Technical The one and only Dualogic failure thread

[varesecrazy]

Re: Stop Start/Transmission issue!!

Hi

How old is the battery ?

As a test get the passenger to sit in the rear.. that may well help..

Do let us know

Charlie

 

[jrkitching]

Re: Stop Start/Transmission issue!!

Hello and welcome to the forum.

Sorry to hear of your problem.

How old is the battery ?

Good question; this is a common reason why S/S would be disabled. It's possible an undervoltage may be causing the transmission glitch, but it's also possible that the transmission glitch is causing the S/S to throw a hissy fit. Either fault could be triggering the other, or they could be unrelated.

could I get some advice on where to go from here??

The issues you've experienced will likely have caused some fault codes to have been stored. With transmission faults, you generally need Fiat-specific software, which means either a franchised dealer, a Fiat specialist, or (if you're a DIY type of person) a copy of multiecuscan (MES). If you give us an idea of your location, there may be someone here near you with a copy of MES who can help you.

Taking it to a franchised dealer and asking for a diagnosis is one option, but you'll likely pay around £100 or so, and that's before they actually do any rectification work. Your local independent garage will likely just use a generic code reader, which has the potential to both help and confuse - you'll pay less, but their diagnosis may prove worthless and take you in the wrong direction. An independent Fiat specialist with a good working knowledge of this type of transmission is the best place to go.

You could try eliminating the battery as a cause by putting it on charge, but if you do this with the battery in the car, be sure to follow the specific instructions for charging batteries on S/S versions or you could damage the car's electronics. If charging the battery solves the problem, and the battery is more than three years old, then I'd suggest replacing it, even if it otherwise checks out OK. Batteries on S/S versions need to be near perfect if you want to enjoy correct S/S functionality, and a battery in top notch condition reduces the chances of all the car's electronic systems behaving strangely, including those which control the operation of the transmission.

 

[deedeedee]

Hiya! Thanks so much for the great reply.

I’ve only had the car a year, and we were assured by the previous owner that the battery was new. But I will definitely look into how ‘new’ he meant. It makes sense that this would be the issue.

I’m in West London, and as far as I’m aware, Fiat Parkside in Hounslow is the closest franchised dealer to me, any other suggestions would be more than welcome though!

Again, thanks so much for the info and help, it’s definitely given me some clarity.

Dee

 

[varesecrazy]

The suggestion of putting the passenger in the back..

Odd how they make a difference..

One of the culprits of that warning are for the brake light switch..

Which can be operated by front passengers feet..

Come back with an update..before booking a Garage visit

Charlie

 

[deedeedee]

I’ve managed every possible combination of passenger positioning you could thing of and it happens almost every single time. Even sometimes if I’ve got a heavy load of groceries in the car with me! I’ve not heard of any weight-based issues with Fiats or any other car for that matter, so that’s the part of the problem that’s throwing me for a loop!

Will definitely keep you updated

 

[varesecrazy]

rolydixon

Might have something to add

 

[Rocco Reviews]

I’ve managed every possible combination of passenger positioning you could thing of and it happens almost every single time. Even sometimes if I’ve got a heavy load of groceries in the car with me! I’ve not heard of any weight-based issues with Fiats or any other car for that matter, so that’s the part of the problem that’s throwing me for a loop!



Will definitely keep you updated

Maybe there is a sensor in the seat that trigger alarms in the transmission I don’t know why that would happen but it could, it doesn’t make much sense why it has only happened with people in the car. Have you tried driving for a long distance by yourself to see if it pulls up?

 

[deedeedee]

Maybe there is a sensor in the seat that trigger alarms in the transmission I don’t know why that would happen but it could, it doesn’t make much sense why it has only happened with people in the car. Have you tried driving for a long distance by yourself to see if it pulls up?

My daily commute is average 45 mins and without a fail, it only happens when someone’s with me. I just got back from a long drive on my own and it was completely fine. Will try again tomorrow taking someone with me.

 

[varesecrazy]

My daily commute is average 45 mins and without a fail, it only happens when someone’s with me. I just got back from a long drive on my own and it was completely fine. Will try again tomorrow taking someone with me.

So no matter the seat a passenger occupies the fault light appears..?

That is intrigueing..

Where are you based.. N.London..?

Will have to think of a decent option to get the fault code read..

Charlie

 

[rolydixon]

Hi 3d sorry to hear about the bother you are having with your 500. The only car I have with S/S is a Citroen so no direct experience of your situation but here are my thoughts anyway ...

First thing I think the S/S warning is a red herring because it's very likely that the S/S will be designed to disable automatically with any transmission error - you would definitelty not want the engine to start unless 100% confident that the car was not going to lurch forward into the vehicle in front for example. It's also possible an S/S fault may be related to the clutch position sensor.

I would focus on the transmission error itself - I agree with jrk if the light is on there is almost certainly an error code logged so that would be the first thing to check. Paying a garage is one way but buying an ELM327 wifi dongle for £10ish on ebay and downloading a free app like AlfaOBD for your phone is far more satisfying and will be a gift that continues to give. The free apps are great for reading/resetting the codes but won't allow you to perform any maintenance on the system. as a 'diy type' I've bought and used MultiECUScan with some success although I have to say the Windows PC version seems more robust than the IOS version.

Knowing the code will at least tell you why the transmission light came on. It may not lead you directly to the problem but you can also use the free app to monitor gearbox parameters such as hydraulic pressure, clutch position etc while your driving which may shed more light on what's happening. Btw I recommend having some help in the car if you drive with an app connected to save getting distracted by it - not a problem for you here I assume as a passenger seems to be part of the equation.

The passenger thing is a strange one - the only electrical effect I can think off is that there will be a sensor in the seat for the seat belt warning light but I immediately can't think of any reason it would affect the transmission system. In the end it may be that you have to wait for the problem to become worse.

For me the most significant thing is that you say the car once stuck in neutral and took 4 attempts to re-engage. Checking the hydraulic fluid (not the gearbox oil!!) level would be a good thing to do - if it's below the mark get it topped up and if it's not clean get it changed.

Apart from that the only thing I can add is keep driving and collecting the evidence about conditions when the fault occurs - again it may not lead to the solution but it might at least help eliminate some theories as to what could be wrong.

All the best

 

[AdbFiat]

Hello all,

New to the this forum and I’ve already read some great advice and it’s helpful (albeit quite sad) that others have similar issues. I really wanted to seek advice from anyone with regards to my issues.

1. My instrument cluster went down and doesn’t work. I’ve been quoted a price for it already and I’m not too fussed about that spend.

2. This next issue occurred the same time that my instrument cluster went, when in automatic, my gears do not automatically shift past second gear! He took apart the gearbox thinking it was to do with the solenoid, cleaned that up but has now advised that the mechatronics unit in the gearbox is faulty and will need repair or replacement. He unfortunately is unable to do this and has suggested somewhere else but she’s quoting bearing £2500 mark, excluding diagnostics/checking the gear box.

It’s a 2015 model (I’ve had it for just under 5 years) and frankly over the past two years I’ve barely driven it due to travelling and before my instrument cluster went I was still under 20,000 miles.

Has anyone had any experience of this. I’ve read that some people DIY replacements... or buy the parts and then take them to the garage? Is it worth the repair? And if not; for people who have replaced it in its entirety, did it run smoothly thereafter With no more problems? Does anyone happen to know of any great Fiat specialised garages in London (west if possible) that they have taken their cars too? If possible, I would prefer to give my money during these times to a local garage that someone has previously used for a similar issue.

I look forward to hearing from you!

 

[jrkitching]

Hello and welcome to the forum.

Funnily enough there's another new chap on the forum asking if a 500 automatic is likely to be a trouble free purchase . Your post is, sadly, yet another reason why it isn't. IMO transmissions should not be developing major faults costing nearly three grand to fix after less than 20,000 miles (neither should instrument clusters for that matter, but although another quite common fault, at least that one can be fixed reasonably cheaply if you do your homework.).

So, what to do?

Personally, if it runs normally much of the time and isn't displaying any warning lights or messages, I'd consider trading it in. (note to would-be purchasers of used dualogics; it's previous owner may have done exactly that).

Before committing to any major expenditure, I'd suggest taking it to an independent Fiat specialist for a proper assessment. If it can be cobbled back into working order cheaply, do so, then follow the instruction in the previous paragraph.

It's not exactly near you, but it's not all that far, and if you fancy a day out in nice countryside, you could try the folks at Small Car Services.

 

[Bebop679]

Hi I am new to this forum and am trying to find answers to the following problem we have on my wife's 500 twin-air
The car is 2014 with 18500 miles on the clocks and 1 owner from new and serviced at our local Fiat Dealer all the time .
The Issue is the car will go from automatic into manual mode all by itself ? i can replicate this by purposely knocking the gear lever when auto is already selected . I have been in the passenger seat watching my wife as she gets in and drives and have proved that this happens by itself and she has not accidently touched the lever .
When she arrived home from work a few days ago the check transmission warning came up on the dash for the first time and has not happened since ( a very hot day ) i cannot see any signs of transmission oil leaks and cannot seem to find anybody else with the exact same problem just faults relating to no gear selection at all or stuck in neutral etc none of which we have experienced .Has anybody got an idea what is going on or had the same problem

 

[jackwhoo]

Re: Dual logic gearbox going into manual mode

Hi I am new to this forum and am trying to find answers to the following problem we have on my wife's 500 twin-air
The car is 2014 with 18500 miles on the clocks and 1 owner from new and serviced at our local Fiat Dealer all the time .
The Issue is the car will go from automatic into manual mode all by itself ? i can replicate this by purposely knocking the gear lever when auto is already selected . I have been in the passenger seat watching my wife as she gets in and drives and have proved that this happens by itself and she has not accidently touched the lever .
When she arrived home from work a few days ago the check transmission warning came up on the dash for the first time and has not happened since ( a very hot day ) i cannot see any signs of transmission oil leaks and cannot seem to find anybody else with the exact same problem just faults relating to no gear selection at all or stuck in neutral etc none of which we have experienced .Has anybody got an idea what is going on or had the same problem

Hi,

Is it under warranty ?

Did you buy it new?

Does it still have the original battery?

Has it been stood unused for long period during lock down?

Do you have battery charger and can you leave it charging overnight or longer?

Jack

 

[jackwhoo]

Re: Dual logic gearbox going into manual mode

If the brake lights come on with the slightest touch on the brake pedal or if the brake lights are constantly on , then it could just be brake light pedal switch requires adjustment.

 

[John202020]

Re: Dual logic gearbox going into manual mode

Hi and welcome
You may(not) wish to read this thread https://www.fiatforum.com/500/425006-one-only-dualogic-failure-thread.html

moderator's note: that's this one!

My gut reaction first reading your post is, sell it/trade it in, perhaps not what you want to hear, just my personal thought?

 

[jrkitching]

Re: Dual logic gearbox going into manual mode

Hi I am new to this forum and am trying to find answers to the following problem we have on my wife's 500 twin-air

Hello and welcome to the forum.

I'm sorry to hear of your troubles.

Since we're almost 600 posts in now, you'll gather that you're by no means alone.

My gut reaction is the same as John's. This could be a very good time to think about trading the car in.

A six year old TA 500 is not a car I'd recommend to anyone unless they had excellent mechanical skills, and even then, they might be wiser not to bother.

Your experience shown that even ultra low mileage car one owner cars which have been main dealer serviced from new are not guaranteed to be free from issues.

 

[donkeyuk]

HI Can anyone please help

I have a semi automatic Fiat 500 and when im driving it keeps slipping into neutral when I slow down or stop, it has also decided not to go into revers anymore,

I have checked the transition fluid and all topped up.

The car was working fine 1 day when I was going up a steep hill I used the manual gears to get up the hill as it was really struggling, the day after this is when I started having this problem, not sure if this had anything to do with the problem that I have.

Can anyone shed any light into this for me please.

Thank you for any help

 

[jrkitching]

HI Can anyone please help

I have a semi automatic Fiat 500 and when im driving it keeps slipping into neutral when I slow down or stop, it has also decided not to go into revers anymore,

I have checked the transition fluid and all topped up.

The car was working fine 1 day when I was going up a steep hill I used the manual gears to get up the hill as it was really struggling, the day after this is when I started having this problem, not sure if this had anything to do with the problem that I have.

Can anyone shed any light into this for me please.

Thank you for any help

Hello there.

Sorry to hear you've got problems.

A little more background history on your car would be helpful; age, mileage, how long you've owned it, where in the country you're located, etc.

As you'll see by reading this thread, these transmissions can be problematical. Proper diagnosis generally requires the services of a fiat specialist; either a franchised dealer or an independent like this one. Most general purpose garages do not have enough knowledge of these transmissions to be of much help, and reading any fault codes requires fiat-specific diagnostics; generic code readers will not suffice.

If you go to a franchised dealer; expect to pay into three figures for diagnostics. They generally deal with dualogic faults by replacing large chunks of the transmission complete; the cost is often multiple thousands of pounds. For these reasons, I'd suggest an independent Fiat specialist if there is one nearby.

Something you can do for yourself is to check the battery is in good condition and that the earth leads are sound and not corroded; like many of the electrical systems on the car, the transmission is not tolerant of a weak or failing battery.

 

[donkeyuk]

Hi

Thank you for the reply, the car is a 08 and has 48000 on the clock we have had the car almost a year now.

I will check the battery as stated and all the earth leads, oh and im in Swindon Wiltshire UK