Has anybody actually achieved or looked into an increase in power for our B engine without going down the turbo route?
For instance has anyone invested in a superchip and proper remapping of the ECU rather than those cheap and nasty thing advertised on ebay for a couple of quid?
What about high-lift cams? Although the variator would probably preclude that.?
Maybe a different cylinder head without the variators head moulding?
Whilst on the subject, why have some of you decided that the engine needed an oil cooler?

Almost one third of the heat generated by the engine must be removed by the vehicle's two cooling systems. That's correct, your engine has two cooling systems. (1) The top of the engine: the area around each cylinder in the engine block, the combustion chamber areas in the cylinder heads and the intake manifold, dispel heat through the engine's radiator coolant system. (2) The rest of the engine: the crankshaft, bearings, camshaft, lifters, connecting rods and pistons are only cooled by engine oil.


The ideal operating range for engine oil is 180°F through 200°F. While operating within this range, the oil works as a lubricant, coolant, and cleansing agent in the engine. Modern engines generally run with radiator coolant temperatures between 200°F and 220°F with oil temperature ranges between 20°F and 75°F HOTTER. In other words, when the engine is performing flawlessly, the engine oil is already overheating! Oil that exceeds 220°F rapidly loses its ability to lubricate and cool causing accerlerated fatigue and premature component failure.

Engine Oil Coolers can reduce the oil temperature to between 180°F to 200°F and keep it there. Benefits are:


Longer engine life
Reduced heat load on engine and radiator
Increased oil system capacity
Lower under-hood temperatures and more!
If you spend any time in stop-and-go traffic, do any kind of towing, drive in a hot climate, or frequently use your air conditioning, your engine needs a Engine Oil Cooler!

I beg to differ slightly!!
I understand your rationale but with today's modern oil and the fact that Fiat designed the engine without an oil cooler for everyday use..........but an oil cooler would come into its own if you were throwing it around a race track competitively.(I can feel an argument coming on)

Regards the original question, I've long been tempted to get a decent normally aspirated engine built. I'm almost waiting for a major engine problem to give me the required excuse!

I don't think the barchetta will suit the power delivery of a turbo engine and a lot more thought has to go in to extracting power in a 'conventional' way.

It is important to note that, even though the dash gauge may register only a 200 deg. F or so water/coolant temperature, the temperature of the sump and of all the assorted bearing surfaces significantly exceed the water temperature, and often surpass 500 deg. F on the piston ring and cylinder wall areas. These high-temperature surfaces serve to rapidly decompose oil and additives, as well as contribute to their shorter service life, while the synthetic is largely unaffected its not impervious.

It is always beneficial to keep the engine oil well inside its working temp.

Fiat did not fit one to the Barchetta because of many reasons, cost being just one of them. Does every B owner need an oil cooler? NO. Does someone who is looking to get more power out of the engine and who will utilize the increase in BHP, Yes.

It’s all part of the bigger picture when tuning you car. You don’t just fit a big turbo, you fit better brakes, forged pistons, oil cooler, better suspension, and so on.

I was not arguing against a cooler Doc, I'm sure I would fit one if I increase the power in the future!
Back to the easiest BHP increase and the chip/ECU avenue, anybody done it?

I havent done it myself, but at he garage I take the B for servicing they have fixed up some Punto HGTz with the following mods.
1) Special cool air induction
2) Rear Exaust and exaust gasket in the front
3) New Autronic ECU
Thats it!

The result is 180BHP on the dyno and reliability is AAA.
Total cost is 3000 euros and as claimed it is very do-able on the B as well.

Its up to you!!!

Have a look at this site, the guy has posted on here a few times. Website under construction it seems.

Also there is a guy who posts here sometimes with a Punto HGT remapped, exhaust and induction kit with 160+ BHP.

Lastly, a lot of induction kits come with a flexi pipe, bin it! The ripples in the pipe slows the cold air into your engine, not by much i grant you but we're only talking a few BHP increase anyway, but you cant afford to lose any cos of a bit of cheap pipe. You need a pipe thats as straight as practicality and space allows and that wont heat the air up, the colder the better. Get a hard pipe made up either SS or silicone.

Oops forgot to put the link in :bang:

http://www.gsr-uk.co.uk/

Might be me your reffering to, its 163.5bhp from a gsr induction kit and full supersprint exhaust, then remapped by a company called chippeduk. I don't see how you'd get 180bhp without performance cams? The standard cams are whats restricting me at the moment, mine was 'just' starting to detonate at 167bhp.

I've ordered a set of C&B cams so i'll post back once there in and its been mapped again.

DanGil said:

Might be me your reffering to, its 163.5bhp from a gsr induction kit and full supersprint exhaust, then remapped by a company called chippeduk. I don't see how you'd get 180bhp without performance cams?.....
.....there in and its been mapped again.

Click to expand...

Its because you simply remap your existing ECU which still has the standard capabilities but with different settings. To get the 180bhp you need to CHANGE the whole ECU unit and install an AUTronic one which is self programmable and has way more functions and much faster real time adjustment capabilities. This unit alone costs 2000 euros though. Even if you change your cams, believe me you will just notice a more live responce, but you will lose torque and definatelly reliability. Had a friend that installed NOVITEC cams on this 156 and he is still crying..

All your doing is advancing the timing untill you can't advance it anymore, on this engine it starts to detonate around 167bhp when using standard cams, fact.

I'm sure C&B know there stuff and I will post the results when completed.

There was a hgt running in excess of 200bhp using the standard hitachi unit. The only reason you lot use aftermarket management is because you can't remap your existing ecu.

sjladopoulos said:

Its because you simply remap your existing ECU which still has the standard capabilities but with different settings. To get the 180bhp you need to CHANGE the whole ECU unit and install an AUTronic one which is self programmable and has way more functions and much faster real time adjustment capabilities. This unit alone costs 2000 euros though. Even if you change your cams, believe me you will just notice a more live responce, but you will lose torque and definatelly reliability. Had a friend that installed NOVITEC cams on this 156 and he is still crying..

Click to expand...

You don't need to change the ECU to get more than 180bhp out of the 1747cc engine. It is just a matter of knowing how to do it, which seems to be only known by a few people. we have done it.

The mentioned much faster real time adjustments are only of real benefit for race use and are a disadvantage for fast road use on a daily basis.

Novitech is a competitor of us, but that doesn't mean that they wouldn't know what they are doing. Novitech has got much more history than many other Italian tuners. If you have problems with their cams then the person who installed them needs to learn a bit more about it.

If the rolling road shows a peak power of 180bhp or more without uprated cams then the reading is hopelessly overrated.

DanGil said:

Might be me your reffering to, its 163.5bhp from a gsr induction kit and full supersprint exhaust, then remapped by a company called chippeduk. I don't see how you'd get 180bhp without performance cams? The standard cams are whats restricting me at the moment, mine was 'just' starting to detonate at 167bhp.

I've ordered a set of C&B cams so i'll post back once there in and its been mapped again.

Click to expand...

Like the B was your HGT 130bhpp prior to mods? How much of the increase was due to the induction kit, the exhaust and ECU remap?

What was the cost of each mod?

Liking the sound of this, now we don't have to include 2000 Euros for a replacement ECU!


DJ OD

Dear Oldschool and DanGil,
I m not much of a mechanical Guru so I cannot argue with you on much detail. It seems that you know these stuff better, so appologies if I sounded like a prick.
All I know is what my mechanic claimes, and since he's got the reputation I tend to believe him and transfer his words to you through this forum. Ofcourse he also wants to make the $$$ so some of the things he says is bullcrap.
I m not to question your knowledge or capabilities. Sorry.

I don't know a lot either tbh mate, all I know is my car made 167bhp and was just starting to detonate so the cams need changing to get anymore out of it.

DanGil what does it sound like when you start to get detonation ?

to detonate means blow up dont to it to your Bee be sensible with the power you can put on the road

docorangepeel said:

DanGil what does it sound like when you start to get detonation ?

Click to expand...

Its hard to explain, but it dose'nt sound healthy lol. It was only slight which is why the bloke mapping it only needed to knock it back a bit.