Part time TA driver when OH is not using it but A500 wannnaaabee.
Quick question guys, is there a new A500 coming out with upped performance and lower CO2 ?

I'll let loveshandbags answer that one as he seems to be a mine of information, lol. The only thing new that I know for definite is that you can now order a 500c with the manual gearbox with a saving of approx £1000.

Talk of an auto version of the tin top still not confirmed but if it was a DDCT version as opposed to putting the 500c Competizione (Selespeed?) box then that would get me seriously considering a change. Better still if the MultiAir was incorporated as that would help boost power and lower the emissions .

arorat said:

Part time TA driver when OH is not using it but A500 wannnaaabee.
Quick question guys, is there a new A500 coming out with upped performance and lower CO2 ?
Is this model worth waiting for ?
If I wanted to buy now – what would I buy ?

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At some stage a new A500 multiair will appear but I reckon it will not be until 2013. The US will get it first and their dates have been pushed from early 2012 to mid 2012. I cannot see Europe getting the car before the US. I reckon the Abarth MA engine will only be put into ‘all new US 500’. At the moment the A500 works and it’s selling for £2K more compared with a ‘Twin Air plus’ with ESP.

The Abarth multiair is out in Europe in the Abarth Punto Evo (2011). This ‘new’ engine is the standard block with a multiair head. Emissions are down from 157grs/km to 142grs/km. New engine has an extra 10bhp, more torque and is more economical. It rebutted to be 20% more efficient compared with 10% in the NA (naturally aspirated) multiair form. I reckon when they bring out MA into the A500 it will probably include S/S and be around 135grs/km (manual).

I get the impression that this new MA engine does NOT give the pops or the back fires that make the less environmentally friendly engine the character that it currently has. The current A500 at 1035kgs has power to weight ratio of 130bhp to the ton. The new one will be heavier (100kgs?) so any increase in ‘power’ wouldn’t be noticed.

At the moment the current A500 is 155grs/km but this engine is a Euro 5 unlike the majority of the standard 1.4s being Euro 4. This may explain why a lot of 'normal' 1.4 owners who migrated to the A500 found little difference in overall mpg.

The MTA gearbox in the A500c has had mixed reviews but the one in the Ferrari 500 tintop seems to be a ‘better’ gearbox and might end up in the ‘new’ 500 if they cannot organise a DSG type as in the VW & Audi A1 http://blip.tv/the-next-gear (as mentioned by Grimwau - DCT). The manual gearbox currently in the A500 despite being a bit agriculture (Alfa 147) is tougher than the 6 speed gearbox in the ‘normal’ 1.4. There is a M32 6 speed gearbox in the Abarth Assetto Corse but to get it to fit they might have had to lose the Air con.
http://www.supercars.net/cars/4162.html

There are a few ‘Celebrity Challenge 2010’ models being picked up for around £14K on autotrader – high spec (Esseesse, Monza, Sabelts,) – but they may not be very ‘client friendly’. This car wiill still carry a few spanners for fixing sinks, etc.

If you are asking – is the new US A500 MA worth waiting for – IMHO I would say NO. You could get a very nice ‘basic’ A500 2010 for around £10.5K (two thirds of a new one) – young enough to be within FIAT warranty cover (& time enough to establish a dealer warranty ). It would also be better value compared to a ’09. I would look for A500 that has had regular oil changes (it should be at minimum 9K as opposed to the initially specified 12K)

Arorat - and you thought it was a quick question.

loveshandbags, thanks for the detailed reply, I thought it would be one/two liner but I see the variables. It concerns me that cars are ruined during their lifecycles by making changes for the sake of advancement, DSG although good in principle is very expensive to repair when things go wrong, that was one of the issues noted in Mini Forum. I like the car to be a bit raw like the old 205GTIs, I suspect A500 will follow the mini lead and overcomplicate matters.

Anyway, its a desire to have A500 and sometimes its better to want (anticipate) then to have and then long for the next thing.

arorat said:

loveshandbags, thanks for the detailed reply, I thought it would be one/two liner but I see the variables. It concerns me that cars are ruined during their lifecycles by making changes for the sake of advancement, DSG although good in principle is very expensive to repair when things go wrong, that was one of the issues noted in Mini Forum. I like the car to be a bit raw like the old 205GTIs, I suspect A500 will follow the mini lead and overcomplicate matters.

Anyway, its a desire to have A500 and sometimes its better to want (anticipate) then to have and then long for the next thing.

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Thank you for the feedback arorat. 'Paddy Power' bookmaker is apparently doing a striving business now and from dabbling on the US sites I get the impression that a lot of information 'bouncing' around is pure projector. I wouldn’t be putting money on the table for DSG and recently I heard that Multi-air could make an European appearance at the end of 2012 (still wouldn’t put a bet on that). The expectations from the US site of getting 175bhp on their release of the A500 (they're only expecting one model) - also surprised me.
If you look at the cancellation of the Trofeo Abarth 2011 championship by Abarth I reckon the A500 will be left as it is. Market demands from the US could rekindle the interest from Fiat in Abarth and bring forward the release date for the MA engine being released in the 'new' 500 setup.
http://www.thecheckeredflag.co.uk/2011/04/abarth-cancel-2011-gb-series/
Re 'its a desire to have A500 and sometimes its better to want (anticipate) then to have and then long for the next thing' I didn't know you were such a deep thinker ! That might be one for the forest in Estonia with some of the local brew.

Fiat are a complete bunch of ****tards. If they released the Abarth with a DDCT box and the multiair engine mpw as well as making the Koni FSD's standard fit then they could really stand a chance of doing well in tests when it comes to outright speed and handling. But instead they'll release the goodies in a year or 3 and the competition will be miles ahead......

306maxi said:

Fiat are a complete bunch of ****tards. If they released the Abarth with a DDCT box and the multiair engine mpw as well as making the Koni FSD's standard fit then they could really stand a chance of doing well in tests when it comes to outright speed and handling. But instead they'll release the goodies in a year or 3 and the competition will be miles ahead......

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Valid argument but in a selfish way as I don't have an a500 yet, a normal clutch would be simpler to maintain and still give that raw feel. I don't understand the issues with shocks so am a silent witness to all your discussions.

arorat said:

Valid argument but in a selfish way as I don't have an a500 yet, a normal clutch would be simpler to maintain and still give that raw feel. I don't understand the issues with shocks so am a silent witness to all your discussions.

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You've probably seen lillahboo's thread but all you need to know in relation to suspension on the A500 is to change the standard shocks to Koni FSD. Ebay has a set for £545. After my test drive in the esseesse and the suspension travel 'issue' I would leave the standard springs in the A500 although the majority would say it's better with the stiffer springs. The OH likes a 'quick' spin in the car but not if she's been 'jarred'.
The other benefit of using the FSD is that they don't impact the warranty on the A500. Anything else might prove expensive if something went wrong.

A500 = over springed and under damped.
A500 + Koni FSD =

loveshandbags said:

A500 = over springed and under damped.
A500 + Koni FSD =

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just on the terminology, by over springed you mean the springs are tight and dampers are too squiggy ? if that is right I am just trying to imagine how that would feel on the road, i guess the springs would do all the work and give sharp bounce on rough ?

Sorry if i got this the other way round, shows my knowledge !!

squiggy, is that a technical term?

grimwau said:

squiggy, is that a technical term?

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its better applied to the OH note my first --> *FRA*