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Old 15-05-2015   #31
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Quote Originally Posted by ahmett View Post

I think conventional modern autos are much more realiable than robotized manuals but of course still less reliable and more costly to fix than a conventional manual.
The American 500 has a conventional auto gearbox so it's definitely something that's possible. I have no idea why FIAT are so keen on retaining the Dualogic/Selespeed

I bought a 3 year extended warranty through a 3rd party insurer (Swann) when I bought my 500C TwinAir Dualogic new -- that's 6 years of warranty in total. I'm guessing I'll probably have the chance to use it (or at least attempt to use it, depending on how sneaky they are when it comes to denying claims)... in any case, I'll most likely sell my car by the 5th year and will reassess the market then.

Mind you, I love my 500, but I dread the potential problems that may surface later
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Old 15-05-2015   #32
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Quote Originally Posted by 44sunsets View Post
The American 500 has a conventional auto gearbox so it's definitely something that's possible. I have no idea why FIAT are so keen on retaining the Dualogic/Selespeed
CO2 g/km.
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Old 15-05-2015   #33
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Quote Originally Posted by 44sunsets View Post
The American 500 has a conventional auto gearbox so it's definitely something that's possible. I have no idea why FIAT are so keen on retaining the Dualogic/Selespeed

I bought a 3 year extended warranty through a 3rd party insurer (Swann) when I bought my 500C TwinAir Dualogic new. I'm guessing I'll probably have the chance to use it (or at least attempt to use it, depending on how sneaky they are when it comes to denying claims)...
oh and @UFI the US spec Auto on the Fiat 500 is Aisin = ) They decided Magnetti Marelli's unreliability cannot be tolerated in the US. Haha no wonder they didn't introduce the Selespeed in the US, there the laws actually protect the consumer unlike backwards Europe = )
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Old 15-05-2015   #34
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Quote Originally Posted by zanes View Post
CO2 g/km.
no its because US car market is more demanding than EU and the laws there are toughter. Also Fiat had a very bad reputation in the US and they knew that they cannot afford broken gearboxes like they get away with in Europe.
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Old 15-05-2015   #35
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

I think zanes is right, the Dualogic does give better fuel consumption figures as it is more efficient than a traditional torque converter automatic. The US doesn't have the same focus on green emission standards that Europe does.
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Old 15-05-2015   #36
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Quote Originally Posted by ahmett View Post
no its because US car market is more demanding than EU and the laws there are toughter. Also Fiat had a very bad reputation in the US and they knew that they cannot afford broken gearboxes like they get away with in Europe.
If that were the sole reason we'd get the same conventional torque convertor boxes over here.

It would have been far cheaper for FIAT to adapt T/C boxes rather than develop selespeed/dualogic boxes.

I suspect the reason for not having dualogic in the states is also a little more complicated- yes, the americans would kick up a royal stink about reliability (although it's important to note that, generally, the dualogic in the 500 appears to have been fairly reliable with only a few failures cropping up now) but I suspect they wouldn't take well to the driving style of a roboticised manual (bear in mind the lions share of cars are T/C autos over there) and, as 44sunsets says, efficiency isn't such a large concern over there.

However, once again I appear to be dragging a topic off topic.
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Last edited by zanes; 15-05-2015 at 15:29.
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Old 15-05-2015   #37
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Quote Originally Posted by zanes View Post
If that were the sole reason we'd get the same conventional torque convertor boxes over here.

It would have been far cheaper for FIAT to adapt T/C boxes rather than develop selespeed/dualogic boxes.

I suspect the reason for not having dualogic in the states is also a little more complicated- yes, the americans would kick up a royal stink about reliability (although it's important to note that, generally, the dualogic in the 500 appears to have been fairly reliable with only a few failures cropping up now) but I suspect they wouldn't take well to the driving style of a roboticised manual (bear in mind the lions share of cars are T/C autos over there) and, as 44sunsets says, efficiency isn't such a large concern over there.

However, once again I appear to be dragging a topic off topic.
not true. Fiat developed the selespeed gearbox originally for the Ferrari 355 F1 in like 1995 or so , to show F1 technology in their supercars. And after that they just trickled it on down to cheaper Alfas and Fiats, while barely spending any money on development in the mean time.

So the 2015 Fiat 500 Dualogic has essentially the 1995 Ferrari 355 F1 system. 20 year old technology with barely any development.
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Old 15-05-2015   #38
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Today's final update....l

Several phone calls later again today I finally get a call from case manager at "customer services"....they had spoken to my dealer to get part codes & prices, which dealer had previously done..... which included £900 for parts....

Fiat stated the prices were incorrect as the part alone is now........£2000 ....

Very helpful guy at dealer (Olly @ BA Marson) rang & said no way Jose....politely.....

Spoke to a very helpful Justin Westnedge who had recieved the above email & took my concerns seriously adding he had forwarded it to Fiat HQ in Italy.

I so appreciate that the car is out of warranty but would like them to at least acknowledge the fault & reliability of their product as a consquence...

Meanwhile...am now on the brink of patch & get rid ......Ciao Fiat!
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Last edited by sem973; 15-05-2015 at 18:53.
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Old 15-05-2015   #39
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Quote Originally Posted by sem973 View Post
Today's final update....l

Several phone calls later again today I finally get a call from case manager at "customer services"....they had spoken to my dealer to get part codes & prices, which dealer had previously done..... which included £900 for parts....

Fiat stated the prices were incorrect as the part alone is now........£2000 ....

Very helpful guy at dealer (Olly @ BA Marson) rang & said no way Jose....politely.....

Spoke to a very helpful Justin Westnedge who had recieved the above email & took my concerns seriously adding he had forwarded it to Fiat HQ in Italy.

I so appreciate that the car is out of warranty but would like them to at least acknowledge the fault & reliability of their product as a consquence...

Meanwhile...am now on the brink of patch & get rid ......Ciao Fiat!
2000 GBP!? Crazy. Did you ask them what parts are costing that much? Don't tell me they are replacing the dualogic + the ecu of the dualogic?
Something sounds very wrong as the actuator is much less than 2000 pounds.
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Last edited by ahmett; 15-05-2015 at 20:57.
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Old 16-05-2015   #40
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Quote Originally Posted by zanes View Post
but I suspect they wouldn't take well to the driving style of a roboticised manual (bear in mind the lions share of cars are T/C autos over there) and, as 44sunsets says, efficiency isn't such a large concern over there.
I think Fiat are actually on the record with this as the reason for fitting an Aisin to the NAFTA cars. The new model is supposed to standardize the 500 worldwide so it will be interesting to see what 'auto' the Euros get.
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Old 25-05-2015   #41
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Hi All

Well a week away in the sun & return to an update!.....and a result!.....

Certainly a drop from the £2000 + fitting orginally quoted!......

Dear Mrs ..........

I have completed my enquiries into your concern.

I would like to begin by apologising to you for the level of customer service you have recently encountered from my colleagues. This isn’t the level of service we expect to offer and, reading your comments, it certainly seems to be unacceptable, for which I apologise. You originally contacted our Managing Director, Mr Steve Zanlunghi, so he is aware of your dissatisfaction.

I turn now to your disappointment with the repair you have recently had carried out on your car, only for it to go wrong again. I see that your disappointment is made all the worse because your car, although 2 years out of the warranty period, is of low mileage and has a full service history.

As the manufacturer, we make every attempt to ensure the reliability and durability of all the components and we offer a three year manufacturer’s warranty should any part fail during this period. Outside of the warranty period and, as vehicles age, repairs will be required. However, when a vehicle is outside of the warranty period, and wherever possible, we endeavour to support our customers on a goodwill basis. Nevertheless, any such requests must meet certain criteria in order for us to be able to assist. These include, but are not limited to, the age of the vehicle (a vehicle must generally be under 4 years old), ownership of the vehicle from new, mileage and the vehicles’ service history within our network of authorised Fiat dealers.

I am prepared to extend our parameters and consider your car and I am therefore pleased to confirm we can offer you the replacement part for £457.63. There will be a charge for the fitting of this part, of £157.20. This brings the total cost to you to £614.83. The new part will come with a 24 month warranty.

Should you wish to proceed with the repair at the reduced cost, please do let me know and I will arrange for the part to be ordered and sent to the dealer directly.

I do hope my response has gone some way to restore your faith in the Fiat brand.

Kind regards


Parts and Services – Directors’ Office

On behalf of Fiat Chrysler Automobiles UK Ltd.
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Old 25-05-2015   #42
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Quote Originally Posted by sem973 View Post
Hi All

Well a week away in the sun & return to an update!.....and a result!.....

Certainly a drop from the £2000 + fitting orginally quoted!......

Dear Mrs ..........

I have completed my enquiries into your concern.

I would like to begin by apologising to you for the level of customer service you have recently encountered from my colleagues. This isn’t the level of service we expect to offer and, reading your comments, it certainly seems to be unacceptable, for which I apologise. You originally contacted our Managing Director, Mr Steve Zanlunghi, so he is aware of your dissatisfaction.

I turn now to your disappointment with the repair you have recently had carried out on your car, only for it to go wrong again. I see that your disappointment is made all the worse because your car, although 2 years out of the warranty period, is of low mileage and has a full service history.

As the manufacturer, we make every attempt to ensure the reliability and durability of all the components and we offer a three year manufacturer’s warranty should any part fail during this period. Outside of the warranty period and, as vehicles age, repairs will be required. However, when a vehicle is outside of the warranty period, and wherever possible, we endeavour to support our customers on a goodwill basis. Nevertheless, any such requests must meet certain criteria in order for us to be able to assist. These include, but are not limited to, the age of the vehicle (a vehicle must generally be under 4 years old), ownership of the vehicle from new, mileage and the vehicles’ service history within our network of authorised Fiat dealers.

I am prepared to extend our parameters and consider your car and I am therefore pleased to confirm we can offer you the replacement part for £457.63. There will be a charge for the fitting of this part, of £157.20. This brings the total cost to you to £614.83. The new part will come with a 24 month warranty.

Should you wish to proceed with the repair at the reduced cost, please do let me know and I will arrange for the part to be ordered and sent to the dealer directly.

I do hope my response has gone some way to restore your faith in the Fiat brand.

Kind regards


Parts and Services – Directors’ Office

On behalf of Fiat Chrysler Automobiles UK Ltd.
Great news
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Old 25-05-2015   #43
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Quote Originally Posted by UFI View Post
I think Fiat are actually on the record with this as the reason for fitting an Aisin to the NAFTA cars. The new model is supposed to standardize the 500 worldwide so it will be interesting to see what 'auto' the Euros get.
i think the new DCT gearbox. it would be about time.
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Old 25-05-2015   #44
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Quote Originally Posted by sem973 View Post
Hi All

Well a week away in the sun & return to an update!.....and a result!.....

Certainly a drop from the £2000 + fitting orginally quoted!......

Dear Mrs ..........

I have completed my enquiries into your concern.

I would like to begin by apologising to you for the level of customer service you have recently encountered from my colleagues. This isn’t the level of service we expect to offer and, reading your comments, it certainly seems to be unacceptable, for which I apologise. You originally contacted our Managing Director, Mr Steve Zanlunghi, so he is aware of your dissatisfaction.

I turn now to your disappointment with the repair you have recently had carried out on your car, only for it to go wrong again. I see that your disappointment is made all the worse because your car, although 2 years out of the warranty period, is of low mileage and has a full service history.

As the manufacturer, we make every attempt to ensure the reliability and durability of all the components and we offer a three year manufacturer’s warranty should any part fail during this period. Outside of the warranty period and, as vehicles age, repairs will be required. However, when a vehicle is outside of the warranty period, and wherever possible, we endeavour to support our customers on a goodwill basis. Nevertheless, any such requests must meet certain criteria in order for us to be able to assist. These include, but are not limited to, the age of the vehicle (a vehicle must generally be under 4 years old), ownership of the vehicle from new, mileage and the vehicles’ service history within our network of authorised Fiat dealers.

I am prepared to extend our parameters and consider your car and I am therefore pleased to confirm we can offer you the replacement part for £457.63. There will be a charge for the fitting of this part, of £157.20. This brings the total cost to you to £614.83. The new part will come with a 24 month warranty.

Should you wish to proceed with the repair at the reduced cost, please do let me know and I will arrange for the part to be ordered and sent to the dealer directly.

I do hope my response has gone some way to restore your faith in the Fiat brand.

Kind regards


Parts and Services – Directors’ Office

On behalf of Fiat Chrysler Automobiles UK Ltd.
good job it worked. get it done, keep the car for 24 months and then sell it on = )
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Old 26-05-2015   #45
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Re: Dualogic gearbox nightmare......

Quote Originally Posted by sem973 View Post
Hi All

Well a week away in the sun & return to an update!.....and a result!.....

Certainly a drop from the £2000 + fitting orginally quoted!......

Dear Mrs ..........

I have completed my enquiries into your concern.

I would like to begin by apologising to you for the level of customer service you have recently encountered from my colleagues. This isn’t the level of service we expect to offer and, reading your comments, it certainly seems to be unacceptable, for which I apologise. You originally contacted our Managing Director, Mr Steve Zanlunghi, so he is aware of your dissatisfaction.

I turn now to your disappointment with the repair you have recently had carried out on your car, only for it to go wrong again. I see that your disappointment is made all the worse because your car, although 2 years out of the warranty period, is of low mileage and has a full service history.

As the manufacturer, we make every attempt to ensure the reliability and durability of all the components and we offer a three year manufacturer’s warranty should any part fail during this period. Outside of the warranty period and, as vehicles age, repairs will be required. However, when a vehicle is outside of the warranty period, and wherever possible, we endeavour to support our customers on a goodwill basis. Nevertheless, any such requests must meet certain criteria in order for us to be able to assist. These include, but are not limited to, the age of the vehicle (a vehicle must generally be under 4 years old), ownership of the vehicle from new, mileage and the vehicles’ service history within our network of authorised Fiat dealers.

I am prepared to extend our parameters and consider your car and I am therefore pleased to confirm we can offer you the replacement part for £457.63. There will be a charge for the fitting of this part, of £157.20. This brings the total cost to you to £614.83. The new part will come with a 24 month warranty.

Should you wish to proceed with the repair at the reduced cost, please do let me know and I will arrange for the part to be ordered and sent to the dealer directly.

I do hope my response has gone some way to restore your faith in the Fiat brand.

Kind regards


Parts and Services – Directors’ Office

On behalf of Fiat Chrysler Automobiles UK Ltd.

That's a good result, and an excellent email both from you to Fiat and from Fiat in return.

Short of paying for the whole lot, you can't really ask for more than what Fiat have offered. Their customer service centre needs some proper structure putting into it so that people don't have to go to such lengths to get anywhere, but ultimately if you persist with Fiat and don't lose your rag, they usually end up being ok.

I had similar good service a few years ago with a Fiat Stilo which I had a problem with. In recent years I've found them more like pulling teeth. Whilst I didn't escalate the issue with my own car to the Directors Office, we have made contact with them regarding my Sisters car, which has had numerous faults and interestingly meets most of their criteria for assistance, yet have got nowhere with the response from a person in 'Parts and Services - Directors Office', so I think you've done well!
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