General Jay Leno's Garage - Fiat 500 Piece

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General Jay Leno's Garage - Fiat 500 Piece

I'm afraid that I was rather disappointed with this piece, especially given Jay Leno's reputation.

For me it came across as an "advertorial" - like one of those awful reviews you see in a free newspaper where the producer of the product in question has clearly paid to have his produict reviewed.

I also agree with Maxi about the engineer. He looked like a stooge to me: "Hey, find me an American who I can say designed this car - we don't wanna say some Eytalian made it!"

Frankly I gave up after a few minutes.
There is a strong vein of mechanics in Leno's blood and you can see that with the overall package he is constructed via the website, albeit done by NBC (and for that reason advertorial), but its a great outlet for the masses where he talks history, the package and the test drive through a barren and dull environment.

Problem is we have got used to excellent reviews in UK, Top Gear being the big daddy (I heard 1billion viewers mentioned somewhere), however I cringe when TG destroy a new car with words, but you know what the industry knows if they send a car for review then they must pay the price.

Back to Leno, a good site that needs patience to watch whilst sipping a dull beer like Miller lite :)
 
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There is a strong vein of mechanics in Leno's blood and you can see that with the overall package he is constructed via the website, albeit done by NBC (and for that reason advertorial), but its a great outlet for the masses where he talks history, the package and the test drive through a barren and dull environment.

Problem is we have got used to excellent reviews in UK, Top Gear being the big daddy (I heard 1billion viewers mentioned somewhere), however I cringe when TG destroy a new car with words, but you know what the industry knows if they send a car for review then they must pay the price.

Back to Leno, a good site that needs patience to watch whilst sipping a dull beer like Miller lite :)

There's a lot of truth in what you're saying. For an anorak TG has turned into a side show where the actual content on the car is minusclued. The lack in sincerity of one presenter is compensated by the trio and the jostling. So it can be hard to slag of anyone individual what with the batter and Captain Slow being the but of a lot of the 'jokes'. Some similarities to X-Factor (which I have long stopped watching) where the show is about the 'judges'.
So when we have a review which has some real content it can be a bit boring like going to a Grand Prix where there are no mishaps. At the point about destroying a car in a few words - there's room for another Fifth gear and I would be a Vicki fan who is genuinely into her cars. I just hope for the guy who has quoted TG on his new TA Plus that he doesn't end up have to scrape the words of his dash.
 
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Not sure about filth gear, its too motoring and lacks the fun factor of TG. Being a visual person I am in awe with the background work BBC put into making and organising the reviews especially the soundtracks and cinematography and that only a small team working in a cardboard box in Guildford.

Not related but its a shame BBC is only covering 10 F1s next year, they had got the right team in place with excellent pre-race analysis & commentary. I refuse to give money to Sky. http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/sporteditors/2011/07/f1_coverage_to_be_shared_betwe.html
 
Not sure about filth gear, its too motoring and lacks the fun factor of TG. Being a visual person I am in awe with the background work BBC put into making and organising the reviews especially the soundtracks and cinematography and that only a small team working in a cardboard box in Guildford.
:yeahthat:

I do like TG but I'm not hanging on to every word that comes out of JC and it looks like he might be in for a spot of bother.

This thread would be an example of Vicki in Fifth gear reviewing the best hot hatch - my OH wouldn't sit through it.:eek:

This youtube (will probably get the axe on copyright breech shortly) is 16 minutes (6+10) long taken from an hour's coverage. My OH was mildly interested but still watched something else in the other room. Most of you would have already seen this - but for those who missed it...


 
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They probably went for a 5 speed box because the multiair engine is more torquey. The more gears in a box the less efficient the car is.

You could clearly see the engineer didn't really feel a great sense of ownership tbh.

FIAT answered this is a US car magazine. The went with the 5-speed manual because the 6-speed manual available doesn't fit. There are structural elements that don't provide enough clearance for the 6-speed. I'm really hoping that they figure out some workaround for before they roll out the US Abarth next year.
 
FIAT answered this is a US car magazine. The went with the 5-speed manual because the 6-speed manual available doesn't fit. There are structural elements that don't provide enough clearance for the 6-speed. I'm really hoping that they figure out some workaround for before they roll out the US Abarth next year.

One problem with the 6 speed in the European model is an increase in the turning circle. When they fitted the 6 speed in the Abarth Assetto corse because it's a bigger gearbox ( & has to be tougher to take the extra power) the turning circle was even worse and it had no air conditioning unit fitted. It was felt that the 5 speed was all that was needed in the 'ordinary' A500 given the torque of the turbo. The 6 speed that is fitted to the Punto Evo Multi-air has come in for criticism.
Can you remember which US car magazine quoted Fiat's reason ?
They fitted the 6 speed in the Automatic and it fitted.
Plus - I really don't understand why Fiat (US) are keeping the bhp output of the 2012 A500 a big secret - I noticed in the JL video clip that Joe Grace didn't answer the question that was put to him by JL.
 
The us abarth will be 170bhp.
 
The us abarth will be 170bhp.

http://www.fiat500usa.com/2010/01/us-fiat-500-abarthhow-much-horsepower.html

Get the impression that the SS model will probably give that but I can't see the standard Abarth 500 being sold with that. The esseesse model is only able to give the 160bhp on the tiny turbo with 6K miles oil changes and a lowered suspension. It's unlikely that the US model with more suspension travel would be as sure footed as the Euro model. I reckon given the price point and the competition with the Cooper S, etc. it has to be seen to be competing with them. I would guess that it will have 145-150bhp since the Multi-air in turbo charged form (20% more efficient that standard) gives 10-15 more bhp than the standard 135bhp. The US have a 4 year and 50K mile warranty so it 'has to last'.
 
One problem with the 6 speed in the European model is an increase in the turning circle. When they fitted the 6 speed in the Abarth Assetto corse because it's a bigger gearbox ( & has to be tougher to take the extra power) the turning circle was even worse and it had no air conditioning unit fitted. It was felt that the 5 speed was all that was needed in the 'ordinary' A500 given the torque of the turbo. The 6 speed that is fitted to the Punto Evo Multi-air has come in for criticism.
Can you remember which US car magazine quoted Fiat's reason ?
They fitted the 6 speed in the Automatic and it fitted.
Plus - I really don't understand why Fiat (US) are keeping the bhp output of the 2012 A500 a big secret - I noticed in the JL video clip that Joe Grace didn't answer the question that was put to him by JL.


Hi loveshandbags,

The 6 speed doesn't fit because of the third load path in the North American cars:

Fiat500USA-Pullout_Dec2010%252520090.jpg


Michael Vincent and Joe Grace explained that to me during a lunchtime chat I had with them back in January, so it is true. Now what is in store for the NA Abarth, we'll have to wait and see;)

You can see more pics like the above here: Fiat 500: Beauty inside and outside.
 
... Plus - I really don't understand why Fiat (US) are keeping the bhp output of the 2012 A500 a big secret - I noticed in the JL video clip that Joe Grace didn't answer the question that was put to him by JL.

They aren't going to let the cat out of the bag until the timing is right. It is their style, a little frustrating, but good for building excitement and anticipation.

I'm working on it, though;)
 
Hi loveshandbags,

The 6 speed doesn't fit because of the third load path in the North American cars:

Michael Vincent and Joe Grace explained that to me during a lunchtime chat I had with them back in January, so it is true. Now what is in store for the NA Abarth, we'll have to wait and see;)

You can see more pics like the above here: Fiat 500: Beauty inside and outside.

Thanks for the 'inside track' on the reason for the 5 speed on the US model. Looking at the video clip on the crash test I was surprised to see that the 500 could meet a 6 star standard if it existed. Do you know if they have increased the child occupancy rating from 3 star on the US models - noticed the simulation test with the 'young ones' in the back ?

They aren't going to let the cat out of the bag until the timing is right. It is their style, a little frustrating, but good for building excitement and anticipation.

I'm working on it, though;)

I reckon if you were a 'fly on the wall' at that lunch hour meet you'd know the answer to that.;)
 
Just as long as a real manual is available in the NA Abarth, I will be content. Power can be increased if needed, the transmission is for the life of the auto. If the NA Abarth shows up with just a dual-clutch auto (or even worse an auto-manual), they can keep it. A sports car should have a clutch..... one that is controlled by a left foot.

At least mine do.:D
 
Thanks for the 'inside track' on the reason for the 5 speed on the US model. Looking at the video clip on the crash test I was surprised to see that the 500 could meet a 6 star standard if it existed. Do you know if they have increased the child occupancy rating from 3 star on the US models - noticed the simulation test with the 'young ones' in the back ?



I reckon if you were a 'fly on the wall' at that lunch hour meet you'd know the answer to that.;)


Tough video clip to watch. Currently, there are no plans to test the Fiat 500 by the NHTSA, so we'll have to wait on that. However, with all the strengthening of the passenger compartment, I'm optimistic that the 500 will do as well, if not better than the previous version. Europe will soon have an updated 500, so with luck, we may see a Euro NCAP test on that.
 
Just as long as a real manual is available in the NA Abarth, I will be content. Power can be increased if needed, the transmission is for the life of the auto. If the NA Abarth shows up with just a dual-clutch auto (or even worse an auto-manual), they can keep it. A sports car should have a clutch..... one that is controlled by a left foot.

At least mine do.:D

Looking at the Mito in DCT (DSG) it only comes in 135bhp Multi-air form which is the same as the Punto Sporting. In the Mito the higher output form of 170bhp is only a manual. Looking at the older variants of 120 & 155 in the FIRE engine the 155 came with hotter cams and slightly more boost.
My hunch is that the standard US A500 will only come initially with a Manual (5 speed is fine and suits the small turbo). I get the impression that the DCT in the Mito is not rated for the higher output. It is highly unlikely the US will offer the Dualogic (MTA) in the Abarth given the dislike of a similiar type of gearbox in the Smart.
 
Looking at the Mito in DCT (DSG) it only comes in 135bhp Multi-air form which is the same as the Punto Sporting. In the Mito the higher output form of 170bhp is only a manual. Looking at the older variants of 120 & 155 in the FIRE engine the 155 came with hotter cams and slightly more boost.
My hunch is that the standard US A500 will only come initially with a Manual (5 speed is fine and suits the small turbo). I get the impression that the DCT in the Mito is not rated for the higher output. It is highly unlikely the US will offer the Dualogic (MTA) in the Abarth given the dislike of a similiar type of gearbox in the Smart.

Yea, verily, thou doust speaketh the truth. The only reason I see for them waffling on the 5-speed is it will be up against all 6-speed competition. I don't really care, as long as it's a manual. There is talk of a DSG being designed/built in China (!) for the 500. The NA Fiat group will not confirm squat so it's a big guessing game. The current 6-speed torque converter auto is the same one as in the MINI so it should be capable of powering the Abarth, but I'll bet the preponderance of Abarths being sold will be manuals. I wholeheartedly concur that the MTA would be laughed out of the Country. Our environmental laws don't stress Co2 so the type of transmission isn't that important (for the law).

Oh, FIAT500USA knows what's up. he just won't say. But you can take to the bank what he DOES say:worship:

Cheers

Oh,
 
...I get the impression that the DCT in the Mito is not rated for the higher output...
I was incorrect on this. The DCT gearbox used in the Mito is the C635 which can take a high torque figure so in theory it should be possible for it to work in the higher output 170bhp variant.

...as long as it's a manual. There is talk of a DSG being designed/built in China (!) for the 500. The NA Fiat group will not confirm squat so it's a big guessing game. The current 6-speed torque converter auto is the same one as in the MINI so it should be capable of powering the Abarth, but I'll bet the preponderance of Abarths being sold will be manuals...

I have attached a 'roadmap' for the gearboxes for the 'Fiat family' (courtesy of the Abarth forum) so you can draw one's own interpretations from it. If the Euro version 2012 ends up with all the crash protection of the US model I get the feeling that we may not keep the current 6 speed C514 (M6) gearbox in the current Euro 1.4 model.

Looking at the gear ratios in the US 500 on the 5 speed with the revised 'higher' final drive (I have plugged figures into 'the spreadsheet' to compare with the Euro model). The US 500 has very much a 'cruising box' and is of the same 'type' as the Euro being a C514.

The automatic in the US 500 on the other hand being a Aisin does have the capability of taking the 'torque' of a A500 (you were correct on this). For the modders in the US the automatic is the only gearbox that can handle a significant increase in power / torque from e.g. the likes of a supercharger if they can crack the ECU (which so far is still eluding them).

Re the development of a DCT in China - this is probably to avoid having to pay a 3rd party a significant amount of money for their Auto. The 500 is an 'economy' car in comparison to a MINI or a A1. I have seen the A1 in action with a DSG and the car lacked soul that was further 'compounded' by the gearbox. I don't think the DCT suits the character of a A500 so the Manual is the really the only choice as a driver’s car.(y)

Oh, FIAT500USA knows what's up. he just won't say. But you can take to the bank what he DOES say :worship:
I’m not too sure if Fiat500USA is still Chris but it reminds me of ‘The Stig’ – you don’t know who’s under the helmet.:)
 

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Came across this on the US side - a road race corsa intake, some sporty :rolleyes: exhausts. They've put a bit of jis in their videos. Interesting to see what's happening on the other side of the pond.:)

EDIT: Just click the header & you get the 3 videos

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/user/BLUDDBOSS?feature=mhee#p/a/u/0/6vRgYSv5z6E"]BLUDDBOSS's Channel - YouTube[/ame]
 
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