Technical Facelift door on pre facelift car

[typecastboy]

I’m fixing a 2014 Sport for a colleague which needs a new door. Her car is a pre facelift car and the door I have is a facelift one. The inside of the door is different and so is the wiring loom.

The door has a crash sensor on it which is wired into the loom and the apertures inside are different. The door card holes seem to all be in the same place so I’m hoping that if I use the old loom from the car that all the other internal wiring is the same so I can just take the crash sensor off. From what I can see the plugs are the same.

Does anyone know whether this will cause any issues?

 

[portland_bill]

If her car is not expecting to find a crash sensor, and it is not connected, it should not create any issues.

 

[jrkitching]

Does anyone know whether this will cause any issues?

If anyone else had posted this question, you'd have been the first person I'd have asked .

Unless anyone else here has done what you're proposing, you'll be breaking ground on this one. Like PB, I'd have expected it to work, but you won't know for sure if there's a problem until you've transferred all the old trim and internal mechanisms into the new door shell. If you need a hole for a fixing that isn't there, then you can always drill one, but if you've got an aperture in the new door where you need to fix something, it won't be that simple.

Let us know how it goes.

 

[typecastboy]

I don’t intend to change anything internally. The plugs all look the same except for the extra one for the crash sensor. I assume the newer cars don’t have the crash sensor behind the seat belt reel but have it on the door instead.

The plug into the car is different too. There’s not a length of cable that goes into the car to plug in, it appears it plugs directly in where door meets car. I will have to strip the loom out and replace it from the car one. The apertures in the New door look like there’s easier access to everything including the horrible job of changing the door handle.

I’ll do a little video when I do it.

 

[306maxi]

Does the door have a door ECU? You may find that this is also different.

 

[typecastboy]

Does the door have a door ECU? You may find that this is also different.

A door ECU? never heard of such a thing!

 

[306maxi]

A door ECU? never heard of such a thing!

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Door_control_unit

such a thing does exist, but to be fair you’re more likely to see them in something that has KESSY, electric folding mirrors, dimming mirrors, mood lighting on the door and so on.

 

[typecastboy]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Door_control_unit



such a thing does exist, but to be fair you’re more likely to see them in something that has KESSY, electric folding mirrors, dimming mirrors, mood lighting on the door and so on.

Oh right, I see. No, Fiat 500s certainly don’t have them. No ECU is shown in MES and there’s nothing within the door itself.

 

[306maxi]

It’s a thing on newer and higher end cars tbh. But it’ll come to lower end cars in time as people expect to get things like KESSY on cars at that end of the market.

 

[typecastboy]

It’s a thing on newer and higher end cars tbh. But it’ll come to lower end cars in time as people expect to get things like KESSY on cars at that end of the market.

I imagine my 500x has got one. It’s still in the local garage having the abs/epb/esr problems sorted out [emoji853]before I do the bodywork.

 

[306maxi]

I imagine my 500x has got one. It’s still in the local garage having the abs/epb/esr problems sorted out [emoji853]before I do the bodywork.

Would be surprised if it did tbh, it’s a rather old platform.

 

[typecastboy]

Would be surprised if it did tbh, it’s a rather old platform.

Is it? What, you mean Jeep? It has fold in mirrors etc.

 

[306maxi]

Is it? What, you mean Jeep? It has fold in mirrors etc.

Ah, it has keyless entry, seems Fiat have moved into the 21st century! Suspect it might have them then.

 

[typecastboy]

Ah, it has keyless entry, seems Fiat have moved into the 21st century! Suspect it might have them then.

Yeah it seems much more technologically advanced and better screwed together than the 500.

 

[JTD_Liam]

The plug into the car is different too. There’s not a length of cable that goes into the car to plug in, it appears it plugs directly in where door meets car. I will have to strip the loom out and replace it from the car one. The apertures in the New door look like there’s easier access to everything including the horrible job of changing the door handle.

I’ll do a little video when I do it.

I wonder if they've done this to prevent the opportunities for more wiring breakages? I've not known Fiat to have problems with wiring breaking in this area, but we all know about the boot wiring and I've known Vauxhalls and VW Group to have wiring breakages in the front door hinge area. Good to know they've made repair access easier too. Perhaps they are learning - the other bits of the 500 facelift (glovebox, useable cupholders) were also answers to criticisms of the earlier cars.

Ah, it has keyless entry, seems Fiat have moved into the 21st century! Suspect it might have them then.

The 500x has loads of kit, albeit mostly as options - lane departure warning, AEB (to be fair even the Panda has that) keyless & capless refueling, keyless entry & start. With the latest facelift they've now added LED front lights - a first on any Fiat or Alfa, who've persisted with xenons until now, traffic sign recognition & auto dipping high beam. They seem to be using the 500x & Renegade to roll out a lot of this stuff - I don't think even the new Alfa Giulia or Stelvio have the traffic sign recognition and they definitely don't have LED front lights.


I think this is possibly why this otherwise dependable (but fairly dull to drive) platform exhibits some electronic failures in the 500x & little Jeep.

 

[306maxi]

The 500x has loads of kit, albeit mostly as options - lane departure warning, AEB (to be fair even the Panda has that) keyless & capless refueling, keyless entry & start. With the latest facelift they've now added LED front lights - a first on any Fiat or Alfa, who've persisted with xenons until now, traffic sign recognition & auto dipping high beam. They seem to be using the 500x & Renegade to roll out a lot of this stuff - I don't think even the new Alfa Giulia or Stelvio have the traffic sign recognition and they definitely don't have LED front lights.


I think this is possibly why this otherwise dependable (but fairly dull to drive) platform exhibits some electronic failures in the 500x & little Jeep.

The problem is that this is now all old hat. Not trying to do the “Ooh look at my BMW” thing, but aside from LED headlights, my 3 series had all these things 7 years ago and I’m very much sure that other manufacturers had these features before, especially on more expensive models.

Now I get that technology costs money, but people are starting to expect more from cars and the things above will soon be seen things that have to be standard or at least available as an option.

 

[JTD_Liam]

Ohh I don't disagree. Seat Leon's have had LED lights for several years, the mid 2000s Citroen C4 had lane-departure warning and Renaults have done (to varying degrees of success) keyless entry & start since the 2002 Megane.

I quite liked that Fiat kept things a bit more simple, as in the case of the French manufacturers, introducing all this tech at a low price seemed a bit hit & miss in terms of dependability, so I'd prefer them to wait till it's more proven. However from seeing some of the glitches on the 500x & Renegade I wonder how well it's been executed even now, coming late to the party.

 

[TrevC]

No tech failures yet after nearly 2 years of 500X ownership - touch wood! I agree that for a 2015 top spec (Lounge) car it's hardly cutting edge. Xenon headlamps, but no leds anywhere, tiny infotainment screen without DAB, no auto lights, or wipers. I'm enjoying it though - nice interior with plastics that are several grades higher than my wife's facelifted 500C. Talking of which, it may seem trivial but the re-designed cupholders are a real improvement, 500ml water bottles no longer eject when cornering!
I'll be interested to see any pictures of the door interior in case we get handle failure - didn't happen on our last one.

 

[SB1500]

“Door ECU”, makes me laugh. Never heard of anything more German!!!

 

[portland_bill]

“Door ECU”, makes me laugh. Never heard of anything more German!!!

A feature of the CANbus system. Around the car are 'modules', small local ECUs that handle their local stuff.
A friend has a Croma. When he got it, the driver's door was damaged, so he sourced a complete door, of the same colour, and swapped it. From then, his mileage flashed.
In the door is a module, that handles the signals to/from the window switches, as that door can operate any of the four, plus door lock control I think. As the 'new' module was an alien, the main body computer was upset so flashes the mileage as a mild temper tantrum. A quick proxy alignment sorted this, and all is working as it should.