Technical The one and only Dualogic failure thread

[jrkitching]

Hi Jane, and welcome to the forum. Sorry to hear your car is giving you problems.

He also mentioned that it would probably be ok if we only drove it in manual mode. Does anyone know if this is the case? Will the transmission be ok if we only drive it in manual?

This is the first time I've seen this suggested. My first thought is that it probably won't help much - even in manual mode, you'll still be relying on the actuator to perform the actual gear changes. And if you're saying that when it failed in traffic, selecting manual mode wouldn't get you moving again, that doesn't bode well for relying on manual mode as a workaround alternative to fixing it.

But seeing as the car is probably otherwise scrap in view of the likely repair cost, you've little to lose by trying.

 

[A3jeroen]

Remember this is not a normal "auto" or do you have the same specs as the US?
Things like brakeswitch, switch for reverselight or earthing at the rear lightcluster are the usual suspects on the dualogic.

gr J

 

[jrkitching]

do you have the same specs as the US

My understanding is that the Australian cars are the European version, so all the usual dualogic coments apply.

We've had quite a few posts regarding dualogic failures on Australian cars; it seems franchised dealers there take the same attitude regarding rectification as their European counterparts, only with even higher prices.

 

[Cbs9280]

Hi all

Hope this is ok I have just acquired a Fiat Doblo with the dualogic and am having issues that seem to be described throughout this thread.

The box is great apart from seemingly changing down from 5th to 4th, it will knock itself into neutral and stay there until I can stop the car then it will allow me to get it into first.

Obviously first port of call is to send it back to dealer but wondering if anyone has experience of this particular issue. The car is a UK model 2014 with 50k on clock

 

[jrkitching]

Hello and welcome to the forum; sorry to hear you're having issues with your recent purchase.

Hope this is ok I have just acquired a Fiat Doblo

Yes, that's absolutely fine; this thread is more about dualogic problems than the specific vehicle the transmission happens to be bolted into.

The car is a UK model 2014 with 50k on clock

That's exactly the age & mileage at which things often start to go awry.

I have just acquired a Fiat Doblo with the dualogic

I'd be doing everything within my power to un-acquire it. The dealer you bought it from will likely try to patch things up sufficiently to get it through whatever warranty may have come with it, rather than doing a lasting repair. Unless the root cause of the fault is properly addressed, any fix is likely to be only temporary. If you have the opportunity to reject the vehicle and get your money back, then that's what I'd do.

 

[jackwhoo]

I agree with previous post.

Look into your rights to reject the vehicle as unroadworthy / dangerous. Think what could happen if you lost all drive on a busy motorway and were unable to reach the hard shoulder. "Smart" motorways often do not have hard shoulder)

 

[Cbs9280]

I agree with previous post.

Look into your rights to reject the vehicle as unroadworthy / dangerous. Think what could happen if you lost all drive on a busy motorway and were unable to reach the hard shoulder. "Smart" motorways often do not have hard shoulder)

Thanks for the replies guys

Normally i would be straight back with the car returning it but it is a bloody nice example gearbox apart, I got a one year warranty with it is it worth trying the repair route or do you think it isn't worth the hassle

 

[AshyZ]

Hey Everyone,
I have a 2013 2cyl 0.9L T 500c, and I too was an unfortunate victim of the selespeed/dualogic failure. After being quoted over AUD10 000 by Fiat in my city to just replace the selespeed actuator, I took it to a local mechanic who replaced my entire transmission and clutch unit for around AUD4000 (still a LOT of money for a broke uni student ).

Since then, the car has not stopped playing up. It intermittently and randomly shuts down at red lights or when idling in car parks and the like, throwing up engine lights and a bunch of transmission/clutch/start stop related codes (Not the same ones every time either.) My poor mechanic has torn the car apart and consulted every specialist in the area (to be fair there a not many). And still every time he thinks he's fixed it within a week it does the same thing. For reference, the issue has been happening for at least 6 months and I have had the car given back to me presumed fixed at least 6 times only for it to fail again (my blessed mechanic is not charging me for any of this but its still very inconvenient). Is there ANYONE on here who has had a similar problem who can tell me what the solution is??

The car seems to run completely fine when I restart is even with the engine light on, which makes me think its not a mechanical issue but I'm not an expert by any measure.


***Things my mechanic has tried:
- Clearing the codes
- Testing the ECU and Transmission computer
- Had it examined by an auto electrician
- Reset the car and bled the clutch fluid (guided remotely by a fiat expert from another state)
That's all I can think of off the top of my head but I'm certain there are other things he has tested that I'm forgetting at the moment.

 

[jrkitching]

Hello and welcome to the forum.

I'm sorry to hear about the problems you're having, and thank you for sharing your experiences. If nothing else, it will reinforce the implicit warning in this thread to anyone contemplating the purchase of one of these vehicles.

TBH, I'm not sure how much help we can be. If a competent mechanic with the car in front of them can't figure out what's wrong, it's hard to see how someone sitting thousands of miles away at a keyboard is going to come up with anything better. Once you've established the battery is in good condition, all fluid levels are where they should be and the clutch isn't worn out, essentially you are out of simple and cheap things to try.

It certainly could be a weak electrical connection or failing electronic module somewhere, but in the absence of a definitive fault code, how on earth can this be tracked down?

The real conclusion I am drawing from this thread is that a 9yr old dualogic with a significant persistent problem is likely beyond economic repair.

 

[AshyZ]

Hello and welcome to the forum.

I'm sorry to hear about the problems you're having, and thank you for sharing your experiences. If nothing else, it will reinforce the implicit warning in this thread to anyone contemplating the purchase of one of these vehicles.

TBH, I'm not sure how much help we can be. If a competent mechanic with the car in front of them can't figure out what's wrong, it's hard to see how someone sitting thousands of miles away at a keyboard is going to come up with anything better. Once you've established the battery is in good condition, all fluid levels are where they should be and the clutch isn't worn out, essentially you are out of simple and cheap things to try.

It certainly could be a weak electrical connection or failing electronic module somewhere, but in the absence of a definitive fault code, how on earth can this be tracked down?

The real conclusion I am drawing from this thread is that a 9yr old dualogic with a significant persistent problem is likely beyond economic repair.

Hi, thank you for the reply.
I absolutely know how difficult diagnostics can be, especially without physically looking at the car. My only hope was that someone on here may have had similar symptoms after their dualogic failure and could explain what their problem was in the hope that it was the same issue. I know it was a long shot though. Especially since in Australia where I live there aren’t many people that know much about these cars at all (don’t even get me started on the useless dealership)

Despite it being 9 years old, it’s got very low kilometres on the car and even lower on the new gearbox, so the fact that it’s being so stubborn is absolutely devastating me, as I really can’t afford to junk the car.

I am glad to reinforce why the dualogics are a terrible choice, I only wish I’d found this forum before I bought mine

 

[teo23]

Hello everyone. I'm new owner of Lancia musa 1.4i 2005 dualogic transmission, and I have this problem: in auto mode, sometimes, when it changes speed from 1 to 2, it changes hard and the car seems to brake. from 2 onwards the exchanges are normal.
The clutch was recently replaced but the problem did not go away. What can it be? thanks

 

[jrkitching]

Hello everyone. I'm new owner of Lancia musa 1.4i 2005 dualogic transmission, and I have this problem: in auto mode, sometimes, when it changes speed from 1 to 2, it changes hard and the car seems to brake. from 2 onwards the exchanges are normal.
The clutch was recently replaced but the problem did not go away. What can it be? thanks

Was the problem there before the clutch was replaced?

 

[teo23]

Was the problem there before the clutch was replaced?

yes

 

[Chopin]

Hi Guys - I am still a fan of the duologic on my twinair but would like info on servicing this unit - I have serviced the car myself over the Covid period but did nothing on the gearbox side - Is there shared oil or should I be looking to service as a separate unit?
Thx

 

[jrkitching]

but would like info on servicing this unit

I'm not aware there is any routine servicing item for the dualogic transmission.

The gearbox and actuating mechanism are separate and use different fluids. Checking the levels in both once a year seems a wise precaution; the accumulator needs to be depressurised before checking the selespeed fluid level in the actuating mechanism, which officially needs to be done using MES or Examiner (though there are unofficial workarounds).

I understand there is a software procedure for estimating the extent of clutch wear, and recalibrating the clutch if necessary.

Gearbox is just a standard manual gearbox; it uses the same gear oil as the manual versions and is topped up/changed in the same way.

A complete change of either fluid isn't specifically recommended by Fiat, but some owners may choose to do this. Some say the clutch life is shorter than on cars with fully manual transmission.

My own recommendation for the best service item to protect yourself from a large and unexpected bill is:

"after 5 years/50000 miles (whichever comes first), trade the car in"

This would prevent most, though not all, of the numerous failure reports and threads we've seen over the years.

I'd give similar advice to TA owners. If you've got both a TA engine and a dualogic transmission, I'd put that service item into bold, and use a larger font.

 

[Chopin]

I'm not aware there is any routine servicing item for the dualogic transmission.

The gearbox and actuating mechanism are separate and use different fluids. Checking the levels in both once a year seems a wise precaution; the accumulator needs to be depressurised before checking the selespeed fluid level in the actuating mechanism, which officially needs to be done using MES or Examiner (though there are unofficial workarounds).

I understand there is a software procedure for estimating the extent of clutch wear, and recalibrating the clutch if necessary.

Gearbox is just a standard manual gearbox; it uses the same gear oil as the manual versions and is topped up/changed in the same way.

A complete change of either fluid isn't specifically recommended by Fiat, but some owners may choose to do this. Some say the clutch life is shorter than on cars with fully manual transmission.

My own recommendation for the best service item to protect yourself from a large and unexpected bill is:

"after 5 years/50000 miles (whichever comes first), trade the car in"

This would prevent most, though not all, of the numerous failure reports and threads we've seen over the years.

I'd give similar advice to TA owners. If you've got both a TA engine and a dualogic transmission, I'd put that service item into bold, and use a larger font.

Noted - I am aware the Twinair and duologic are both cliffedge items but really like the little motor and it is only now available here in the Cross 4x4 manual - now if they did that Panda in duologic....

 

[jrkitching]

and it is only now available here in the Cross 4x4 manual - now if they did that Panda in duologic....

Have you seen this thread?

I think there's a reason why Fiat don't sell a TA Cross 4x4 dualogic.

 

[Fiorinoswe]

Hello!

So, Fiat fiorino gearbox with problem.
I can move My Gearstick but THE car only makes beepsound and does not shift to D or R.

When i open My door i only hear a fast Click sound (open close) from the Relay.

Is the Relay bad or is it a faulty pump?

 

[A3jeroen]

If the relais is easily accessible and not too expensive I'd start with that.
MES could probably tell you in detail where the problem is.

gr J

 

[Fiorinoswe]

If the relais is easily accessible and not too expensive I'd start with that.
MES could probably tell you in detail where the problem is.

gr J

Found the problem.
A burnt fuse of 40A. As soon as i put One new in it burns THE fuse. I tried with 60A and the pump started to make Noice.

Tried 80A and pump started and all Warnings disappeared.

So i Will take the pump out and change it.

I tapped it with a hammer with 40A and it started but very, very Slow.

So -
If You open THE door and the Relay only clicks and No sound from pump - Probably No power to Pump, The pump is not working.

Tapp THE pump with a hammer and check if it starts.

Change The pump that is located with reservoartank.