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Old 17-04-2013   #16
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

Quote Originally Posted by loveshandbags View Post
My understanding is that the gearbox on the MJ I is the C154 ? gearbox rated for 150Nm. The standard output of 75bhp and 145Nm is just below what the gearbox was rated for. If you have increased power to 90bhp surely you now way past the tolerances that the gearbox was designed for. Even if you uprate the clutch for the extra power the whole powertrain would still be under stress. Would you not need the uprated C510? gearbox from the multijet II for this 'upgrade' ?
I have a 2008 multijet which would have been the 75bhp model however there was an engine failure after 3 years and just 23,000 miles when the car was owned by the previous keeper. The engine was replaced under warranty and I contacted the dealer who did the change and they confirmed that it was a 95bhp engine that they fitted as the 75bhp was no longer available. As I understand it however the clutch was not uprated nor the powertrain so either I may have issues in the future & they were just doing the absolute minimum or the ratings & tolerances will be fine.
Either way, I guess I should not do any more performance mods - I have a K&N panel filter and a free flowing exhaust already. I am very happy with performance & economy but there's always room for improvement!
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Old 17-04-2013   #17
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

Quote Originally Posted by Lincs500 View Post
I have a 2008 multijet which would have been the 75bhp model however there was an engine failure after 3 years and just 23,000 miles when the car was owned by the previous keeper. The engine was replaced under warranty and I contacted the dealer who did the change and they confirmed that it was a 95bhp engine that they fitted as the 75bhp was no longer available. As I understand it however the clutch was not uprated nor the powertrain so either I may have issues in the future & they were just doing the absolute minimum or the ratings & tolerances will be fine.
Either way, I guess I should not do any more performance mods - I have a K&N panel filter and a free flowing exhaust already. I am very happy with performance & economy but there's always room for improvement!
Does the new engine appear as below? Surely they'd also need to replace the ECU too?

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Old 17-04-2013   #18
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

Not exactly, the engine covers & whatever else they could save from the original engine was used on the new one but yes, the ECU was changed as I believe it is just in the mapping where the extra 20bhp is derived.
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Old 17-04-2013   #19
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

Hardly likely that the difference between the 75 and 90bhp is down to only the ecu.
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Old 17-04-2013   #20
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

Quote Originally Posted by ban1111 View Post
Hardly likely that the difference between the 75 and 90bhp is down to only the ecu.
Almost certainly correct, I'm sure when I had my 75BHP 500 and was looking to change to the 95BHP or a TA I was told that there were a few differences apart from the mapping, Injectors seem to ring a bell.

Of course, if it was a brand new engine, it might have been a full engine complete with all ancillaries, exactly as ready to go straight into a new car.
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Old 17-04-2013   #21
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

Quote Originally Posted by Lincs500 View Post
I have a 2008 multijet which would have been the 75bhp model however there was an engine failure after 3 years and just 23,000 miles when the car was owned by the previous keeper. The engine was replaced under warranty and I contacted the dealer who did the change and they confirmed that it was a 95bhp engine that they fitted as the 75bhp was no longer available. As I understand it however the clutch was not uprated nor the powertrain so either I may have issues in the future & they were just doing the absolute minimum or the ratings & tolerances will be fine.
Either way, I guess I should not do any more performance mods - I have a K&N panel filter and a free flowing exhaust already. I am very happy with performance & economy but there's always room for improvement!
Correction on the gearbox.
C510 for the MJ I
C510R for the MJ II

If you've got the MJ II engine and the drivetrain off the MJ I I would probably keep clear of a tuning box.

Are there any insurance implications with the engine change even though it was done by the dealer ?

Would the more powerful engine justify the bigger brakes ?
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Old 17-04-2013   #22
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

Quote Originally Posted by loveshandbags View Post
Correction on the gearbox.
C510 for the MJ I
C510R for the MJ II

If you've got the MJ II engine and the drivetrain off the MJ I I would probably keep clear of a tuning box.

Are there any insurance implications with the engine change even though it was done by the dealer ?

Would the more powerful engine justify the bigger brakes ?

Thanks for the clarifications & both good questions to which I don't have the answers right now.
Brakes wise, I have just changed the discs & pads and they seem good to me but as for the insurance, that could be a can of worms ...
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Old 17-04-2013   #23
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

Quote Originally Posted by Lincs500 View Post
I have a 2008 multijet which would have been the 75bhp model however there was an engine failure after 3 years and just 23,000 miles when the car was owned by the previous keeper. The engine was replaced under warranty and I contacted the dealer who did the change and they confirmed that it was a 95bhp engine that they fitted as the 75bhp was no longer available. As I understand it however the clutch was not uprated nor the powertrain so either I may have issues in the future & they were just doing the absolute minimum or the ratings & tolerances will be fine.
Either way, I guess I should not do any more performance mods - I have a K&N panel filter and a free flowing exhaust already. I am very happy with performance & economy but there's always room for improvement!

???? i think you have been fed a load of hogwash. Fiat are quite capable of still sending out today a 75bhp rated engine today.
If the garage had fitted a 90 or 95 bhp version engine instead of the 75bhp
version they would be leaving themselves open to more out of warranty claims due to not updating the drive-train as it really is not likely to be the same. Also what about your VED? are the 75/90 in the same group? your V5 should have any engine change down and the co rating is specific to each bhp car.....

just done a check both the punto and panda still use the 75bhp engine in Italy
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Last edited by ban1111; 17-04-2013 at 20:43.
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Old 17-04-2013   #24
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

Quote Originally Posted by grimwau View Post
Almost certainly correct, I'm sure when I had my 75BHP 500 and was looking to change to the 95BHP or a TA I was told that there were a few differences apart from the mapping, Injectors seem to ring a bell.

Of course, if it was a brand new engine, it might have been a full engine complete with all ancillaries, exactly as ready to go straight into a new car.
The turbo is also different the 95 being variable geometry too.
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Old 18-04-2013   #25
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

Quote Originally Posted by alexh365 View Post
The turbo is also different the 95 being variable geometry too.
Alex, that was going to be my first post this AM. ........... Honest!
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Old 18-04-2013   #26
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

Quote Originally Posted by alexh365 View Post
The turbo is also different the 95 being variable geometry too.
There's a post by dannyboy in the Panda section on the differences between the turbo used on the 75bhp verus the 90bhp - it may also apply to the 500...
https://www.fiatforum.com/panda/1076...ml#post1142216

Previous discussion on the use of the word variable....
https://www.fiatforum.com/abarth-500...ml#post2812795

On a PM on the FF understand that the MJ I (75bhp) can't use a tuning box.
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Old 18-04-2013   #27
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

anyone tell me how the engines perform against each other? Is the 95 worth spending a bit more on? Better response? More torque? I'm after good MPG after my gas guzzling Audi TT but I'm not sure whether I can cope going from 270bhp to 75
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Old 26-04-2014   #28
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

An update.

The clutch, well the release bearing, failed after 176 000 miles. There was loads of meat left on the clutch. It was probably good for another 100 000 miles.
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Old 27-04-2014   #29
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Re: 1.3 d multi jet remap

Impressive stats for any car!
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Old 27-04-2014   #30
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Quote Originally Posted by 306maxi View Post
Ah Dunno why I thought it was the Abarth one.

As I said before I wouldn't be so sure about the box and clutch, the Panda has the same box and clutch IIRC and they seem to be quite near their limits judging by the issues people are having in there.

Linky. Lewey is a very knowledgeable guy and if the 95bhp 500 uses a different box then it does so for good reason.

https://www.fiatforum.com/panda/2706...ml#post2767114
*snigger* well that's me proven wrong in this instance!
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