Had it about 3 years, have too many cars and it's got to go. I own a specialist garage and so when I did the brakes I went to and both made them very nice and upgraded them with premium discs and uprated Predator pads - the stopping including cold bite is absolutely fantastic, coming down from 80-100mph to roundabouts on dual carriageways I often stop before I intended to without trying and have to let off the brake to roll to where I wanted to stop. It's also had a load of servicing, the swirl flaps are off, EGR is off and it's remapped to around 240hp. The troublesome DPF has been removed and replaced with straight pipe, no more DPF and EGR faults on this baby. Everything works, no lights on the dash, got a towbar, body nearly perfect but a few small scratched/imperfections.

Oh yes the wheels.... just under £1000 worth of custom power coated black chrome wheels with a new set of RainSport tyres when I did them that have only done about 5,000 miles - the best tyres in the wet money can buy. Fantastic grip. I mainly changed from 18's to 17's to improve the ride over pot holes, it's drives fantastic on them.

I can't decide if to fit my spare manifold with swirl flaps removed and blanked off and do the cambelt and water pump before I sell it, or sell it with a spare manifold and a full cambelt kit in the boot.

Any ideas what it's worth? There literally about 34 in the country and very few in this colour and none will have these brakes/wheels/dpf off/etc. Miliage is very low about 55k and it's got a fair bit of history, two keys etc, comes serviced and with long or full mot.

Thoughts appreciated. My other car is nearly ready for an mot and I can't afford to keep both. Till then it's still my daily driver

Greg.

Greg123 said:

<SNIP>
the swirl flaps are off, EGR is off and it's remapped to around 240hp. The troublesome DPF has been removed and replaced with straight pipe, no more DPF and EGR faults on this baby. Everything works, no lights on the dash, got a towbar, body nearly perfect but a few small scratched/imperfections.

<SNIP>

Any ideas what it's worth? There literally about 34 in the country and very few in this colour and none will have these brakes/wheels/dpf off/etc. Miliage is very low about 55k and it's got a fair bit of history, two keys etc, comes serviced and with long or full mot.

Thoughts appreciated. My other car is nearly ready for an mot and I can't afford to keep both. Till then it's still my daily driver

Greg.

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Well, as it's illegal to use on the road due to deletion of emissions control equipment (using a straight pipe for the DPF deletion means it will fail any properly conducted MOT) I'd say it's not worth a lot.


Robert G8RPI.

never seen these kind of disc brakes

this is a 2006 croma? timing belt last changed? how many times it was crashed? tires dot?

g8rpi said:

Well, as it's illegal to use on the road due to deletion of emissions control equipment (using a straight pipe for the DPF deletion means it will fail any properly conducted MOT) I'd say it's not worth a lot.


Robert G8RPI.

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It's not an issue, we (my garage) do loads and loads. Generally we cut the DPF open, remove the filter and weld it back up so it passes a visual inspection (there is no other check on the MOT and most stations I know aren't even bothered about that so long as the exhaust isn't leaking and it passes the mot smoke test which they all will) however I do still have my DPF so it can be retro fitted back if there was the need. The egr and such is not an issue and not testable in any way, these troublesome mpg sapping devices are bodges by the mfr to get the vehicle through type approval and largely irrelevant to any sort of road worthyness or mot. We have SO many vehicles in with issues with them but this car will never have an issue with them again. My next car has had the same treatment and gains excellent mpg as a side effect.

You should have they are standard 2.4 brakes, just really nicely built up with decent discs and Black Diamond Predator pads which have an excellent coefficient f friction.

Yes I think it's a 2006 m/y.

Never been crashed or painted that I know of and it looks perfectly original everywhere! I paid good money at a dealer to get a good example I was looking 2 years to get one in that colour with low miles.

The tyres DOT? You mean approved? Yes! They are from the Continental stable of brands, German Uniroyal, premium sports tyre with all ratings and one of the best tyres you can buy. Not cheap but the grip is fantastic particularly in the wet where it counts.

flisko said:

never seen these kind of disc brakes

this is a 2006 croma? timing belt last changed? how many times it was crashed? tires dot?

Click to expand...

Forgot to answer about cambelt, the new one is in the boot lol

Greg123 said:

It's not an issue, we (my garage) do loads and loads. Generally we cut the DPF open, remove the filter and weld it back up so it passes a visual inspection (there is no other check on the MOT and most stations I know aren't even bothered about that so long as the exhaust isn't leaking and it passes the mot smoke test which they all will) however I do still have my DPF so it can be retro fitted back if there was the need. The egr and such is not an issue and not testable in any way, these troublesome mpg sapping devices are bodges by the mfr to get the vehicle through type approval and largely irrelevant to any sort of road worthyness or mot. We have SO many vehicles in with issues with them but this car will never have an issue with them again. My next car has had the same treatment and gains excellent mpg as a side effect.

Click to expand...

It never ceases to amaze me that people will post details of illegal activity on a public forum. You do know that it's illegal to remove emissions control components from road cars? I guess you do as you disguise the removal of DPFs by welding the case back up.

Robert G8RPI.

Post it on a forum? Try I send HMRC revenue from the business I run carrying out and advertising DPF and EGR removal, listed like thousands of others on Google for the service, mot'd at numerous garages without problem and was describing the procedure to some of Notts police interested in having his done the other day. You are entitled to your opinion of course. These devices are a nightmare and there is currently no drive to enforce and test their operation post the type approval with the EU. Similarly you can argue that changing wheels and remapping the ECU software is similarly illegal, and indeed modifying the exhaust by welding on a tailpipe trim which wasn't type approved for that car originally...... I used to run on biodiesel on my previous Peugeot which my engine wasn't tested or certified for either! So long as the vehicle is safe, has an mot there is little likelihood of a problem, I have done hundreds of them.

But I don't want to start a flame war, I respect you wanting to keep your car totally stock that's your privilege. You think my car is worth little/nothing, thanks for your opinion, I'd be interested to hear a few other people's estimates too.

g8rpi said:

It never ceases to amaze me that people will post details of illegal activity on a public forum. You do know that it's illegal to remove emissions control components from road cars? I guess you do as you disguise the removal of DPFs by welding the case back up.

Robert G8RPI.

Click to expand...

Hi,
Too few on the market to estblish a price accurately. If somone wants a 2.4 you may get a premium price but for a quick sale the bigger engine will make it harder to sell. People look at running costs these days and the 2.4 is higher in all areas. I think you would be lucky to get more than £1500 as a private sale.
B.T.W changing wheels, brakes, tailpipes etc does not invalidate the type approval. You have to make major modifications to need an SVA. I don't like DPFs, EGRs etc and am not too bothered about originality, but I like to stay legal.

Robert G8RPI.

g8rpi said:

Hi,
Too few on the market to estblish a price accurately. If somone wants a 2.4 you may get a premium price but for a quick sale the bigger engine will make it harder to sell. People look at running costs these days and the 2.4 is higher in all areas. I think you would be lucky to get more than £1500 as a private sale.
B.T.W changing wheels, brakes, tailpipes etc does not invalidate the type approval. You have to make major modifications to need an SVA. I don't like DPFs, EGRs etc and am not too bothered about originality, but I like to stay legal.

Robert G8RPI.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the opinion, appreciated. I can talk at length about the need for B.S. stamping on exhausts etc vs what fails mots, but that's for another day I rekon! £1500 eeek I paid about 4k I think a couple years ago. We'll see, I guess the good thing is I don't have to get rid of it mega fast i'm still daily driving so when ready I can write it up in the for sale section and see what happens as you say over a month or so.

Cheers again, Greg.

1500?
i would sell it for 3k min

varesecrazy said:

dave

Click to expand...

ive already got a new car, 2.4 i think is too big for me be a pain to change belt in a small gap

flisko said:

1500?
i would sell it for 3k min

Click to expand...

Thanks for the opinion, I was hoping something like that was fair as I paid more and there are only 34 of them in the UK!

If i was selling my 2.4(which im not) i.d be asking around 3k.The same spec as yours but with an upgraded Garrett turbocharger fitted to it.550nm torque with the graph to prove it.Bodyworks probably not as clean as yours,rear bumber wonts painting as scratched around the top.Just turned 80k.What are you replacing it with if you dont mind me asking.

Glass's basic says £1510 to £1730 for a private sale. Trade, which gives the buyer a lot more protection is £2350 to £2680.
Trade-in is a measly £660 to £940.
The Croma is a great car but virtually no one knows what it is. The extra £110 a year in tax, 11MPG worse fuel consumption and higher insurance for the 2.4 20V over the 1.9 16V manual was a big negative for me when I was looking for a Croma . There is not even an improvement in perfomance (apart from 3MPH on the top speed). Unless you need an automtic and want the extra performance the 2.4 has little to recommend it over the 1.9 16V.

Robert G8RPI.

My concerns with mods is on two grounds

1) my Croma 2005 (that I used to have) was homologated to Euro 4. Fiat chose to fit a DPF for Euro 5. As a purchaser of a Euro 4 vehicle which will pass MOT standards with or without DPF I was annoyed by the so called red tape and imposed unreliability of Euro 5 crap on a homologated Euro 4 car. (Actually could a Euro 3 / Euro 4 point but that is partially irrelevant for this post)

2) I have a Euro 4 car (with DPF) and choose to remove the Euro 5 DPF. Yes she will pass all the MOT and Euro 4 criteria (let's ignore games manufacturer are proven to be playing) HOWEVER removal of the DPF is a vehicle modification for insurance purposes. I took this all up with my and other insurers. It is a mod and if not disclosed and discovered after an accident etc. THEN YOU ARE UNISURED. You will be liable for ALL costs etc. etc. Not a risk worth taking as it would cripple you and your family for just about the rest of your life in cases of paying for the maintenance and care of someone seriously injured in an RTA. etc.

I in part blame both the motor industry and the insurance industry for not actually getting their acts/vehicle credentials and specifications properly aligned. Needless to say they will take the easy path and any mod is their "get out clause at YOUR expense" even though a mod does not increase performance, does not affect the homologated level/rating BUT DOES make your vehicle more reliable etc.

Any vehicle mods ARE *FIRE* and playing with fire can get you burnt, possibly seriously burnt.

My advice / opinion check with your insurance company first. Many are tolerant AND JUST WANT TO KNOW. Others, as in my case with my then insurer, said my insurance would be null and void if I removed the DPF and/or EGR valve and they had no option/will to cover me for a higher premium.

I've made (in the past possibly when times were more lenient) loads of mod to cars and got agreement from the insurance company. This included even such trivial things as yellow taping the battery negative lead, ignition off direction lables, tape on headlamps etc. when I did motor sport. Then (80s/90s) just a trivial vehicle mod (like a safety label, fitting of seat belt mounting "eye" bolts to take a full safety harness, etc. was deemed to be a notifiable modification that would affect the vehicle insurance.

Given todays insurance culture and rising costs then they will use any excuse to nullify an insurance policy so you better be damn sure you notify/ask your insurer before tinkering.

you can ask 3k all day long but its a buyers market when it comes to cromas, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fiat-crom...D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557 and it had the more desireable 1.9 16v

dave said:

you can ask 3k all day long but its a buyers market when it comes to cromas, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fiat-croma-prestigio-in-excellent-condition-/231907447393?hash=item35fec2d261%3Ag%3AdMAAAOSwWTRW1b8p&nma=true&si=MOMxQzypg7wAc7bkuIJ4XPtEdaE%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557 and it had the more desireable 1.9 16v

Click to expand...

to cheap

flisko said:

to cheap

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Not too cheap according to the market, there were no bids. The average price for the last 9 Cromas sold on eabay was less than £640. The most expensive was £1495 for a 2007 1.9 with 77,000 miles.

I wasn't going to mention the insurance angle of deletions, but it's a catch 22, you can't declare a modification that makes the car illegal to the insurance and if you don't you are uninsured.

Robert G8RPI.