So I went to change the oil on the 500 that I have just bought and I don't know what size bolt I need to get the plug out ?, anyone have a link to the correct size of tork head that I need ?. Also I noticed that the sump tray was very rusty is this normal ?, and could I maybe sand it down and paint it with something ?..
Technical Fiat 500, oil change and sump question..
- Thread starter Ros3
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Technical Fiat 500, oil change and sump question..
Bluetruck
New member
A 1.2 petrol? Its a 10mm allen for the sump and gearbox level plug. The sump pans do have a habit of rusting to the point of leaking. It is worth cleaning it off and treating with a rust converter and paint then maybe a coat of oil or grease. All the ones I service get a coat of an oil and grease mix along with the rear axle which rust at the same rate!
Bluetruck
New member
I've used stuff made by Locktite on bodywork but not on a sump, I suppose it works ok. Paint? A good quality satin black. Changed a sump on a 2014 500 as it rusted to a leak last year!
If its that bad consider replacing the sump, our 59 plate has had a new sump when we bought it(dealer replaced it foc before we got it).
Bluetruck
New member
Non OEM sumps are cheap to buy and not too hard to fit.
Sure it will be fine, just don't sand down the old sump much, clean it with brake cleaner, if any rusty area still looks "dark/oily" there's very little metal left there?
Ros
For what its worth i jsut got a 500 1.2 and had the same issue.
This what i did:-
Drain oil before attempting any repair of the sump in case it is leaking/seeping
Clean with brake cleaner/ meths / alcohol
Gently remove the surface rust as best possible
Clean again
Treat with Hammerite K rust
Leave 24 hours in this weather
Fill / patch if needed with 2 part chemical metal - screwfix sell it
Leave to dry
Paint with hammerite paint
Leave to dry
Cover with waxoyl or whatever you have
Then do your oil refill / change
Job done - worked for me as my sump was seeping - will see me through the winter i think and beyond now
HTH
For what its worth i jsut got a 500 1.2 and had the same issue.
This what i did:-
Drain oil before attempting any repair of the sump in case it is leaking/seeping
Clean with brake cleaner/ meths / alcohol
Gently remove the surface rust as best possible
Clean again
Treat with Hammerite K rust
Leave 24 hours in this weather
Fill / patch if needed with 2 part chemical metal - screwfix sell it
Leave to dry
Paint with hammerite paint
Leave to dry
Cover with waxoyl or whatever you have
Then do your oil refill / change
Job done - worked for me as my sump was seeping - will see me through the winter i think and beyond now
HTH
Right well I went ahead and fixed the sump. Once I got right under the car and had a good look it really wasn't that bad. Just the front facing side was rusty and just surface rust at that. Still I gave it all I good sand down then treated with krust before 2 good thick coats of Hammerite. It look's like new now. Thanks for all the help, but one thing though I still don't know what size allen key is needed to undo the sump plug, anyone help me out ??..
12mm.
I'd suggest you purchase an allen socket rather than an allen key; mush less frustrating to use, easier on the hands and far less likely to damage the sump plug. You might need a breaker bar to remove it, but use it carefully or you'll need a new sump.
It's a tapered thread, so no sump washer. Be careful not to overtighten when refitting - pulling it up firmly with a standard 1/2" drive ratchet handle will do just fine.
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If you want to be that way inclined, you'll need a torque wrench capable of working accurately at such low torque values - most 1/2" drive torque wrenches aren't suitable for use below about 30 lb/ft.
The 3/8" or even 1/4" drive torque wrenches designed for motorcycles should be fine with this, but it does emphasise the need to be careful not to overtighten!
I rather like taper plugs as sump plugs compared to the more common shouldered bolt with sealing washer which is often used. The "family fleet" has included a number of small SEATs and Skodas over the years and their alloy sumps are all too easily stripped. Never had a problem with the various Panda's taper plugs. They can be tight though and I think this happens because, when fitting, the thread is well oiled by the oil you've just drained so the plug tightens with little effort and the temptation is to overtighten. Then it sits there for maybe a year, with the oil in the threads being squeezed out, until the next oil change. The threads are now relatively "dry" - compared to when fitted - and have "settled" together so it takes a lot more force to remove?
I've heard that the threaded boss in the sump can tear out if you get a really "super tight" one. But, although I've had one in particular which was rediculously tight and needed my "big" power bar to shift it, I've never had that problem. Some people advise using plumbers tape on the plug to ensure a good seal. I don't like that idea as there is a small possibility that tape fragments might get in and trapped in the oil pump pickup strainer. Also, as the plug is tapered it should self seal anyway?
I've heard that the threaded boss in the sump can tear out if you get a really "super tight" one. But, although I've had one in particular which was rediculously tight and needed my "big" power bar to shift it, I've never had that problem. Some people advise using plumbers tape on the plug to ensure a good seal. I don't like that idea as there is a small possibility that tape fragments might get in and trapped in the oil pump pickup strainer. Also, as the plug is tapered it should self seal anyway?
I think the problem is that many folks overtighten them, perhaps incorrectly fearing they'll leak otherwise. If you're servicing a new car for the first time, it might surprise you just how little torque is needed to remove the factory fitted sump plug on the taper plug Fiats.
TrevC
Established member
Regarding the rusting sump issue, is there any feel for how common this is? When I washed my wife's 500c (2015) yesterday, I tried to have a look, but with the car on the ground I could only just see the bottom of it. I ran my hand over as much surface as I could get to, including the front face, and all felt nice and smooth. I'll lift the car and have a proper look when I've more time and inclination (next Spring!) but I'm guessing this is another problem that only affects a proportion of 500s (like the doorhandle and hatch wiring issues).
Assuming I find no rust, I'll probably brush on a layer of Waxoyl anyway.
Assuming I find no rust, I'll probably brush on a layer of Waxoyl anyway.
They are all identical sumps so any car can have the issue probably depends on the use the cars had lots of short runs the wet is what likely caused them to rust
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