Cjpinner said:

My car should be going in this week for repair. So will update you on the outcome... Fingers crossed this sorts it!!!!

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Will keep all my fingers crossed for you.

Again if it's a brandnew unit, I'm curious what weight and specs oil the workshop is going to use...and why...

Peter Pick-Up said:

Again if it's a brandnew unit, I'm curious what weight and specs oil the workshop is going to use...and why...

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If it's being done under warranty, I doubt they'd be changing the oil as part of the repair.

If the problem is caused by oil starvation. degradation or blocked strainers etc. then a thinner oil (0W30) is going to be better at preventing a problem than a thicker oil.

On the other hand, if the problem is caused by wear, then a thicker oil (5W40) will be better at preventing the problem.

My guess (having got a "fiddling with engines" T-shirt) is that the switch to 0W30 is more to do with emissions than to solve the problem with the Multi-Air unit... since it coincides with the Euro-6 doodah.

Obviously you can make oil as thin as you like.. but you can also overdo it and that would knacker your crank and cam journals, never mind that your MA is then fine.. So 0W30 is probably okay for Euro-6 motors but if it was mine, I'd run 5W40, at least in the summer... since someone spec'd that grade originally, for a reason.

The MA problem is certainly more to do with the 18,000 mile change intervals, than the oil grade. If I had one, I'd change the oil at half the mileage until I knew that was enough to prevent this issue.. plus clean out the strainer every change. If that all came out clean, then I'd maybe stretch to a 12,000 interval. I doubt I'd run the oil to 18,000 miles - it must come out completely shot.

Plenty of short trips, with the engine not quite warming up (i.e. gunk in the oil) and/or a low oil level probably don't help. In this case I'd say 9000 miles religiously, using the 0W30... but clean the strainer too, every time.


Ralf S.

Ralf S. said:

My guess (having got a "fiddling with engines" T-shirt) is that the switch to 0W30 is more to do with emissions than to solve the problem with the Multi-Air unit... since it coincides with the Euro-6 doodah.

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I'd agree with this (I've said as much before, here).

I've also written about the difference between the two grades of oil.

I'd also agree that the recommended oil change interval is too long and that 9000 mile changes may help prolong the life of the uniair unit, which seems to be the general consensus here. I also think part of the problem may be that cars are being driven hard shortly after startup from cold; personally I would keep below 3000rpm until the engine had reached operating temperature.

jrkitching said:

If it's being done under warranty, I doubt they'd be changing the oil as part of the repair.

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They have confirmed they are doing oil change. I asked today after reading your post and putting in 5w40...

jrkitching said:

If it's being done under warranty, I doubt they'd be changing the oil as part of the repair.

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going back to misfiring, my local friendly garage who buy cars from auction picked up a badly misfiring panda - (it wasn't a TA however) They did all the usual checks and couldn't work out what it was. No fault code. They did some googling and it was just that the input socket into the ECU had corroded slightly and was causing the issue. No doubt an unscrupulous garage could charge for a new ECU if this arises....may be the moral is check your connections before changing any unit, whatever it is?

Cjpinner said:

Hi All,

I bought my 500 last week and already having problems!!!!

I have a rough idle to start, the drive 200m and the car starts to kangaroo and splutter!! Then lights up like a Christmas tree then goes into limp mode still spluttering. So I pull over turn off and leave for 1min start up and resets and drives OKish...

I have replaced sparks and coils. Changed the oil and still playing up.

The garage i bought from are going to replace the uni air module...

Which after reading up on forum sounds like the problem???

Anyone else had this issue??

Thanks

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Hi I have a 67 plate, my problem was exactly as you described, it started when I was on 4000 miles. After several visits to the dealership, I had to threaten them with rejection of the car for them to get Fiat technical involved who diagnosed the uni air module. Im now driving with fingers crossed its cured the problem. Maybe its not an issue affecting older vehicles. Mines the 60th anniversary model and it was number 30 off the production line.

Peter Pick-Up said:

As the OP is getting a new TwinAir module, it's probably safe to use synthetic 0W30 C2 oil.

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That doesn't make sense. Why combine a new module of a Euro 5 engine with oil of a Euro 6 engine? Euro 5 and Euro 6 have different MultiAir generations: Euro 6 is MultiAir 2.

AGH1965 said:

Euro 6 is MultiAir 2.

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What do you think is going to be fitted...??
Safe bet: a latest generation Euro 6 unit!

I suspect the actual uniair units are identical in both versions. Multiair 2 integrated the exhaust manifold in to the head afaik which produced some advantages apparently

...question remains:
What weight and specs oil to use, and why...??

Euro 5 engine, Euro 6 TwinAir unit....:shrug:

It seems Mercky is right. The ancient ePER from May 2014 says that at that time both a 2011 Euro 5 TwinAir and a 2014 Euro 6 TwinAir need a module with part number 55260267. I thought the MultiAir 2 module would be really different.

Peter Pick-Up said:

What weight and specs oil to use, and why...??

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Why pretend to be smarter than the manufacturer? Besides, weight??? I guess you mean viscosity.

OK, there might be one reason though. My 2011 Euro 5 TwinAir used 5W40 and except for the first 5000 km, there was no significant oil consumption. My 2014 Euro 6 TwinAir uses 0W30 and there is significant oil consumption. I need to add more than half a liter per 30000 km to keep the level above minimum.

Peter Pick-Up said:

...question remains:
What weight and specs oil to use, and why...??

Euro 5 engine, Euro 6 TwinAir unit....:shrug:

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That's still not been answered satisfactorily after several years of posts.

We know what Fiat officially recommend based on the Euro version of the car, but we've no idea what is actually best for the engine.

In practice, I suspect most cars being serviced by garages are simply filled with whatever is the closest bulk oil stock they have on the day.

AGH1965 said:

My 2011 Euro 5 TwinAir used 5W40 and except for the first 5000 km, there was no significant oil consumption. My 2014 Euro 6 TwinAir uses 0W30 and there is significant oil consumption.

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Probably more to do with the individual tolerances and the way the engines were run in.

The difference in viscosity between the two grades of oil is not that great.

AGH1965 said:

Why pretend to be smarter than the manufacturer? Besides, weight??? I guess you mean viscosity.

OK, there might be one reason though. My 2011 Euro 5 TwinAir used 5W40 and except for the first 5000 km, there was no significant oil consumption. My 2014 Euro 6 TwinAir uses 0W30 and there is significant oil consumption. I need to add more than half a liter per 30000 km to keep the level above minimum.

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Well, Mr. Smartass, weight=viscosity, do your homework next time.
Our 2016 Giulietta with 0W30 WEIGHT oil doesn't consume oil at all, at 30.000km now, but in your case, when you brag about 1 liter at 60000km, we call you in Dutch a "miereneuker" ( ant ****er)
(You probably mean 1/2 liter at 3000km, that's 1 liter at 6000km, that's no significant oil consumption at all and is far above the critical consumption level...)

jrkitching said:

In practice, I suspect most cars being serviced by garages are simply filled with whatever is the closest bulk oil stock they have on the day.

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You are absolutely right, in my search for Selenia oil, I visited a large, official Fiat dealer near where I live.
To my horror, they used Total 0W40 ( in bulk) in ALL Fiat's they serviced, no matter new or used, model, year, MultiAir/TwinAir what ever...:bang:

AGH1965 said:

It seems Mercky is right. The ancient ePER from May 2014 says that at that time both a 2011 Euro 5 TwinAir and a 2014 Euro 6 TwinAir need a module with part number 55260267. I thought the MultiAir 2 module would be really different.

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There is no newer ePER than 2014, from that year on, Fiat is using a different parts program, only accessible for dealers.

Peter Pick-Up said:

Our 2016 Giulietta with 0W30 WEIGHT oil doesn't consume oil at all, at 30.000km now, but in your case, when you brag about 1 liter at 60000km, we call you in Dutch a "miereneuker" ( ant ****er)
(You probably mean 1/2 liter at 3000km, that's 1 liter at 6000km, that's no significant oil consumption at all and is far above the critical consumption level...)

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Brag??? I just mentioned something I observed. For 30 years I owned cars where I didn't need to add any oil between the scheduled maintenance visits to keep the oil level above minimum. The Euro 6 TwinAir with 0W30 oil is the first car that can't reach the next scheduled maintenance visit without adding oil. If I would have followed FIAT's instruction "if the level of the oil is close to or below the MIN mark, add oil via the filler until the MAX mark is reached", then I would have needed approximately 3 liters till the second scheduled maintenance visit at 60000 km. In my opinion that is too much to ignore. Therefore I call it significant.

Peter Pick-Up said:

Well, Mr. Smartass, weight=viscosity, do your homework next time.

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Should I increase the font size of my signature?