Mr FIAT - Your #1 source for vintage car parts

General Still good value?

Currently reading:
General Still good value?

Re: Still good valua?

RobW said:
how do you know this?

I saw a Ka test mule at Dunton 3 years ago
Click to expand...
Because most of the test mules were German or Italian registered and there are tonnes of pictures of the Ka with it's fellow Fiat mules. There is one pic on Italiaspeed on the forum with the Ka in a convoy of other Fiat group mules but searching for it is like searching for a needle in a haystack :p But trust me, most of the development was done by Fiat because they know the platform best and know how it reacts to different things. I'm sure Ford were involved at some level but as with all platform sharing I'm sure that Fiat wanted to keep their cards close to their chest.
 
Re: Still good valua?

306maxi said:
Because most of the test mules were German or Italian registered and there are tonnes of pictures of the Ka with it's fellow Fiat mules. There is one pic on Italiaspeed on the forum with the Ka in a convoy of other Fiat group mules but searching for it is like searching for a needle in a haystack :p But trust me, most of the development was done by Fiat because they know the platform best and know how it reacts to different things. I'm sure Ford were involved at some level but as with all platform sharing I'm sure that Fiat wanted to keep their cards close to their chest.
Click to expand...

So now you contradict yourself :p

From my understanding Fiat used computer simulations to 'design' the suspension on the 500, the fact that Ford were driving a test mule meant that they were involved in the 'development'. (y)
 
Re: Still good valua?

306maxi said:
Exactly. The 500 is a lifestyle car and the sort of people who it will appeal to are the sorts who would probably pay a grand more if they had to. You need only look on the Panda forum to see the reactions of people to higher prices of normal cars.
Click to expand...

Whats your defintion of a 'normal car' then. Does the 500 fly or drive on water then. ;) If it does then i guess it isnt 'normal'.

But as far as i can tell its a Panda with a better looking body and interior, nothing more.
 
Re: Still good valua?

paul100hp said:
Whats your defintion of a 'normal car' then. Does the 500 fly or drive on water then. ;) If it does then i guess it isnt 'normal'.

But as far as i can tell its a Panda with a better looking body and interior, nothing more.
Click to expand...
Exactly and for the privelige of having a nicer body and interior you pay lots of £££££'s.
 
Re: Still good valua?

306maxi said:
Exactly and for the privelige of having a nicer body and interior you pay lots of £££££'s.
Click to expand...


Oh right , so its just a 'normal' car after all, it just looks better than some other cars on the road. Although some would say the panda is the better looking car, but of course those people shouldnt be allowed out.

Just checking , i dont want any nasty surprises when i get the missis one after xmas.
 
Re: Still good valua?

paul100hp said:
Oh right , so its just a 'normal' car after all, it just looks better than some other cars on the road. Although some would say the panda is the better looking car, but of course those people shouldnt be allowed out.

Just checking , i dont want any nasty surprises when i get the missis one after xmas.
Click to expand...
I think you've got the wrong end of the stick. I'm always the one who says that the 500 is just a more expensive and less practical Panda in a pretty dress :) If not for my wife not liking the Panda interior I'd have had a Panda too :)
 
Re: Still good valua?

Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love it BUT i never found it being good value, far from it, on two counts:

1/ It's a very small car, and at 9 grand for a basic version it should never be that much. (same goes for that new Toyota, and Mini)

2/ Is a 500 really more expensive to produce than a Panda with all theses common parts? How come Renault manage to produce a 6 grand 5 seater in Romania (Dacia)?

I do not criticize Fiat, they charge more because it is a lifestyle more than just a car, fair play to them.

ivantate said:
I wonder if the 500 is hitting the targets they originally set, at the moment in Italy the Panda is out selling it nearly 3/1./QUOTE]

All figures throughout Europe I saw on various sources show that the 500 is doing way better than Fiat expected themselves and the now 16 weeks to produce is testament to that methink.
Click to expand...
 
Re: Still good valua?

Cucciolotto said:
Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love it BUT i never found it being good value, far from it, on two counts:

1/ It's a very small car, and at 9 grand for a basic version it should never be that much. (same goes for that new Toyota, and Mini)

2/ Is a 500 really more expensive to produce than a Panda with all theses common parts? How come Renault manage to produce a 6 grand 5 seater in Romania (Dacia)?

I do not criticize Fiat, they charge more because it is a lifestyle more than just a car, fair play to them.

ivantate said:
I wonder if the 500 is hitting the targets they originally set, at the moment in Italy the Panda is out selling it nearly 3/1./QUOTE]

All figures throughout Europe I saw on various sources show that the 500 is doing way better than Fiat expected themselves and the now 16 weeks to produce is testament to that methink.
Click to expand...


the 500 is in a premium small car market place....having driven round in an admittedly solid C1, you can see what you pay your £££ for over a standard city car.....and also, the fiat panda is such a good donor car that you still get a great deal!
Click to expand...
 
the 500 is a good case study in Marketing

positioned - to compete with the MINI
priced - to undercut the above
promoted - on the basis on being retro cool
people - want to buy it and be seen in it

therefore it is a desirable car, whether it is good value depends on your perspective

compared to a MINI? yes
compared to a Panda? maybe

well personally I really like the Panda 100HP and in a lot of respects it is a better car dynamically and more fun to drive. I also like the tougher looks and 'honesty' of it.
 
Re: Still good valua?

Cucciolotto said:
2/ Is a 500 really more expensive to produce than a Panda with all theses common parts? How come Renault manage to produce a 6 grand 5 seater in Romania (Dacia)?
Click to expand...

The difference in price between the 500 and Panda is pure profit for Fiat.
 
To follow up my point on Dacia, have look at these:

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/firstdrives/204818/dacia_logan.html

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carrev...sed_car_test_dacia_sandero_vs_ford_focus.html

and above all check the price out: £6,500!

For sure they're no lookers but for someone who doesn't care what he's seen in (not me then :D), they're excellent. Even if you add 3 grand worth of options you'd have a £9,500 car (Maths made easy, by Cucciolotto :rolleyes:).
They are cheap but noTatas either remenber.

Plus the fact Fiat don't produce the 500 in Italy but in Poland (still cheaper), on these two basis alone I think the 500 isn't a bargain at all. Renault shows it is possible to built a reasonably good car for less.

Still, I must admit I am so smitten with the 500 that I would have paid a grand more, but that would have been my top top ceiling.
 
Cucciolotto said:
To follow up my point on Dacia, have look at these:

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/firstdrives/204818/dacia_logan.html

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carrev...sed_car_test_dacia_sandero_vs_ford_focus.html

and above all check the price out: £6,500!

For sure they're no lookers but for someone who doesn't care what he's seen in (not me then :D), they're excellent. Even if you add 3 grand worth of options you'd have a £9,500 car (Maths made easy, by Cucciolotto :rolleyes:).
They are cheap but noTatas either remenber.

Plus the fact Fiat don't produce the 500 in Italy but in Poland (still cheaper), on these two basis alone I think the 500 isn't a bargain at all. Renault shows it is possible to built a reasonably good car for less.

Still, I must admit I am so smitten with the 500 that I would have paid a grand more, but that would have been my top top ceiling.
Click to expand...
See my post above. The difference between the Panda and the 500 is PURE profit as in Fiat are profiting from people who are willing to pay all that extra money for the looks of the car.
 
Cucciolotto said:
To follow up my point on Dacia, have look at these:

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/firstdrives/204818/dacia_logan.html

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carrev...sed_car_test_dacia_sandero_vs_ford_focus.html

and above all check the price out: £6,500!

For sure they're no lookers but for someone who doesn't care what he's seen in (not me then :D), they're excellent. Even if you add 3 grand worth of options you'd have a £9,500 car (Maths made easy, by Cucciolotto :rolleyes:).
They are cheap but noTatas either remenber.

Plus the fact Fiat don't produce the 500 in Italy but in Poland (still cheaper), on these two basis alone I think the 500 isn't a bargain at all. Renault shows it is possible to built a reasonably good car for less.

Still, I must admit I am so smitten with the 500 that I would have paid a grand more, but that would have been my top top ceiling.
Click to expand...

are you nuts :ROFLMAO:

a Dacia - you cannot be serious :rolleyes:
Renaults are bad enough!!
 
it didn't matter to me how much a Panda was and how much it is like a 500, as far as I was concerned it is a totally different car and I didn't want one!

several friends told us we were mad, but when they go in the 500, suddenly they wanted one too!!

somethings you buy with your head, others with your heart, regardless of how much extra money Fiat makes, it was 500 or nothing for me ;)
 
RobW said:
1/ are you nuts :ROFLMAO:

2/ a Dacia - you cannot be serious :rolleyes:
3/ Renaults are bad enough!!
Click to expand...

1/ Not at all.
2/ Yet I am.
3/ If you follow a make's reputation that much then you should never have bought a Fiat!

I scour French and Italian forums not just because I'm a sad person :)D) but because I'm interested. I can assure you that Dacias fare well and do not have more problems (not saying less either) than others, same for Renaults, yet those two makes sell bucketloads in French, Spanish, Belgian markets to name a few. If they were that bad they'd be ditched straight away by the buyers yet they do well! (and well enough to provide the engines to the second F1 team of this year's championship, better than BMW and Toyota btw)

Anyway, your argumentation was such a killer I can only accept defeat.
 
Murano16v said:
Profit for Fiat should be seen as a good thing for all who like the brand - better quality, money to develop new models, happy workers. Not so long ago Fiat was on the brink of going under.
Click to expand...
I doubt most of the people on this forum are 'Fiat' people. As someone whose first car was a hand me down 131 which had been in the family since before I was born I really like the Fiat brand and was sad that up until the current range came out there wasn't really anything that I'd have bought. Sadly my other favourite brand (Peugeot) has gone the other way and there isn't a single Peugeot I'd buy after the 106/306 and 406
 
Cucciolotto said:
1/ Not at all.
2/ Yet I am.
3/ If you follow a make's reputation that much then you should never have bought a Fiat!

I scour French and Italian forums not just because I'm a sad person :)D) but because I'm interested. I can assure you that Dacias fare well and do not have more problems (not saying less either) than others, same for Renaults, yet those two makes sell bucketloads in French, Spanish, Belgian markets to name a few. If they were that bad they'd be ditched straight away by the buyers yet they do well! (and well enough to provide the engines to the second F1 team of this year's championship, better than BMW and Toyota btw)

Anyway, your argumentation was such a killer I can only accept defeat.
Click to expand...


Perhaps the new ones are OK but to me it's like Skoda - to me it will always be a rubbish eastern bloc car for peasants (n)
 
RobW said:
Perhaps the new ones are OK but to me it's like Skoda - to me it will always be a rubbish eastern bloc car for peasants (n)
Click to expand...
and not as well built as they'd want you to think. Brother in law has an x-reg Fabia. Central locking doesn't work, suspension is completely knackered, engine needs loads of work and some of the rear lights don't work either. My wifes L reg Subaru on the other hand only just now has a slightly weeping damper at the back, some bushes which are going and all the electrics work. As much as I hate Subaru's for being a bit bland in the styling department and for being a bit crappy inside they're still bloody bulletproof.

The Germans can keep their VAG **** and I'll stick with my stereotypically unreliable Fiat and our Subaru which to most people probably looks like it's at the age where cars fall apart.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

GettinBetter
General The Good News and the Bad News
3 4 5
Replies
84
Views
5K
steveras57
S
T
General Best value car i have ever owned
Replies
2
Views
398
John202020
John202020
vexorg
Technical Not so good vibrations from the rad fan
Replies
3
Views
660
vexorg
vexorg
R
Technical Clutch master cylinder lack of fluid, why?replaced slave cylinder but still keep losing pressure and fluid.
Replies
3
Views
625
John202020
John202020
Fiat2015 Ying
Technical Replace a new Brake Switch (46840510) , Still shows P1760 brake switch code.
Replies
15
Views
2K
John202020
John202020
Back
Top