General doblo particulate filter

[bobian81]

Hi, is this filter covered on the 3rd year warranty ?
its done 27k, and had all services on time, I new one is £920 !
so beware

 

[NottsCharger]

Maybe theres something else included in that £920 as I was quoted £235 by Fiat Customer Care which I thought was bloody expensive and yes should be covered by 3rd year warranty as had mine done on my 06 Stilo Multijet. So long as within 60k mile limit. Only thing they tried to argue over was whether wrong fuel had ever been put in, which would be down to user error.

Maybe that cost includes labour which I have just been advised by Fiat is down to individual garages discretion, therefore pays to shop around.

 

[bobian81]

thanks for that notts, I no longer have the dobbie, but I'm trying to help the new owner get it done under warranty, so its useful to know that is covered by 3rd year warranty.

 

[nec]

Hi, is this filter covered on the 3rd year warranty ?
its done 27k, and had all services on time, I new one is £920 !
so beware

Hello,

Can you say what is wrong with this filter to require replacement and how did the problem with it arise?

thanks

 

[bobian81]

the gentleman who bought the car from me, told me the engine m/ment light came on, so he took it to a fiat dealer for diagnostics on it, they then said it was the dpf, apparently they said it couldnt be regenerated ? not sure if this is right term.
I have since read on the net, this problem is widespread in late model diesels, vw, skoda, citroen, obviously fiat, and mazda.
One driver had a new mazda with 600 miles on it and it failed !
I fail to see how these filters are any better for the environment anyway, the carbon still ends up in the environment.
I have 2 other fiat mj's (pandas) and, I've checked thankfully they dont have one of these DPF's, unfortunatley we've just bought a late model skoda diesel mpv, and that does have a dpf on.

 

[Ulpian]

This factor, and the dual mass clutches, are what would seriously discourage me from buying another Diesel. This and the fact that petrols are getting more economical by the day.

The small eco Polos that are used by my local Council have been nothing but a pain. They clog up regularly and apparently the whole fleet is being got rid of.

It's a shame, because I like the way Diesels drive. The fact is, with these new filters the cars have to be driven hard, regularly, to keep them working. High speed runs and keeping the revs up around town are a must.

 

[NottsCharger]

The DPF or rather the lack of one was my particular reason for buying a 105bhp model Doblo. I have had bad experience with a late model Stilo with a dpf and also an Audi A4 which became a total disaster because of the dpf.

My 105 Doblo gives me better economy, more torque lower in rev range and still feels quite quick and no dpf to go wrong.

I always drive my cars hard, lots of revs, they get a damn good work out, but where there was a dpf fitted it still gave me problems.

I actually like diesels but as with any car where they have not been over engineered.

Dual Mass Flywheels can be an issue, but something to get used to as they are increasingly being introduced on petrol cars in the name of efficiency and the environment!

If anyones particularly worried about the dmf on their Doblo you can have it changed for a solid flywheel at time of clutch change, Fiat have an alternative part number. I had it done to my previous Doblo. You need to find a dealer with half a brain and perhaps threaten them with torture, but they will get there in the end.

 

[Ulpian]

If anyones particularly worried about the dmf on their Doblo you can have it changed for a solid flywheel at time of clutch change, Fiat have an alternative part number. I had it done to my previous Doblo. You need to find a dealer with half a brain and perhaps threaten them with torture, but they will get there in the end.

That's really interesting. Does the engine run more roughly?

 

[NottsCharger]

It makes not one blind bit of difference apart from no more clutch judder. I was very surprised by the outcome but after speaking with few engineers seems it is not a such a shock. I drove my old Doblo again last week when I replaced a brake light bulb for current owner and the sad thing is its clutch felt much better than my current less than year old Doblo!

 

[NumanR]

Its unlikely to be a blocked dpf filter, if the ecu is not capable of doing a foced regeneration the dealer needs to look for reasons why, there is a service news with approx 20 checks for this fault. I did one a few weeks ago and found a worn camshaft to be causing the fault, as the engine ecu couldnt carry out forced regeneration due to the valve timing on the faulty cam lobe effecting the engine balance and pressure signals.

 

[nec]

Its unlikely to be a blocked dpf filter, if the ecu is not capable of doing a foced regeneration the dealer needs to look for reasons why, there is a service news with approx 20 checks for this fault.

At last someone with the knowledge of what a DPF is all about and prepared to share the news

How about telling us what a forced regeneration is all about and if that would increase mpg from 50 average to 65 mpg for the first 200 miles or so. I think this is what they did on my first service resulting in the increase. Back to around 50 mpg now so I suppose the DPF is clogged up again.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

 

[bobian81]

The guy that bought my car has found out that DPF's ARE NOT COVERED on 3rd year warranty !
Even though it costs more than a clutch or gear box repair, or major engine rebuild, he's been quoted 1770 euros for the job in ireland !

The car I sold him was only just in to the 3rd year warranty, and had been serviced correctly by fiat, this stinks, a major part like this should not be failing on such a new car.

 

[Ulpian]

If that's true the nail really is in the coffin for Diesels. Sooner or later these things will go wrong, and a bill like that is frightening. Fiat should guarantee them at least seven years, mileage unlimited, otherwise where's the Diesel cost benefit?

 

[NumanR]

Tell him to contact Fiat customer services, as Fiat head office do not look after third year warranty, this is administered by Mastercare, so Fiat may be able to help providing the service news has been followed for diagnosis.


Forced regeration, ok, natural regeneration occurs when certain circumstances occur during driving, cruising with a hot engine etc etc. If those circumstances do not happen (short journeys, city driving etc etc) then the system cannot clean that dpf, so after monitoring the pressure in the dpf the warning light comes on and it goes to your dealer.

The dealer checks through everything and then carries out a forced regeneration using examiner. They stick the car outside or up on a ramp (you need as much cold air as possible around the dpf) and if inside fit a remote exhaust extractor (if you fit it directly to the exhaust it would melt). Secure an area around the car so no one gets too close, and start the regeration, the engine has to be hot, no pedals pressed and a load on the engine (lights etc). Examiner revs the engine to 2000 rpm and monitors the parameters to make sure its safe to do a regen. After this check, the engine is then revved to 3000 rpm and regen starts, it takes approx 15 minutes and sparks and soot are ejected from the exhaust. The injection period is extended and post injection occurs which super heats the exhaust and dpf, raising the temperature to between 600 and 800 degrees c, burning off the particulates that are trapped in the filter. After regen has occurred the vehicle is driven hard to flush out as much soot as possible, typically the pressure difference between before and after regen in the dpf goes from 150 mbars to 10 mbars at idle. This pressure difference increases as the revs are raised.

 

[T14086]

reminds me of a tie-breaker question

 

[dobload]

The DPF or rather the lack of one was my particular reason for buying a 105bhp model Doblo. I have had bad experience with a late model Stilo with a dpf and also an Audi A4 which became a total disaster because of the dpf.

Having recently bought a 105hp doblo dynamic (which i am very pleased with) I was pleased and somewhat relieved to read the above post.

Just wondered why there is no pdf on this model when it appears to be fitted on numerous other diesel powered cars?

 

[chrisb100]

The DPF or rather the lack of one was my particular reason for buying a 105bhp model Doblo. I have had bad experience with a late model Stilo with a dpf and also an Audi A4 which became a total disaster because of the dpf.

Having recently bought a 105hp doblo dynamic (which i am very pleased with) I was pleased and somewhat relieved to read the above post.

Just wondered why there is no pdf on this model when it appears to be fitted on numerous other diesel powered cars?

my 105bhp 06 cargo also does NOT have the DPF fitted.

The 105bhp 1.9 8v multijet in the Doblo has a fixed geometry turbo and therfore no DPF fitted ,the same for earlier 75bhp 1.3 16v multijet versions with fixed geometry turbos.

The later 85bhp 1.3 16v multijet and 120bhp 1.9 8v multijet versions have a variable geometry turbo ( VGT ) allowing for the increases in power both these engine units have a DPF fitted.

So if you are concerned buy the 105bhp 1.9 or earlier 75bhp 1.3 versions.

we wil all soon have no choice as the new 1,6 multijets and current 1.3's have DPFs so keep hold of your old dobbies

 

[nec]

Forced regeration, ok, natural regeneration occurs when certain circumstances occur during driving, cruising with a hot engine etc etc. If those circumstances do not happen (short journeys, city driving etc etc) then the system cannot clean that dpf, so after monitoring the pressure in the dpf the warning light comes on and it goes to your dealer.

The dealer checks through everything and then carries out a forced regeneration using examiner. They stick the car outside or up on a ramp (you need as much cold air as possible around the dpf) and if inside fit a remote exhaust extractor (if you fit it directly to the exhaust it would melt). Secure an area around the car so no one gets too close, and start the regeration, the engine has to be hot, no pedals pressed and a load on the engine (lights etc). Examiner revs the engine to 2000 rpm and monitors the parameters to make sure its safe to do a regen. After this check, the engine is then revved to 3000 rpm and regen starts, it takes approx 15 minutes and sparks and soot are ejected from the exhaust. The injection period is extended and post injection occurs which super heats the exhaust and dpf, raising the temperature to between 600 and 800 degrees c, burning off the particulates that are trapped in the filter. After regen has occurred the vehicle is driven hard to flush out as much soot as possible, typically the pressure difference between before and after regen in the dpf goes from 150 mbars to 10 mbars at idle. This pressure difference increases as the revs are raised.

Thanks for the above - sounds an awful lot to a dpf and the heat on regeneration is awesome

Is there a way of telling when the engine is regenerating naturally - I would hate to stop and step in line of the exhaust at the relevant time !!!

 

[dobload]

The 105bhp 1.9 8v multijet in the Doblo has a fixed geometry turbo and therfore no DPF fitted ,the same for earlier 75bhp 1.3 16v multijet versions with fixed geometry turbos.


Chris, does this mean that the 105bhp has a bog standard exhaust system which would be (relatively) cheap and easy to replace compared to a DPF?

 

[chrisb100]

Yes apart from the cat its billy basic!