I follow 'Honest Johns' pages in the Saturday telegraph, where he has been a big fan of diesel cars. However he is now warning folks away from diesels for a couple of reasons, but particularly because of problems with 'dual mass flywheels' and associated clutch failures.

I have no idea what these terms mean but was wondering if my Dobbie (2007 1.9) has one? I hope not!

I'm hoping my trusty Dobbie will have a nice old fashioned simple clutch (like it's leaf springs!) and won't suffer from these woes.

Any help appreciated.

PETER

Broadpete said:

I follow 'Honest Johns' pages in the Saturday telegraph, where he has been a big fan of diesel cars. However he is now warning folks away from diesels for a couple of reasons, but particularly because of problems with 'dual mass flywheels' and associated clutch failures.

I have no idea what these terms mean but was wondering if my Dobbie (2007 1.9) has one? I hope not!

I'm hoping my trusty Dobbie will have a nice old fashioned simple clutch (like it's leaf springs!) and won't suffer from these woes.

Any help appreciated.

PETER

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yours should have one! sorry! as my 2005 1.9 jtd had its replaced at a woeful 35k miles very disapointing and very expensive!!!!

Mine's an '03, so I'm worried too.
Erm, roughly how expensive?

I need another bit of exhaust too, and a cambelt soon, and a new rear wiper motor....I've already had a front wiper motor and a new auxiliary drive belt (under guarantee this one) so this car of mine is heading towards expensive to run, and I've done fewer than 50,000 miles

Usually the DMF doesn't cause a clutch failure, but replacing the clutch without the flywheel is a no-no...

A DMF is basically a flywheel made of 3 parts. An inner disc which bolts to the crank; a outer ring which has the teeth for the starter and the friction surface for the clutch plate; and a rubber filler which joins the two taking out small vibrations from standard clutch operation.

How expencive? About £400-£450 for the flywheel making a + labour clutch change around £800-£1300 depending on how difficult the job is. 1.9JTD should be closer to £800, some of us ex 2.4JTD owners paid the bigger number!

yep i had to have a new clutch and they found the flywheel totally shot so had to be done too just the parts came to nearly 700 quid plus the dreaded labour! but it was totally different to drive after much smoother!, guess thats the joys of modern motoring!!

I'm beginning to wish I hadn't asked (although thanks for the helpful replies). I guess I'll be extra gentle on those hill starts.
Sorry to have depressed fellow owners

Mrs_G recently had her 2nd new clutch - at about 305,000 miles. The garage examined the flywheel and said it was still ok - they had got a new one in just in case. So at 314,000 miles she is still on the original flywheel.

Are these huge differences due to a change of design in the engine/transmission, or just that the vehicles have very different lives? (Motorway vs Town).

Pete, if yours is the 120bhp model it should have a different and, according to other members, stronger clutch.
I presume the DMF is different too.

Broadpete said:

Are these huge differences due to a change of design in the engine/transmission, or just that the vehicles have very different lives? (Motorway vs Town).

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i couldnt tell you as i had to have mine changed fairly soon after buying so what the previous owners did to it? they may have thrashed the living daylights out of it but i wud still expect it to last longer than 35k i wud say poor quality parts myself until im proved wrong!

DMF are better designed/made than in the mondeo diesel days of almost continious failure.

Put it into perspective, how many diesels on the road in world,you will expect a small pecentage of failure due to some reason or other, unfortunally many are due to driver error.

Thought I would add my experience.

Clutch went on my Doblo 1.9 JTD ELX (03) at 50,000 miles not too bad but probably would have lasted longer except for previous owner who used it to haul stuff from cash and carry. I was told I needed a new DMF but because it was out of warranty I took to a clutch specialist who reconditioned the DMF and fitted a new clutch for £335 total. Sold Doblo two years ago to a mate and he is now upto 90k, clutch and DMF still going fine even with a 140 bhp remap!

NottsCharger said:

Thought I would add my experience.

Clutch went on my Doblo 1.9 JTD ELX (03) at 50,000 miles not too bad but probably would have lasted longer except for previous owner who used it to haul stuff from cash and carry. I was told I needed a new DMF but because it was out of warranty I took to a clutch specialist who reconditioned the DMF and fitted a new clutch for £335 total. Sold Doblo two years ago to a mate and he is now upto 90k, clutch and DMF still going fine even with a 140 bhp remap!

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sounds very good!!!

i wud be very interested if you could tell me for future reference who recon'd the dmf and did ur clutch very good price that!

many thanks

Was called the the Clutch Centre, perhaps unsuprisingly, on Arnold Lane, Basford, Nottingham. If I can find the telephone number I'll post it up.

Interestingly it was the Fiat dealer JCS (Kegworth) who directed me there. If the Doblo had been under warranty they would have done the job themselves and fitted a new DMF or replacement solid flywheel as cheaper alternative.

DMF is designed to remove engine/transmission vibration making modern diesels smoother than old type diesels but you don't have to have one, standard solid flywheel was on alternative parts list for my 03 JTD!

Replacement is big part so you can understand cost of new one but is easily remanufactured, so you pays your money and takes your choice.

1.9jtd here

mine went out at abt 80000 km

had a new clutch replace @ 33000km after i feedback to the dealer that the clutch was hard.


seems like dualmassflywheel failure are pretty common throught the jtd platform

https://www.fiatforum.com/multipla/107488-acceleration-judder.html

Worrying.

I'm looking to replace my car now that I have seen this thread.

I have to wait a year, so I hope it'll hold, but then I want a small economical petrol something - maybe a 500?

Has the 1.3 MJ engine got a duel mass flywheel? and is it turbow charged?
Thanks
Jon

it has a turbo with intercooler and the clutch arrangement seems to be the same as for the larger engines
check out italiaspeed for full spec

Perhaps for once I am better off with my petrol Doblo. Certainly those who have had to pay for a new DMF will have wiped out much or all of the fuel economy savings from having the diesel version.