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

ive just learned that the linea is hydraulic, is it fully hydraulic or electric pumped?
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Old 28-04-2012   #65
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

Does anyone know if the power steering system is the same in the Fiat 500 as the Panda. I ask because I know they share components. My red light came on with a power steering failure and the steering became very heavy. I got to work parked up, and when I went home it was fine. I called Fiat Customer care on Friday and they eventually gave me a reference number and will have it looked at by Fiat on Monday. Though they were insistent that the Watchdog programe did not refer to my model, and there were no reported problems with it.
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Old 28-04-2012   #66
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

Quote Originally Posted by krossi View Post
Does anyone know if the power steering system is the same in the Fiat 500 as the Panda. I ask because I know they share components.
That's quite an understatement. Apart from the styling and rear suspension, they're basically the same car.

So yes, if it's an issue for Pandas, it'll be an issue for 500s as well.
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Old 28-04-2012   #67
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

I thought it only affected cars up to 2008 or so. When was the 500 launched? 2007 wasn't it.
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Old 28-04-2012   #68
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

Mine was registered in May 2008 so four years old next week. 50k on the clock and it has been beseiged with problems. Whilst under warranty it needed a new control unit. Now problems with the power steering, drivers door handle has come loose, and the tailgate won't open. I just brought a new carriage charge lock (40) as I thought it was the solenoid and fitted it but still not working. It seems that the old fiat electrical problems still persist depsite the trendy marketting and image they want to potray.
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Old 28-04-2012   #69
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

My 56 plate 1.4 Active Sport has just failed this week, I cannot believe the timing. I can see recon units on Ebay are available, I have rang them today and am getting a refurb/exchange unit next week for 234.50. Is this a job a reasonably competent DIY person can do or do I need to get a mechanic to fit and do I need special tools?

Does anyone know?
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Old 28-04-2012   #70
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

Quote Originally Posted by krossi View Post
Does anyone know if the power steering system is the same in the Fiat 500 as the Panda. I ask because I know they share components. My red light came on with a power steering failure and the steering became very heavy. I got to work parked up, and when I went home it was fine. I called Fiat Customer care on Friday and they eventually gave me a reference number and will have it looked at by Fiat on Monday. Though they were insistent that the Watchdog programe did not refer to my model, and there were no reported problems with it.
Quote Originally Posted by KozmoNaut View Post
So yes, if it's an issue for Pandas, it'll be an issue for 500s as well.
NO they are not, Krossi customer care are correct in what they are telling you. You are advised to get a software update from your nearest Fiat dealership that will cure your issue.
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Old 28-04-2012   #71
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

My grande is coming up to 6 years old ,not 1 issue with the steering ,so they aren't all faulty ,car is on 59,000 miles so is used a lot ...
Another point is..What is the ratio of cars built to failure rate ???
Why should any manufacturer replace an item on a car that is (a) out of warranty (b) may have no service history (c) don't know how it has been driven ,i dare say pot holes and kerbing a car will put a shock through the steering column ,could this be contributing to failure ???
Does anyone really take Watchdog seriouly anymore ..They put faults on items and then don't give a proper description of what went wrong ,then when the lad goes of on a tangent ,they crucify him ...I remember when they did the RAC over batteries ,they parked a car in a car park ,put a flat battery in it ,then told RAC parked up went shopping came back and battery dead .Now if you leave your car for 30 mins come back and batt is dead i would imagine if belt etc is ok then batt may be duff ,and not just need a jump ,RAC was trying to do a 1st time fix
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Old 28-04-2012   #72
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Quote Originally Posted by phil0254 View Post
My grande is coming up to 6 years old ,not 1 issue with the steering ,so they aren't all faulty ,car is on 59,000 miles so is used a lot ...
Another point is..What is the ratio of cars built to failure rate ???
Why should any manufacturer replace an item on a car that is (a) out of warranty (b) may have no service history (c) don't know how it has been driven ,i dare say pot holes and kerbing a car will put a shock through the steering column ,could this be contributing to failure ???
Does anyone really take Watchdog seriouly anymore ..They put faults on items and then don't give a proper description of what went wrong ,then when the lad goes of on a tangent ,they crucify him ...I remember when they did the RAC over batteries ,they parked a car in a car park ,put a flat battery in it ,then told RAC parked up went shopping came back and battery dead .Now if you leave your car for 30 mins come back and batt is dead i would imagine if belt etc is ok then batt may be duff ,and not just need a jump ,RAC was trying to do a 1st time fix
(a) It should be fit for purpose, and last a reasonable amount of time. It isn't and it doesn't.
(b) do they service the eps? no. Full service history makes no difference.
(c) Pot holes are an unavoidable part of driving.

Yes watchdog is a load of bull. What are they doing reporting that the 99p store is ripping people off. It only costs 99p! Who cares!
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Last edited by Crx16; 28-04-2012 at 22:09.
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Old 28-04-2012   #73
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

Quote Originally Posted by D4nny8oy View Post

The complaints should really be directed at those companies- if it were a simple fix, do you not think Fiat would have sorted it by now, thus saving a huge amount in warranty claims by Dealers which it has to pay for?
The simple fact is that Fiat have used cheap parts which aren't manufactured to a standard that will last the life of the car. They then replace the part with the same part and so it fails time and time again.

This problem has been ongoing since the MK2 Punto. Over 10 years. Fiat continue to use cheap, poorly manufactured parts and so the problem is ongoing.

Regardless why Fiat havent sorted the problem, the fact is, they haven't.

As far as it being hard to steer when it cuts out, I've driven Babz's Punto on many occasions when it's happened. It can sometimes be a surprise but I've come to expect it now and so just get on with it. it isn't hard to steer. Just heavier but not to the point you can't do it. Yes, manouvers are tricky but not impossible. Anyone ever thought to click the ignition back a notch and back on whilst the car is still moving? Takes less than a second, resets the steering ECU and can be done perfectly safely without stopping. Doesn't even kill the engine if you keep it in gear.
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Old 29-04-2012   #74
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

Of course it's fit for purpose .What is the ratio of failures to cars made. a point that seems to be ignored

Of course service history matters ,no history means car may never have been serviced and someone with no knowledge has been messing about with systems they know nothing about ,who in their right mind will warrant anything that they have no record of being maintained ..You buy the car you know the warranty period ,any help outside of that is of goodwill and generally involves a service history

Potholes are an unavoidable part of driving ?? Why they shouldn't be ,look at the damage they cause to cars ,buckled wheel etc ,and probably cause accidents due to people trying to avoid them etc ,but that's acceptable ?????Well guess what ,parts failing on cars is an unavoidable part of driving ..I thought roads had to be up to standard ,after all the money we pay for them ,i've had countless broken front springs ,but i don't go to fiat complaining as it is 99% down to the state of the roads ..
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Old 29-04-2012   #75
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Re: The BBC WATCHDOG THREAD

Wear and tear on parts is all part of owning a car and yes, you should expect to replace certain parts.

The fact is, these steering columns fail within warranty. Surely that shows the part isn't fit to last the length of the car. Service history doesn't come into it. These parts are not serviceable. Nor would then be touched in a service anyway.

No, not all cars suffer this problem but that is besides the point. A large number do and Fiat have just basically said it is up to the owners to fix and have continually denied there is a problem. Owners pay for the replacement part and it fails again as it is still a poorly built piece of hardware.
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