It all depends on the deal you can strike, and how much you interest you can earn on your deposit.

Here's an example.
http://www.perrys.co.uk/fiat-500-0.9-twinair-3-door/new-and-delivery-mileage/offer-188169-12180

I was looking at a twinair, used price best I could squeeze them down to was £9500. this was an 11 reg car in red registered August 2011, 1400 miles demo car.

Perrys will sell you a new one for £10,745 Nearly £1k off list.

minus £500 deposit contribution, £10245.
Then, if you play with the i-deal finance terms you can almost get it down to zero percent. I am paying £23 interest over 33 months on my particular deal.

So put your £10,000 into a high interest account, Halifax are offering 4%AER
So for a basic rate tax payer your £10k will be worth £10,904 in 33 months supposing you don't withdraw anything or deposit any more.

So take the £904 off the purchase price = £9341.

So for me, I would save £150 buying a new car over a used one.

This all depends on if you are happy to make the monthly payments of approx £180 (don't have time now to do the full calculation) and you will still have a £4k balloon after the 33 month term. So what though??

The only other thing you will have to pay which is money for nothing rip off fee, is the "option to purchase" to fee of £290 if you decide to keep the car instead of handing it back.

If you used your own money to pay for the car, and then deposited £180 a month into the same Halifax account, you would earn £300 in interest over the same 33 months.


Now if you need finance on your used Fiat 500, if the car is £10,000, you can add around £1500 in interest over 3 years, making total payment for that car £11,500.

As I said, it all depends on your personal circumstances, but I think anyone who has a large amount of cash in the bank is much better off leaving it there and taking the (nearly) free finance on offer, having a new car with full warranty, 1 years tax, non used tyres, maximum time until next service etc. Also the car will be worth that much more re-sale.

At the moment, used 500's are fetching very strong prices. If they were 30-40% cheaper than new at a year old, I'd probably go for used too.

I have to say, I agree with the posters who are saying the best deals to be had are those new on finance. I had the money in the bank for my twinair, but got it on finance as I end up paying less than the list price over three years.

A quick look seems that the same is still true for a 1.2 on i-deal.

Take into account inflation at 3.5% per year and you could bank the money you have and earn an albeit modest rate of interst and you win all round.

I've just bought a new 1.2 pop. I looked at all the dealers within a 50 mile radius, the two biggest second hand car web-sites and local papers. 2nd hand values were way way too close to new (pre-registered) prices for me to consider 2nd hand. As much as I didn't want a new car, I certainly didn't want to pay nearly new prices for 2nd hand either. Whatever you decide to do... Good luck!

tombb said:

...never been a fan of getting anything on finance, always been the frame of mind of getting what you can afford.

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jrkitching said:

The value of these deals to the customer obviously depends very much on their personal circumstances, and I appreciate that for many folks it could be significant.

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For the OP with a budget of £7-8K for a secondhand 500 his girlfriend has the option of dumping the car in a few months or in a year or 2 if the car doesn't suit her needs. Roping someone into a 3 year commitment for a car that they may not necessarily want in time does not make any sense.

Thinking of 'what's good for the goose is good for the gander' for those who are on 2009 cars on PCP that are now going in for the 'swop' - guys like the OP create a market for your secondhand cars and keep the flow of old for new.

Buying privately has its pitfalls but generally you can knock £1K off the price of what's advertised. At least that would cover half the cost of new exhaust, tyres, brakes and a bit of service on a 3-4 year old model.

There have been one or 2 threads from young people on here who opted for a Finance based 500 - couldn't resist the options and ended up with monthly payments of c.£225 when all they could afford was £150. They couldn't get out of the contracts unless someone else took them over.

I dont know if things are different in ireland, but in the UK You can always terminate your pcp deal at may time you like.
You don't have to go full term.
Just pay off the balance. There is no penalty.

Here's an idea. Get the cheapest deal on a new car, take the I-deal pcp with £500 contribution at nearly 0% interest. Then settle with your cash in the bank
the following month.

Hardly worth it because of the £290 option to purchase fee, but still save £200 over the best cash price.

But you are right LH. We need people buying used to keep the values up on our motors.

Yes, sometimes second hand prices are ludicrous. When we were buying our Volvo XC90 there was a very good deal to be had through an online broker (with almost 10K off the list price!!) Conversely that made the 2 year old examples almost the same price. We weren't in the market for a new car but it was stupid to refuse the new car/tyres/ warranty/ 3 year free servicing for the sake of £500! Pays to shop around...

deeyup said:

We need people buying used to keep the values up on our motors.

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This statement, whilst undoubtedly true, relies on most of the elements of a Ponzi scheme.

One reason why residuals are so high is because FIAT has increased new car prices mercilessly since launch & kept up sales by building large discounts into the finance scheme whilst denying those same discounts to cash customers. Without the car's exceptional popularity, it's highly unlikely they'd have been able to do this.

There is a limit to how long this can continue & I'd say we're now close to reaching it. It only needs FIAT to start offering serious cash discounts on the car & residuals will fall through the floor.

Folks who've bought new on a pcp always have the option of limiting their losses by returning the car, but those who've bought used for top money could be left with a car that's worth very little in 3 years time.

jrkitching said:

Folks who've bought new on a pcp always have the option of limiting their losses by returning the car, but those who've bought used for top money could be left with a car that's worth very little in 3 years time.

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It could be worse though. I bought my Marea a week before it's 3rd birthday for a shade under 5 grand from a main franchise dealer. Pity the poor sod who bought it new with options rrp at 18 grand.

jrkitching said:

This statement, whilst undoubtedly true, relies on most of the elements of a Ponzi scheme.

One reason why residuals are so high is because FIAT has increased new car prices mercilessly since launch & kept up sales by building large discounts into the finance scheme whilst denying those same discounts to cash customers. Without the car's exceptional popularity, it's highly unlikely they'd have been able to do this.

There is a limit to how long this can continue & I'd say we're now close to reaching it. It only needs FIAT to start offering serious cash discounts on the car & residuals will fall through the floor.

Folks who've bought new on a pcp always have the option of limiting their losses by returning the car, but those who've bought used for top money could be left with a car that's worth very little in 3 years time.

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There's a simple answer to that 'problem'. Don't buy a new car that you don't expect to keep after 3 years. I've always been of the opinion that if you want to chop and change, you're better off not buying new in most cases.

deeyup said:

I dont know if things are different in ireland...

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We haven't got the i-deal here. Nearest to it is a Hire Purchase arrangement at 5.9% APR and even that offer may have expired. Never a fan of HP agreements but it can work for a business as an 'off the balance sheet' arrangement.

I had a quick look on your uk autotrader. A '08 clean looking 1.2 Sport in Black with 26K that could be got for less than £6K with the Sport alloys. On pistonheads there was nice spec '09 1.2 Sport BNW with 16s & glass roof with 10K that could be got for £7K with a 1 year Fiat secondhand approved warranty. With over 2,000 500 for sale on autotrader someone is going to 'break ranks' with a reduction in prices so that stock can be shifted. E-bay has a number of cars on going and if you pick your moment you can do well. There is nothing like that choice over here. But I can see what some are buying new and making the most of the 0% i-deals on offer.

I dont know how much they are selling but it seems that the Fiat 500 is selling decently from the amount i see on the road and the amount of people on this forum.

What does everyone think?


its a bit like the mini, mini 2nd values are still high and its been 10 years its been out!

frupi said:

I have to say, I don't agree that buying a used 500 can be a poor deal. I know other forum members are aware from my previous posts, but my Wife and I did buy a 6 month old 1.2 POP A/C B&M ex Fiat fleet car (fully traceable and genuine) with only 821 miles on the clock for £7499 cash.

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Noticed on the FF that some individuals managed to secure a new Lounge 1.2 (around the time of the scrappage prices) for £8.5K (could have been the exception). If one was buying a new 'more expensive' car a justification is that your line of work requires a new reliable car and a car allowance in some cases is provided to help towards the costs.

The i-deal figures on this thread were very useful and surpassed previous threads on the FF. I found the following links informative and put the i-deal option for me into context...
http://www.dealdrivers.co.uk/html/financedrivers.html
http://www.moneysupermarket.com/community/forums/t/pcp-good-deal-or-not-6932.aspx

A mate of mine got a chunky allowance car allowance and splashed out on a new 'normal' car. He is now looking to shift it on but looking at his 'losses' he's now looking to give it to the OH for the school run. Stil he has no real regrets since a new up-to-date car in Corporate carpark looked the part.

For me personally I struggled on getting the spec right on my first 500 and now having had 2 I've a good idea what I would spec if I was buying another. Buying secondhand initially has it benefits so that you know what's worth getting the next time around.

One poster on another forum bought a brand new A500. After 2 weeks realised that it wasn't for him. After working out the losses he was looking at a 'hit' of 30-35% of the purchase cost since the VAT element is 20%.

I've made one commitment that's life long but when it comes to cars I put them in the following category...
https://www.fiatforum.com/500/280742-saucy-hot-wild-thats-amore.html

loveshandbags said:

Noticed on the FF that some individuals managed to secure a new Lounge 1.2 (around the time of the scrappage prices) for £8.5K

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and struggled to justify paying that much, given that I bought a new Panda Dynamic Eco about 6 months later (after scrappage had ended) for £6.5K. That Panda has a spec roughly equivalent to a 500 Pop with A/C, so IMO 'worth' about £1K less than a 1.2 lounge but a cool £2K cheaper, even after taking into account the scrappage I got on the 500.

Strong residuals mean scrappage buyers could trade in now for an amusingly low paper depreciation - but the ending of £2K discounts combined with some hefty price hikes mean that the changeover cost isn't so funny.

I'll be keeping mine awhile yet . It's only just about run in!

Wow thanks for all the comments, my mind is now completely boggled.

however after thinking about it for a while, think i am going to look at buying new, and will either bump up the cash we have to spend on it or go down the pcp route.

Reason behind thisis that my other half will be looking to keep it for a long time rather than trading it in a few years, so for peace of mind, warranties etc new is probably the best option.

hopefully should be able to get a bit of money off the list price through work though

tombb said:

Wow thanks for all the comments, my mind is now completely boggled.

however after thinking about it for a while, think i am going to look at buying new, and will either bump up the cash we have to spend on it or go down the pcp route.

Reason behind thisis that my other half will be looking to keep it for a long time rather than trading it in a few years, so for peace of mind, warranties etc new is probably the best option.

hopefully should be able to get a bit of money off the list price through work though

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I respect your decision. Buying a car new or second hand, can often be an absolute battle of choices.

We chose to buy our 500 second hand for the reasons already posted, but we also knew we were buying to keep for several years and a cash buy was the best option for us. Buying a six month old almost new vehicle not only saved us a lot of money from the main dealer price (about £2000 I believe), but it still had 2 and a half years of warranty left and six months full AA cover which has obviously now expired (now with RAC at £58 for Roadside/Recovery/At Home - done on Tesco vouchers!)

Like I said previously, consider looking afar, you may just find an absolute bargain. I'm not the only one who got thousands off a car, my cousin found a brand new Ignis for a couple of grand less at a dealer in Fife I believe and he travelled up from Portsmouth to get it. When I bought my Cadillac, I did a 650 mile round trip in a day (one way car hire there with fuel, 100 quid, dealer filled my Caddy tank for the return trip for free coz I'd travelled so far!) and I saved 10 grand on the list price.

Be lucky!

Don't forget the 3rd year of fiat warranty covers almost nothing..You really only get a 2 year warranty with a new fiat.

RUI said:

Don't forget the 3rd year of fiat warranty covers almost nothing..You really only get a 2 year warranty with a new fiat.

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To be fair, for 27 quid (a meal and a couple of pints at my local Indian restaurant), I couldn't car less if it doesn't cover much. It'll cover something and if that 'something' fails in the third year and it is covered and costs a great deal more than 27 quid, then it'll be worth it.

frupi said:

To be fair, for 27 quid (a meal and a couple of pints at my local Indian restaurant), I couldn't car less if it doesn't cover much. It'll cover something and if that 'something' fails in the third year and it is covered and costs a great deal more than 27 quid, then it'll be worth it.

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Speaking as a man who has replaced almost every component one could reasonably (and unreasonably) consider a 'serviceable' item I can assure you, nothing that you'd want to make a warranty claim on costs less than £27.

I've read through all the posts in this thread - very interesting. I couldn't decide whose post to quote, but jrkitching has a particularly thoughtful point about the Ponzi scheme.

A similar situation exists here in NZ with used 500s commanding relatively high prices, and the variations in specification and equipment cause me some frustration.

Ideally I'd like to buy a Bossa Nova White 500 in Lounge spec, doesn't matter which engine but Dualogic transmission would be great (I love my Selespeed 156). Dualogic is rare in NZ (one out of 15 500s that I've found).

The 1.2 and 1.3JTD engines are also rare in NZ (again, 1/15 and 1/15) - most 500s are 1.4 (not Multiair) and the Twinair isn't here at all.

There is a special deal on two new 1.4 Sport 500s at $23990 ($1 = 51p, so that's about £12000.) The colour choice is black or grey, with black interior.

The base price of a new 500 Lounge (none in stock) is $26990 (£13500) or $29940 for the Dualogic. The 500C is $29990. The Pop is not available and not priced, and the Abarth is $42990 (Tributo Ferrari is $79990 - surely they are having a laugh.) Interestingly there are no other FIAT models available new in NZ.

So, second-hand I have found a 2008 500 Pop in Bossa Nova White (the only one) with the ivory/red interior - great! The car is at a generic European car dealer (not the FIAT dealer). The spec includes the chrome wing mirrors and bumper strips, multispoke alloy wheels, Blue and Me with steering wheel controls, 1.4 engine with 6-spd gearbox - but not the fixed glass roof I was hoping for as it's a Pop and not Lounge. Oh well - this car gets closer to my desired spec than any other I've found, since the most common 500 is the Sport model and the most common colour is silver.

Now what I need help with is the price. The asking price is $20000 (£10000) for this 2008 car which has 48,000km (29,832 miles) on the clock. This price is actually at the cheaper end of the 500s offered second-hand - most (Sport) are $23000, which is very funny now that those two new examples are available at essentially the same price give or take.

So, by buying used I'm getting closer to the spec I wanted and saving 4000 compared to the new price. But the depreciation so far has been very little (less than 8% per year). Something doesn't seem right here. I'm used to the levels of depreciation seen on Alfa Romeo 156s and 166s - more like 25% per year.

I suppose the way to look at this is to ignore the new 500s on offer and consider the true new price to be $26990, assuming it would be possible to order a new car in a particular colour and have it arrive whenever the next shipment of cars arrives (in NZ, new cars are usually sold from the FIAT dealer's showroom rather than as 'special orders'). There are actually three FIAT dealers, one in each of the main cities, I live in the fourth-largest city so the nearest is only a 90-minute drive away...

Well, I don't know what to do, but I suspect the right thing to do is to haggle the price down on that 2008 car by pointing to the new 500s and pretending the colour etc. is unimportant. Unfortunately for me, the 2008 Pop has only just been listed and is likely to sell quickly. At least being only four years old it does look like a new car - no salt on the roads here, so brakes and exhaust like new.

Hmmm... My 156 is worth $6000-$8000 in a private sale, so at least I can also assess what is offered for it as a trade-in. My insurance company thinks the market value on a 2003 156 is $17500 - hopefully the dealer might have a similar high estimate

Cheers,
-Alex

alexGS said:

Ideally I'd like to buy a Bossa Nova White 500 in Lounge spec, doesn't matter which engine but Dualogic transmission would be great (I love my Selespeed 156). Dualogic is rare in NZ (one out of 15 500s that I've found).
...
There is a special deal on two new 1.4 Sport 500s at $23990 ($1 = 51p, so that's about £12000.) The colour choice is black or grey, with black interior.

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Seeing that ideally you'd like a BNW Lounge and are not too pushed about which gearbox the now discountinued Black Sport IMHO is also a very attractive option. Since prices for new & old are quite close I would be tempted to go new and see if you can negotiate a discount for yourself. Not having a roof is no big deal and gives more headroom - ideal for rugger bugger mates. As mentioned previously the 6 speed manual gearbox suits the 1.4 best and keeps the engine on the boil making the most of the performance it has to offer. Spec of the Sport with B&Me, A/C,cetc. makes it much a better daily proposition than a Pop.