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Old 12-08-2019   #31
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

Actually, if I can access the black plug, to extend the wires, assuming I can get the correct sections and colours, I will use molex connectors as I have some around. They are ex-PC and 4 way, so 2 will do it. Plus, i have the corect pin removal tool which works a treat on these!
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Old 12-08-2019   #32
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

Access to connector D018B is much improved if you bite the bullet and remove parcel shelf, plus LHS lower dash and glove box. Lots of screws into clip on "spire" nuts with T25 head, plus one M6 at bottom, with H5 recess head.


The T25 screws are one recessed near quarterlight, one behind oddment tray above fuses. (Flip tray out with wallpaper stripping knife or similar tool.) Four screws along top of glove box (not two holding latch), and two in rear of glove box recess. Then two at front of parcel tray, all much easier than lower two on steering column cover.

For the lower steering column cover I have fitted a 20mm length of reinforced PVC fuel hose over the end of a standard PZ2 driver. This makes screw head location much easier. For replacing check alignment with torch and mirror, before using a claw type retriever as a screw starter.


The area above my LHS fuseboard is a mess, due to the activities of an alarm installer commissioned by the converters. Wiring scrambled, and unmounted connectors in a bundle, but with the lower dash panel removed it is fairly easy to get to the black connector D018B. This connector is a sealed Delphi Hybrid accepting larger inserts in in ways 3 & 4. These two centre ways are used by the cab aircon option, and would need to be high current rated if aircon is fitted. I have considered replacing the female section, which on my vehicle only carries the cruise control wires. In this case I could label it D018C. I have download drawings of the Delphi connector, and may see if I can work out where I am going wrong. Meanwhile my jury rig will hold together.

After taking the parcel shelf out, I removed the radio and message holder assembly. With the binnacle removed I was able to run a fish wire across the front, through the existing cableform supports. Made a tidy job of the cable run. Two metres of cable were sufficient to run between the new Alfa 147 stalk connector and D018B, plus another metre to connect to 12V +ve at D160A/1.

The final work of cutting the slot for the Alfa 147nstalk in the lower steering column cover should not be rushed. The wiring is out of sight, but it would be difficult to hide a badly cut slot. I made a cardboard template, to which I made several adjustments before marking out and cutting the slot.
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Old 12-08-2019   #33
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

I should have added that as regards cable colours, I try to match the base colour, and then add a coloured band at each end as a marker. Normally I use stretched short lengths of coloured PVC sleeving (very old stock), but in this case I bought a lengths of purple and green heatshrink. The large unused quantity has boosted my stock of heatshrink for future jobs.
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Old 12-08-2019   #34
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

This info is solid gold to me. I will likely end up biting said bullet. However, I think that some of the panel screws that you refer to as near the quarterlight, will be a problem for me, as it is an A class and thus from the dash panels back, including the side walls, is all bespoke. I have seen in eLearn 2 screws that locate transversly near the position of the door A pillar on a regular cab, that if fitted to mine, are inaccessible. We shall see.

I too had a hantle of bother getting a Torx bit on to the column shroud screws, so your tip is welcome. Same in my Smart car too, strangely, almost an identical layout.

As for wiring mess made by the convertor, most MoHos will have some. Mine has some under the flip up clipboard for the radio.

I have aircon in mine so will need to accomodate the extra cross section of the wires in any new plug. A deep breath and dive in, then, and maybe take pics as I go just in case!
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Last edited by Ocwobio; 12-08-2019 at 23:13.
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #35
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

On reflection, I thought that I had written too much, but as the detailed info is appreciated I will expand on a few items.

The screws at the front lower dash covers of my PVC are symetrical, and close to the A pillar. If I follow a line round the corner below the heating vents, I can find the recessed screw head just as I touch the door seal. If you have problems reaching this screw, right angle torx wrenches, or mini thumb wheel ratchet wrenches come to mind. It is possible to remove the parcel tray (no passenger air bag) without removing the lower dash. Just remove or loosen the screws as appropriate. The two components clip together, so replacing could be tricky.

On my vehicle you would find it difficult to remove the lower steering column cover screws with a Torx bit, as they have PZ2 heads. Incidently the fuseboard cover screws are PH2, why?????

As you have aircon, if you wish to bypass the black Delphi connector why not leave it in place with the aicon connections, and divert only the four cruise control connections?

My radio connections are tucked away, but I am considering mounting a no screen dash cam at the front of the clipboard. (All dash cameras offered seem to be screen cameras, and these would interfere with Remis blinds.)
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #36
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

Hello again!

"As you have aircon, if you wish to bypass the black Delphi connector why not leave it in place with the aicon connections, and divert only the four cruise control connections?"

That is what I intend to do. A single Molex will the suffice, 4 way and will take the current involved. I even though about picking the 4 wires up in the engine bay nearer to the fuse box therein, and going in thru the dash at the RHS, I will have a look to see the possibilities in the next day or two.
As for too much info- not a bit of it! If I can't accomplish this job now in light of the foregoing, well, I deserve to watch Barbie doll unboxing videos on youtube for the rest of my days.
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #37
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

Quote Originally Posted by GlenR View Post
Hi im new to the forum. I have sourced the parts mentioned above but the indicator stalks are different will this still work. I have a 2002 ducato 2.8.

Thanks
Glen
Sorry for late reply! I have the same switches, so this will work. The thing is, we are not changinging the wiper or light switches. I have Alfa one that came with the cruise switch, don't know if they can be swapped over all as a unit, but not necessary anyway. Just add the Alfa cruise lever to our existing switch module- there should be a recess that is made for it.Logic then says that being as the Duc had steering wheel controls for the cruise, this suggests that the whole switch assembly may well work as a complete unit, lights, wipers and all. But check first and I don't take responsibility if it won't, lol.
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #38
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

I am now part way thru this job. I have connected to the wires from the ecu in the black plug, by cutting the required 4 wires short of the connector and extending a little into a 4 way ex-pc Molex connector, thence via 7 core trailer cable to the vicinity of the stalk switch location. I had to substitute the orange wire of the stalk for the brown one in the 7core as this does not contain an orange strand. (BTW the pins removed from the stalk switch leads are a very near match to the black connector ones needed, but getting them in was a problem due to 1- space, 2- not sure they would 'click' into the housing, but they fit the slots well).

I now need to fit the stalk, connect the 4 of the wires from that to the 7 core as per colours in that, watching for the fact that brown is the new orange. This then leaves the yellow one to connect. Most users of this stalk cruise switch connect the yellow to pins 1,3, and 4 (IIRC) on the brake light swich. As I have 4 wires going to all pins of a 4 pin brake light switch (not yet fitted, later today hopefully), it looks like I won't have to bridge pins 1 and 3 there, if I have this right, just taking a key switched live feed from a suitable other point. I have one in mind.

So, bottom line--do I have to take the yellow from the stalk to the brake switch, and pick up a feed there? Or as there are already 4 wires into/out of the switch, (2 normally open, for the brake lights, and 2 normally closed for cruise I think?) it is already set up for cruise apart from the + switched supply to yellow , and once that is taken from elsewhere, no further need to attach any connection to the brake light switch is necessary? If you see what I mean. In short, can I forget the yellow to brake switch and bridging pins 1 and 3 there if an alternative supply is used?

I am taking pics as I go and will hopefully be able to do a write up on here when finished. I may have to stop for a while and return to it later, depending on progress rate. I have some other things to do while I have the tools out and dash partially stripped.
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Last edited by Ocwobio; 4 Weeks Ago at 05:26.
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #39
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

Just tried to get the brake switch changed. Totally impossible. I cannot get a mini grinder/dremel in, to make a recess in the metalwork behind that stops removal of even the plug, never mind the switch. As the steering column is in the way,and can't get lower dash panel off anyway as one screw is buried in the sidewall structure. Also got the wrong switch anyway, the operating 'tit' sticks out too far by at least 5mm.
Also unable to bend brake switch bracket down enough to allow removal of switch or connector plug.

It is also not possible to splice into the wires to the switch as I can't do it one handed- cutting, stripping, soldering and heat shrinking.

So, it looks like I will have no choice to connect into the (D160A?) connector wherever that is to be found.
Anyone got a pic?
Found a likely suspect but can't i.d. it and need to know where the pins to bridge are in it, and how many wires go in? I got it into my head that it is an unused connector with quite a few wires into it? Think I need pins 1 and 6 jumpered together, them the same wire from that jumper goes off to the cruise stalk yellow wire.

This job is crashed and burning just now, can it get any worse?
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Last edited by Ocwobio; 4 Weeks Ago at 13:25.
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #40
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

Ocwobio,

Where do I start? The connector D160A will only give you the 12V supply from F27. As previously stated D160A is located front right, under the instrument binnacle, and to quote the translation from the Italian, "There is not much wealth of cable." I had to release the plastic holder from the framework to gain access. On the female side of D160A pin 6 is fitted with a single 0.75mm Wh/Bl wire, I managed to solder an 0.5mm blue loop for connecting to pin 1, where a new female terminal is required. A second wire wire from pin1 is required to extend the supply to the yellow wire of the Alfa 147 stalk. I think that it may be possible to use red "Scotchlok" IDC connectors rather than install two wires in a single terminal insert. I used a spare AMP superseal female insert at pin 1. It latched in position OK.

I do not think that removing the RHS lower dash panel is essential, but it allows more light on the scene. Back to filing, or repeat relay, both of which present problems. I have measured the brake pedal switch that I removed from my vehicle. The operating button protrudes about 11mm, but the plot thickens. Illustrations on the Italian Camperonline site show the two pin switch as I have described, but the replacement 4 pin switch appears longer as you have described.

The new switch that I fitted was a LEMARK LBLS090, ordered on Ebay from All Car Parts Ltd. Another number on the box was A036829. Ebay item No. was 2917 0454 2326. I searched for Fiat Part No. 1029 5468 4051 0. Cost was 8.12 delivered.


I have some pictures but they are still on my camera card. For a quick view of some photos follow the following link to the Italian site, and scroll down. https://forum.camperonline.it/tecnic...4-aiuto/222555

I hope that the above is of some help.
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Last edited by Communicator; 4 Weeks Ago at 15:27. Reason: Details of brake pedal switch added
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #41
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

I have got the brake switch out!


I disengaged tthe connector tab, rotated the switch off its bayonet so as to tilt it (tried this before tho'), and let my temper out on pulling the plug out. It gave, so then had room to get the switch body out. The tit on the new swich was as stated too long, so I cut off the rounded head and the short square section belw it. It is neow exactly! the same length as the old one. Getting the new one back will be hard I expect. BUT I hve managed to get theintermediate piece of loom out, about 6 inches, with the switch plug one end, and a socket the other. I can solder now in comfort before running the replacement gauntlet, at least.

So to be clear- I now bridge wire switch pins 1 and 3, spurring off this bridge to yellow stalk cable? Pins 1 and 3 being normally closed and check out thus for correct continuity, going openwhen brake is pressed, and the oppsite on 2 and 4, for brake lights. Will, therefore, 1 and 3 bridge supply my + swiched voltage- internally from pin 2 or 4- or do I need it from elsewhere? I know I keep asking the same old stuff, but I'm bouncing off walls here with the frustration of a job I wished I had never started!
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #42
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

I have got the brake switch out!


I disengaged tthe connector tab, rotated the switch off its bayonet so as to tilt it (tried this before tho'), and let my temper out on pulling the plug out. It gave, so then had room to get the switch body out. The tit on the new swich was as stated too long, so I cut off the rounded head and the short square section belw it. It is neow exactly! the same length as the old one. Getting the new one back will be hard I expect. BUT I hve managed to get theintermediate piece of loom out, about 6 inches, with the switch plug one end, and a socket the other. I can solder now in comfort before running the replacement gauntlet, at least.

So to be clear- I now bridge wire switch pins 1 and 3, spurring off this bridge to yellow stalk cable? Pins 1 and 3 being normally closed and check out thus for correct continuity, going openwhen brake is pressed, and the oppsite on 2 and 4, for brake lights. Will, therefore, 1 and 3 bridge supply my + swiched voltage- internally from pin 2 or 4- or do I need it from elsewhere? I know I keep asking the same old stuff, but I'm bouncing off walls here with the frustration of a job I wished I had never started!
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #43
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

Quote Originally Posted by Ocwobio View Post
I have got the brake switch out!

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


So to be clear- I now bridge wire switch pins 1 and 3, spurring off this bridge to yellow stalk cable? Pins 1 and 3 being normally closed and check out thus for correct continuity, going openwhen brake is pressed, and the oppsite on 2 and 4, for brake lights. Will, therefore, 1 and 3 bridge supply my + swiched voltage- internally from pin 2 or 4- or do I need it from elsewhere? I know I keep asking the same old stuff, but I'm bouncing off walls here with the frustration of a job I wished I had never started!
Sorry NO!

May I start with defining the states of the switch. Out of the box, switch pins 2 & 4 will form a NC pair (compare with old switch) for the stop lights, and pins 1 & 3 will be NO for cruise control. This is the opposite of what you may reasonably expect, but when in situ the switch button is held depressed by the brake pedal in its released (normal) position. The eLearn diagrams take this operated state of the switch as Normal. For simplicity, I will follow this convention, and assume that the switch is mounted on the vehicle.

Terminal 4 of the switch is connected to 12V obtained via 7.5A fuse F26. Wire colour should be Blue/Green (LV in Fiat code). You need to link this wire to terminal 3 of the switch Blue wire (L in Fiat code), and extend to the yellow wire of the Alfa 147 switch stalk. (The existing wire on terminal 3 routes directly to connector D160A/1 and terminates there.)

To complete the switch terminal information pin 2 Red/Black (RN) connects to the stop lights, and pin 1 Grey/Black (HN) connects to the EMC A54 via D001/B, and D004A/A08. I have not checked but I think that D004A is the connector in the base of the engine bay fusebox.

Now that you have the switch out, would it be possible to enlarge the slot? That is what I did.
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Last edited by Communicator; 4 Weeks Ago at 18:29. Reason: Minor correction
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #44
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

No need to enlarge the slot, got the new one in Ok and connected up,,,, bit awkward to say the least. I have put my bridge between blue and grey. Wrong then! Wondered where the supply would be from.
I had removed and replaced (after bridging) the 6 inch link between switch and loom, tomorrow I will re do the connections there linking the blue/green pin 4 to the blue pin3. I had already tested pin 4 for keyed supply last week. I admit to being caught out checking the new switch- realised the brake side with it extended would be NC when not fitted to bracket and pedal. Opposite being true for pins 1 and 3 being NO unless fitted also.

Many soldered joints and graduel shortening of loom pieces makes rectifying things harder. So, link 4 to 3 then off to the yellow stalk. Pin 1 left as is. I have actually linked off 1 to 3, so will 'simply' remove that one and put it on 4.

I also found that the stalk has 2 screw holes, only one of which (lower) can be used, I will have to cut the second mount boss off to enable flush fit. Also the Alfa screw is too small for the Fiat swich block mount hole. I found an easy way to route the cable from left to right, going down below heater controls and back of the map packet. I will post pics when done.
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Old 4 Weeks Ago   #45
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Re: X244 cruise control retrofit 2.8JTD 2005-factory parts?

No need to enlarge the slot, got the new one in Ok and connected up,,,, bit awkward to say the least. I have put my bridge between blue and grey. Wrong then! Wondered where the supply would be from.
I had removed and replaced (after bridging) the 6 inch link between switch and loom, tomorrow I will re do the connections there linking the blue/green pin 4 to the blue pin3. I had already tested pin 4 for keyed supply last week. I admit to being caught out checking the new switch- realised the brake side with it extended would be NC when not fitted to bracket and pedal. Opposite being true for pins 1 and 3 being NO unless fitted also.

Many soldered joints and graduel shortening of loom pieces makes rectifying things harder. So, link 4 to 3 then off to the yellow stalk. Pin 1 left as is. I have actually linked off 1 to 3, so will 'simply' remove that one and put it on 4.

I also found that the stalk has 2 screw holes, only one of which (lower) can be used, I will have to cut the second mount boss off to enable flush fit. Also the Alfa screw is too small for the Fiat swich block mount hole. I found an easy way to route the cable from left to right, going down below heater controls and back of the map packet. I will post pics when done.
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