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Old 24-06-2019   #1
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Servicing - General Review on car.

Hello again 500L users,

I haven't been on here for a while. Another year later on this forum and our 500L is still driving without any issues and it is turning 4 years old, wow. It doesn't look like we've owned the fiat for that long!

We have the 1.3 Multijet Diesel Euro 5 Design, which is not to be confused with any other engine from Fiat's 500L range.

I have a couple of things to say to prevent any issues with servicing. Take note with the different air filter designs.

You can use the keyeper online catalogues with your VIN to determine which model air filter you require. Do not use online part checkers, they will provide incorrect parts as seen by Bosch Automotive Catalogue.

Engine Oil

Firstly, the oil, I have used Castrol Magnatec C2 (very cheap coming at 23 for 4L at Asda), Selenia WR PE and now Liqui Moly 4300 (a tad bit more dear but so far a week since my service - it seems to be working very good, time will tell just like castrol). Liqui Moly 4300 is a C2 variant whereas 4200 is a C3/C2 variant. I'd rather go for an ACEA C2 rating than a C3 oil which meets C2 specs. Though the C2 spec is just the increased fuel economy. I can tell that this service including Liqui Moly and new filters, fuel economy has been raised as to using Castrol with new filters last year.

I can see that Castrol has now removed the meeting Fiat 9.55535-S1 specification as of 08 Mar 2019. This made me quite weary as I have used Castrol on my last oil change in 2018, at the start, there was honestly no difference between my previous Selenia engine oil than during the harsher winters, it became apparent that the engine noise increased significantly.

You can use any of these oils which meet Fiat specifications or you can just go and source this malarkey called Selenia.
Quote Originally Posted by Bromodo View Post
What you guys forget is that the Euro5 (read: DPF) oils are Mid-SAPS, with less sulfated ash, phosphorus and sulfur to keep the DPF clean.

Without DFP, Fiat's recommended oil is Selenia WR, which is a "normal", semi-synthetic 5W-40 (SAE 5W-40, ACEA B3/B4, API CF, FIAT 9.55535-N2).

With DFP, it's Selenia WR Pure Energy, which is a fully synthetic, mid-SAPS 5W-30 (SAE 5W-30, ACEA C2, FIAT 9.55535-S1). In the newer Bravo manuals, this is the specification for all Diesel engines, DPF or not.

For the newest Euro 6 Bravos, it's Selenia WR Forward, which is a 0W-30 (SAE 0W-30, ACEA C2, FIAT 9.55535-DS1). It says that it can also be used with Euro5 engines, however there is literally no third-party oil that even mentions the specification, yet.

It's best to go by the Fiat specification numbers which are listed on most oils, not the weight. eni i-Sint FE and Motul Specific S1 are for example actually approved as FIAT 9.55535-S1 (as opposed to "Meets/exceeds specification of" which is printed on everything anyways), and as it's the only specification besides API and ACEA on both oils, they're likely developed specifically for Fiat Multijet engines.

As far as the "manufacturer says it also meets the specifications" fraction goes:
- Aral HighTronic J
- Castrol Magnatec (Professional) 5W-30 C2
- Fuchs TITAN GT1 PRO C-2
- Liqui Moly Top Tec 4200 and 4300
- Meguin Compatible and Fuel Economy 5W-30
- Motul 8100 Eco-clean 5W-30
- Shell Helix Extra
- Total Quartz Ineo ECS
- Valvoline Synpower ENV C2

It also states that you should not mix C2 oils with non-C2 oils.


Rant about air filter quality

I had used a Mann oil and air filter (supposedly one of the best). The oil filter seemed to be in good shape for it being used. The air filter was totally blacked out after a year usage in town, under the same driving conditions the original Fiat OEM filter was much more cleaner on the 2018 air filter change.

The filtration of the Mann was a bit definitely different to the original Fiat spec, this one was made in Spain and not Germany and there is something to consider with its outlet airport, instead of it being made of a metal mesh which would further filter out any small particles it was made of a large plastic, which would allow any large particles after the inlet filtration paper to be sucked into the engine. A very bad design indeed.

The air filter I am talking about is the Mann C 36 006/1.



Notice how there is a black plastic grill at the top.

Now look at the original OEM spec (made in Italy).


Similar but different intake material in the top outlet where the air goes into the system after filtration.

If you see reviews from Amazon in Germany,Italy and Spain, you will see that some customers who experienced a bit less responsiveness with the Mann filter. Something to consider when cheaping out on OEM parts (as much as I hate the dealerships). It could always be a placebo effect for you hardcore Mann filter enthusiasts. I have just felt a much more restored power with my new filter but the Mann was totally dusted within a year of casual town driving - something the original Fiat filter was cleaner with (probably allowing more dirt if it was cleaner - so yeah it is a good filter, I just don't recommend it as my opinion).

This year I decided what the heck, I'll go for Crosland, the cheapest air filter in ECP. You are just paying for the marketing I thought... TOTALLY AVOID THAT BRAND BY THE WAY. UNKNOWN PLACE OF MANUFACTURER AND SUPPLIER. Used to be British filters, then sold to Sogefi group (FRAM etc.) and now has unknown details about the source.. Very fishy. The most cheapest parts from the far East is what I am assuming.



The Crosland has the same appearance as the Fiat filter with the foam on the gas blow pipe area and the paper fins w/o foam on the outside air intake. It also has the metal mesh so win-win right?

NOPE.

Remember the issue which plagued older 1.3 Multijet Pandas with air filter water ingress?



Well, the cheaper air filter did not have the correct silicone measurement, it was higher in height causing the silicone to stick out at the back of the air filter housing, allowing water to drip into the housing and getting sucked into the engine potentially causing the engine to prematurely die! Just like the older 2005 Panda issue, something which probably is contributed by using cheaper filters and combined with the heat deforming the plastics is my theory.

I will upload three images of the back of the housing, you will see the silicone moulding is very large on the cheaper filter causing the housing to stick on top allowing water to drip into the system.

The housing looks tight on all fittings, they were aligned perfectly into the box, but you will see on the back that not all were seated well.


Crosland (cheap filter)
Silicone sticks out all the way round, definitely is a not a flush fit. Silicone will prevent water but should not stick out.

Mann
Flush neat fixture. Similar to OEM apart from the top outlet hole

Bosch
A tad higher but still acceptable in my view. I am using this on my latest service and will get back to my casual town driving to see how different the single sided foam will filter compared to the two compartment design.


As you can see, all of them stick out at the back, as that's what the design is, but the Crosland had the highest tolerance with it being lifted up in the corners more visible than the rest of them.

Now the filter may work perfectly but I just don't want something that raises the air housing significantly.

The Bosch now is a different design to all of them. The Bosch Automotive Catalog will recommend F 026 400 346 which is right for most 500L's sold in the UK without the gas blow pipe type air housing which according to ePer is an adaption for colder countries. The Bosch filter is made in China by the way.



You will notice Fiat also produces this filter under 51897086


This is a specific air filter for the 500L, Linea, Ypsilon and Fiorino-Qubo.

It is only for cars without the cold adaptation from what I can see, where there is no gas blowpipe. which is why it is not divided into two compartments. This is where car parts finder websites should not recommend this Bosch if you do have a gas blow pipe.

The air housing for colder countries has some sort of gas blow pipe which looks like with some pipe at the back,

It has some sort of carbon filter foam on the bottom of the paper fins, it isn't divided as there's no need to with our model of the non-blow pipe. Whereas, with the filters, with two compartments you can use the blow-pipe style filter and it would still be compatible.

K&N Air Filter rant

Do not buy this junk, it needs regular cleaning and allows a lot more dirt into the engine. The outlet hole isn't filtered and has caused MAF sensor issues with our 500L. Avoid. No wonder they're on Amazon Warehouse Deals most of the time significantly cheaper...

They give very little performance increase, most likely with a margin of error and will allow a lot more dirt into the engine - this also can cause premature damage. The oiling process can also get into the hot film MAF sensor and burn out your air flow meter. It is a good idea to reuse these, but the problems faced with these filters, it's best to go for paper, a reason OEM's choose paper in the first place.

Tyres
Michellin CrossClimate at the back was changed in 2016 and we've hated it. Very noisy at concrete motorways and in the rain. Something which the 500X users also hate, the noise produced by these tyres.

For grip they're excellent.

GoodYear EfficientGrip at the front changed in 2019, and we're liking it but not good enough compared to stock Continental EcoContact 5 in terms of noise.

GoodYear's are very good grip and have been great if not better than stock around corners, the noise is comparable to Crossclimate however.

I will stick to the original EcoContact next time around as they do seem to produce less noise and have more comfort.

Battery
Still going strong with the original one 4 years later with start/stop all the time

Dualogic oil
This is on the min line. I will have to source some of that magic fiat oil and see how to depressurise the system to top-up. I do remember some fiat's topping up to a minimum and not above due to some issues. So I'll take a look at that.

For the cabin air filter, I have been using SOGEFI GROUP filters very cheap ta 3 a piece on Amazon, I ordered like 5 enough for the lifetime of the car. Appears to be out of stock / production now. They're essentially UFI filters.

Yes my reviews on aftermarket parts is quite TLDR but it will help make you the correct judgement if you're given a bunch of parts to choose from. If Fiat didn't charge 24 for an air filter, I would go stock, but seeing these things only go for a year, I'll go for the one with the most acceptable quality (Not cheap). You may find OEM parts cheaper at shop4parts or eBay, but delivery charges and/or questionable authenticity is a risk.
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Last edited by LordMetro; 24-06-2019 at 14:07.
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Old 24-06-2019   #2
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Re: Servicing - General Review on car.

Can't seem to edit this post anymore.

The Bosch air filter is considerably noisier compared to Mann. It is now going back.

Check the Fiat KEYePER with your VIN, even though I do not have a gas blow pipe, I can see why the system doesn't give me the single compartment filter.

It is just a lot nosier on start up and feels like it filters nothing.

If you had a double compartment filter, stick with it. I myself am going with OEM now as I have had enough figuring out the best compatible option when OEM is the best.

Unless I can find an Mann filter with a metal mesh outlet, I can't see any other viable alternative in stock in the UK.

Air Filters to avoid (if you do not have blow gas pipe and had the original 1.3 Multijet with double compartment filters).
  • Crosland Air Filter - silicone too large, causes the top of air box to lift up allowing water ingress
  • Supposedly any filter made by SOGEFI group as the Crosland was one made by them or used to be one made by them? Questionable quality, may be ok if Fram etc. but cheaper brands from the group should be avoided.
  • Bosch - the air filter pleats does not go all the way down in the box, considerably noisy, ok if your car came with single compartment filter but if you got an double avoid. There are no images on ECP for this filter, so do not assume it is the same as the rest! The silicone mould was acceptable for the double compartment with little tolerance to base.
  • Mann - complaints of Amazon customers outside of UK about reduced responsiveness, probably a placebo. The plastic outlet is a downside but it's silicone fits flush. This was considerably dirtier than the OEM Fiat after a year of same usage.
  • KN - complaints of Amazon customers in various marketplaces incl. out of UK about EML and reduced performance but working fine when replaced back to stock. Likely the oil is affecting the MAF. Explains large stock of warehouse deal products.

Air Filters to use.
  • OEM Fiat - obviously made the engineers who made your car. I'd rather go with an original part that fits rather than mess around with this aftermarket stuff
  • Mann (made in Spain on filter element) - complaints of Amazon customers outside of UK about reduced responsiveness, probably a placebo. The plastic outlet is a downside but it's silicone fits flush. This was considerably dirtier than the OEM Fiat after a year of same usage.
  • UFI filter looks exactly the same as the Mann made in Spain so see above.

I will have another shot of getting an Mann filter, if it comes with the plastic outlet again, it's going back and I'm getting OEM. The images online are falsely advertising the product - but it could be possible for the metal type mesh product to actually exist, but various places, buycarparts and ECP stock the plastic one, even though a metal type mesh spec image is used.

Dualogic Oil Level
Bang on point at max when depressurised. Seems to be ok.

I couldn't find any way to depressurise the system as no gearbox ecu exists on Multiecuscan, so I just waited for it fall down itself during the night.

When pressurised the oil level is on Min, when it was depressurised it was on Max.

Therefore, it has not leaked at all and has been more reliable so far compared to other hassles with the Dualogic I have been seeing around.
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Last edited by LordMetro; 24-06-2019 at 21:52.
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Old 19-07-2019   #3
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Re: Servicing - General Review on car.

Generally Mann and Bosch are universally accepted as good quality filters and as such are OEM for many quality marques. Crossland are as you suggest a cheaper alternative. I would not use them as maintenance is all about prevention in my book and cutting corners is false economy. KN are for track cars where performance at expense of other considerations rules, for boy racer enthusiasts.
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Old 28-07-2019   #4
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Re: Servicing - General Review on car.

Quote Originally Posted by Southsea View Post
Generally Mann and Bosch are universally accepted as good quality filters and as such are OEM for many quality marques. Crossland are as you suggest a cheaper alternative. I would not use them as maintenance is all about prevention in my book and cutting corners is false economy. KN are for track cars where performance at expense of other considerations rules, for boy racer enthusiasts.
Yes, I am not fine with the air filter housing being left open for water to enter lol. Avoid Crossland for this reason. I thought Crossland used Sogefi Group parts but they used to, not anymore - it's stuff from Chinese wholesalers...

Bosch is to be avoided on this model of CF5 engines! It causes the engine to work rough as it is missing the double compartment filter as well.

So yeah do definitely get good quality parts, in my case, I used Fram this year - fits like OEM with metal mesh I believe the Fram extra guard filters for other cars have the metal mesh as it lasts longer than the types with the plastic mesh, for this reason I'll be sticking to Fiat OEM or Sogefi group filters for now. I have yet to try Febi.

UFI is the same filter as Mann from their specs.

Additional notes:

Dual-logic Maintenance

I used AlfaOBD on my mobile to depressurise the system and then disconnected the electric pump - MultiECUScan cannot do this for now. After I topped up with the CS Speed oil.

I bought a bluetooth Elm327 off Aliexpress and ensured it was the PIC chip which allowed ECU access, then I cut off the CanBus resistor and works fine. Mine one had Vgate brand written on it but there are a ton of fakes, so you need to check review images of one with the canbus resistor.

Do not do this when the system is pressurised as you will over-fill it.

Liqui Moly 4300 is working quite well so far, feels much better than Castrol. Next year I'll be trying out Selenia so see if Fiat has any magic in it
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Last edited by LordMetro; 28-07-2019 at 11:39.
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