Hello, new member here.

I just finished my video review of the North American Fiat 500 and wanted to share it with all of you. Be aware however that I've never driven a European Fiat, so I can't say which continent has the better vehicle. Also, this North American Fiat has yet to experience a typical Canadian winter, so the review is a bit incomplete on that subject.



Enjoy!

Thanks for posting this Milnoc, I've edited in the correct embed for you

Where was this filmed, I just got back from Canada a few hours ago!

NDG, Nun's Island, downtown Montreal, and the South Shore along the river. The only decent road in the entire video was Highway 20 on the South Shore! The rest was all crap!

The 500 survived it all.

Very nice. Thanks for posting!

Milnoc said:

NDG, Nun's Island, downtown Montreal, and the South Shore along the river. The only decent road in the entire video was Highway 20 on the South Shore! The rest was all crap!

The 500 survived it all.

Click to expand...

I was staying in Rue Mont Royal over the weekend I did see one 500, but I don't think it was you

Milnoc said:

Hello, new member here.

I just finished my video review of the North American Fiat 500 and wanted to share it with all of you. Be aware however that I've never driven a European Fiat, so I can't say which continent has the better vehicle. Also, this North American Fiat has yet to experience a typical Canadian winter, so the review is a bit incomplete on that subject.

Enjoy!

Click to expand...

Thanks for posting the review of the US 500 Lounge. Interesting finance figures at the start which makes the Pop a better finance option. On the European V US it would be perceived that you have the better car since you have a lot of extra rigidity in the structure, the suspension (possibly ) the multi-air engine and you're Pop in particular is priced keenly. The European hits the scales about 100kgs lighter and might have better handling on the twisties. Your video made me appreciate the roads that I have. I have a little laugh that you were surprised that the 500 would 'keep up' with the flow of traffic. The 1.4 was marketed as the peppy one in comparison to the smaller engined 1.2 - so with a MA 1.4 101bhp (& better economy) you are doing well despite the weight disadvantage.

Also the automatic in Europe is a MTA - a Manual Transmission Automated - so there is no lose of power since there's no torque converter - but it probably isn't as smooth as your automatic. It would be an interesting exercise to see if the Manual in the US in the real world is quicker than the automatic.

Re the Snow. Well the small bit that we received in Dublin - about 2 feet deep where I live beside the sea - nothing like the real snow that people have had elsewhere - the 500 has coped very well. Some individuals in the UK remarked that they didn't need their 4x4s and have sold them because the 500 was so good. Noticed that your tyres are 'All season' but there would have to be changed for proper winter ones (as you know) if you really wanted the 500 to perform.

Hockey players fight?

Soccer players are nonces in whatever country!

Rugby league is a proper man's game.

I didnt think much of the music track.

Weather looked nice!

The 500 is OK (but looks out of place amongst the Monster Truck tatses of Canadians & North Americans)

That is all.

One day, I'll have to try a European 500 so I can make a decent assessment between the two production models. Maybe Fiat can finance a trip.

Montreal and Quebec City are huge markets for small cars. Many have to park in the street, and big cars are just too much of a pain.

As for the upcoming winter test, here are the conditions.

- Winter tires (required by law, brand new ones ok since all 500s are new here)
- Minus 10 degree Celsius weather with high humidity (chills your bones)
- The morning after the season's second major snowstorm (unplowed snow on pre-conditioned roads)
- Car left exposed outdoors and unplugged (i.e. no block heater), covered with at least a foot of snow

After clearing the snow, we'll see if the 500 can start on the very first turn of the key -- assuming the doors and locks haven't frozen over!

Anyone who thinks this a bit extreme has never lived here.

BTW, does anyone know if A/C is standard in the US Pop and Sport models? It's only standard in the Lounge model here in Canada. My CPG (Canadian Price Gouging) factor might be off again. Might have to issue a correction.

Thanks everyone!

EDIT: Okay, the CPG factor for the Pop model might be way off, but I'll need confirmation from an American source. At first, it seems as if the Canadian Pop model is even more stripped down than the US Pop model, but the American Pop model includes way too many features that you'd normally find on higher end models! The Blue&Me package, A/C, Cruise Control, leather trim on the steering wheel and shift knob... Doesn't make any sense.

The figures for the Sport and Lounge models however appear to be reasonably accurate, and would take into consideration many of the mods required for Canadian regulations compliance such as daytime running lights and side reflectors.

Milnoc said:

One day, I'll have to try a European 500 so I can make a decent assessment between the two production models. Maybe Fiat can finance a trip.

Montreal and Quebec City are huge markets for small cars. Many have to park in the street, and big cars are just too much of a pain.

As for the upcoming winter test, here are the conditions.

- Winter tires (required by law, brand new ones ok since all 500s are new here)
- Minus 10 degree Celsius weather with high humidity (chills your bones)
- The morning after the season's second major snowstorm (unplowed snow on pre-conditioned roads)
- Car left exposed outdoors and unplugged (i.e. no block heater), covered with at least a foot of snow

After clearing the snow, we'll see if the 500 can start on the very first turn of the key -- assuming the doors and locks haven't frozen over!

Anyone who thinks this a bit extreme has never lived here.

BTW, does anyone know if A/C is standard in the US Pop and Sport models? It's only standard in the Lounge model here in Canada. My CPG (Canadian Price Gouging) factor might be off again. Might have to issue a correction.

Thanks everyone!

EDIT: Okay, the CPG factor for the Pop model might be way off, but I'll need confirmation from an American source. At first, it seems as if the Canadian Pop model is even more stripped down than the US Pop model, but the American Pop model includes way too many features that you'd normally find on higher end models! The Blue&Me package, A/C, Cruise Control, leather trim on the steering wheel and shift knob... Doesn't make any sense.

The figures for the Sport and Lounge models however appear to be reasonably accurate, and would take into consideration many of the mods required for Canadian regulations compliance such as daytime running lights and side reflectors.

Click to expand...

Macdebbie who posted on this forum should be able to confirm if the Finance figure for her recently bought Pop is correct - you could always sent her a PM if she doesn't 'come on line'.
The US Pop with the B&Me, A/C, etc. surprised me because it is not on the European model but it makes sense to include them since B&Me is really a safety feature with nearly all drivers carrying a mobile ; A/C - in this 'day & age' very few would be with out it. Base price in the US of €15,500 is cheaper than the European and IMHO appears excellent value for money despite the $800 delivery & admin fee. Noticed the canadian base price is higher on the Pop at $15,900 and that's with it 'stripped down'.

Re the locks on the 500 freezing over - my wife's Alfa mitos locks freeze over if it dips slightly below zero but they will open with a hair dryer ! Time will tell if the 500 fairs better.

The parking - the 500 is great for that - you find spots that no-one can get into.

Not sure the B&Me package is worth it. You can get a Bluetooth earpiece pretty cheap these days, and having to "give instructions" to the car sounds as infuriating as calling one of those automated tech support centers!

And remember! The Blue&Me system was designed by Microsoft! Do you really want a "Blue Screen of Death" in your car???

As for the A/C being optional here, that makes sense. Shops are often overrun at springtime with cars whose A/C have broken down after months of disuse and exposure to freezing cold temperatures. The potential repair costs alone can be enough to make people skip over this option even if it were given away for free.

And finance figures? What if you wanted to pay cash? Could they say "no?"

I'm starting to wonder if the American Pop model is actually used for "bait & switch" tactics, especially if dealers routinely demand a couple of thousand dollars over MSRP for it, which is a common occurrence in the US with this car.

BTW, a few more Canadian tidbits. Destination is $1,4000, plus a $100 government levy on the A/C if you have it. The spare tire is $200 Canadian instead of the US $100. Automatic transmission: $1,300 Canadian, $1,000 US. Electric sunroof: $1,000 Canadian for the Pop and Sport models, $500 Canadian on the Lounge model, $850 US for all models. Block heater: $50 US, standard in Canada.

And this is with the Canadian dollar worth MORE than the US dollar!

Funniest part: French labeling is standard in Quebec, and is extra if you live anywhere else.

loveshandbags said:

I have a little laugh that you were surprised that the 500 would 'keep up' with the flow of traffic. The 1.4 was marketed as the peppy one in comparison to the smaller engined 1.2 - so with a MA 1.4 101bhp (& better economy) you are doing well despite the weight disadvantage.

Click to expand...

Not surprised, just saying that the car can handle normal Quebec traffic, a place where everyone drives at 120 km/h even though the posted speed limit is 100 km/h. You don't want to be in a car that can't keep up and risks being rear-ended, which is why you rarely see Smart cars on our highways.

Milnoc said:

Not sure the B&Me package is worth it. You can get a Bluetooth earpiece pretty cheap these days, and having to "give instructions" to the car sounds as infuriating as calling one of those automated tech support centers!

And remember! The Blue&Me system was designed by Microsoft! Do you really want a "Blue Screen of Death" in your car???

As for the A/C being optional here, that makes sense. Shops are often overrun at springtime with cars whose A/C have broken down after months of disuse and exposure to freezing cold temperatures. The potential repair costs alone can be enough to make people skip over this option even if it were given away for free.

And finance figures? What if you wanted to pay cash? Could they say "no?"

I'm starting to wonder if the American Pop model is actually used for "bait & switch" tactics, especially if dealers routinely demand a couple of thousand dollars over MSRP for it, which is a common occurrence in the US with this car.

BTW, a few more Canadian tidbits. Destination is $1,4000, plus a $100 government levy on the A/C if you have it. The spare tire is $200 Canadian instead of the US $100. Automatic transmission: $1,300 Canadian, $1,000 US. Electric sunroof: $1,000 Canadian for the Pop and Sport models, $500 Canadian on the Lounge model, $850 US for all models. Block heater: $50 US, standard in Canada.

And this is with the Canadian dollar worth MORE than the US dollar!

Funniest part: French labeling is standard in Quebec, and is extra if you live anywhere else.

Click to expand...

I had a look at the exchange rate of the Canadian Dollar to the US Dollar and the roller coast effect reminded me of the Euro Sterling exchange rates. With the buying power of the Canadian Dollar (probably due to your more prudent Banking policies) your economy seems to be in a relatively strong position. So now would seem a good time to buy.

Another member of on the FF forum got some assistance on the spec on her 500 on the European forum. She purchased a Pop at $17,600 plus delivery and admin charge of $800 and seems satisfied with it.
https://www.fiatforum.com/500/274671-ok-ive-decided-car-order-tomorrow-3.html?p=2802023
Compared with the price of the European models it’s priced very well. In Ireland the 1.2 Pop is priced at €12,695 (very basic) and the 1.4 Lounge (this is the ‘old’ engine and more comparable to the US Pop) at €16,695 which equates to 17,672 CAD and 23,242 CAD.
http://www.fiat.ie

A more important exchange rate that probably might need to be looked at is the Euro to Dollar (or I should Canadian Dollar). Euro has got stronger and weakens the North American buying power. But you have protected yourselves with ‘local’ manufacturing ?

On the Blue & Me I take your point about the blue screen of death because it came be a bit quirky - but it is nothing like the Pink screen that people are getting now between a Satellite decoder (Technisat), Home Cinema amp (Marantz) and a LCD (Samsung). I would like to think that the input from Magneti Marelli kept ‘Microsoft on their toes’.
http://jalopnik.com/275203/blue--me-and-fiat-500

Here is an unbiased review of the B&Mesystem…
https://www.fiatforum.com/blue-me/197163-blue-me-review.html

For me being a European I preferred our ‘voice’. Do you have the option of switching to a nice French accent since you're living in Quebec ?


On the issue about Air cons breaking down in your artic Canadian (I had a whole gang of cousins leaving in Newfoundland that suffered -30deg Celsius – they’re now in slightly warmer Montreal) you might get a model called ‘Naked’ . This was a model below the Pop model in Italy. I don’t know what it was missing (possible 2 airbags & Electric something) but they might bring it into Canadian for your cold winters.

I’ll leaving you with one final link to the hologram configurator which you will give you a peek into the future…
http://www.musion.co.uk/Fiat_500_Car_Configurator_Retail_Launch_Italy.html

P.S. I enjoyed that one about the Smart cars not keeping up – I’ll save it for a particular FF member who thinks they’re great !

That is a very unpleasant sounding voice. Still, I'll have to check which version of French is included with the 500 in Quebec: France French, or Quebec French. If it's France French, many French Canadian customers will probably switch over to English just to get away from the incomprehensible French dialect!

A "naked" model without airbags might never become available here. Our transportation regulations are just as strict as our banking regulations (none of our banks failed or even asked for a bail-out).

As for the Smart City car, lack of speed isn't the only problem. In Series 5 episode 7 of Top Gear, they gave the Smart Car the award for best comedy car of the year because when trying to navigate the second curve in the Hammerhead, it kept going straight and almost went off the runway!

BTW, "Boo" on the producers for their despicable judgment calls last weekend!

Spoke to the sales manager who loaned us the car. Not only did he love the review, he'll be using it as a training tool for his sales staff. I didn't expect that kind of reaction!

It looks like the winter driving test is definitely a "go" at this stage.

Finally, I have a few bonus videos available as well. Here's a handy video selector I've created just in case YouTube's subscription module didn't work properly again. Just click on the video you wish to see.

Enjoy!

Milnoc said:

That is a very unpleasant sounding voice. Still, I'll have to check which version of French is included with the 500 in Quebec: France French, or Quebec French. If it's France French, many French Canadian customers will probably switch over to English just to get away from the incomprehensible French dialect!

A "naked" model without airbags might never become available here. Our transportation regulations are just as strict as our banking regulations (none of our banks failed or even asked for a bail-out).

As for the Smart City car, lack of speed isn't the only problem. In Series 5 episode 7 of Top Gear, they gave the Smart Car the award for best comedy car of the year because when trying to navigate the second curve in the Hammerhead, it kept going straight and almost went off the runway!

BTW, "Boo" on the producers for their despicable judgment calls last weekend!

Spoke to the sales manager who loaned us the car. Not only did he love the review, he'll be using it as a training tool for his sales staff. I didn't expect that kind of reaction!

It looks like the winter driving test is definitely a "go" at this stage.

Finally, I have a few bonus videos available as well. Here's a handy video selector I've created just in case YouTube's subscription module didn't work properly again. Just click on the video you wish to see.

Enjoy!

Click to expand...

Just to clarify the "naked" model - this was only sold in Italy. I got the impression that it was missing the airbags just from the Front seats so you still had 5 left. That shouldn't be a big deal. The Ford Ka in 'basic' model seems to be missing a few airbags so it is nothing new. Also for those lucky enough to get the Abarth 500 - if you get the Sabelt seats - there would be no airbags in them. I thought if there was a demand for a Pop with no Air con etc. then possibly a model with a better name might suit what you were looking for.

If you keep this up you might get a trip to Europe yet. I would be very interested in your views on the new Twin Air and Twin Air plus models that have been launched and also if your US model feels any different from our European model. Maybe a trip to Milan or Turin ?

The TwinAir is definitely an interesting beast. In North America, two cylinder engines are normally found in motorcycles!

Comparing the North American 500 with the European 500 would definitely be worthwhile, especially at the Milbrook proving grounds in the UK (I watch waaaaaay too much Top Gear). Anyone out there willing to finance my trip and the performance driving lessons I desperately need?

Milnoc said:

The TwinAir is definitely an interesting beast. In North America, two cylinder engines are normally found in motorcycles!

Comparing the North American 500 with the European 500 would definitely be worthwhile, especially at the Milbrook proving grounds in the UK (I watch waaaaaay too much Top Gear). Anyone out there willing to finance my trip and the performance driving lessons I desperately need?

Click to expand...

There is a dealership opening up a 'new garage' in Northern Ireland with Fiat 500s, Alfas and for the first time in Ireland - Abarths including the A500. I reckon that the A500 wouldn't be that different from the US A500 and you could do another Youtube special.

https://www.fiatforum.com/abarth-500/275491-abarth-dealerships-northern-ireland.html

You could follow the link on the above thread and see if you can organise an invitation for yourself. It should be on sometime in August 2011.

Flight shouldn't cost that much. There would be great interest from those in NA particularly on the A500.

Organising someone to give you some advanced driver lessons shouldn't be too difficult given the heritage of Rallying in the North and the border counties.

Estimated cost for a round trip from Montreal to Belfast via Heathrow just to visit the grand opening of a Fiat dealer: £980.

£1725 if I fly World Traveler Plus just to get those much needed seven inches of extra leg room, or about £100 per inch.

Not including hotel and airport transfers.

What were you were saying about the trip not being expensive?

Milnoc said:

Estimated cost for a round trip from Montreal to Belfast via Heathrow just to visit the grand opening of a Fiat dealer: £980.

£1725 if I fly World Traveler Plus just to get those much needed seven inches of extra leg room, or about £100 per inch.

Not including hotel and airport transfers.

What were you were saying about the trip not being expensive?

Click to expand...

It's pricier that I thought. Dublin-US at €378
http://www.cheapflights.ie/Flights/DUB/NYC/Dublin-New-York.htm

Montreal - Belfast £697
http://www.cheapflights.co.uk/flights/Montreal/Belfast-International/

Anyway - it's got you thinking.

Unfortunately, your links are for flights originating from Belfast, and not from Montreal. The site won't accept departures from Montreal.

Another travel site had a flight option via Newark, New Jersey for about £775, but that would have meant flying through the USA, an option I would prefer to avoid considering how downright paranoid they've become over the years. British customs agents are much nicer.

The problem is that I'm departing from Canada instead of departing from outside of Canada. And unfortunately, Canadian airport fees are among the highest in the world. Despite the US customs hassles, many Canadians will take buses to regional USA airports just to catch much cheaper flights both in and out of the USA. In Montreal, our closest US airport is Plattsburgh International in Vermont, and they'll even serve you in French!

It isn't for nothing I've created the CPG (Canadian Price Gouging) factor in my video. We Canadians get ripped off time and time again for exactly the same products sold in both the USA and Canada. In fact, some cars sold in Canada are priced at 40% above the equivalent US price! And the physical differences between the two vehicles are frequently minimal at best!

Milnoc said:

Unfortunately, your links are for flights originating from Belfast, and not from Montreal. The site won't accept departures from Montreal.

Another travel site had a flight option via Newark, New Jersey for about £775, but that would have meant flying through the USA, an option I would prefer to avoid considering how downright paranoid they've become over the years. British customs agents are much nicer.

The problem is that I'm departing from Canada instead of departing from outside of Canada. And unfortunately, Canadian airport fees are among the highest in the world. Despite the US customs hassles, many Canadians will take buses to regional USA airports just to catch much cheaper flights both in and out of the USA. In Montreal, our closest US airport is Plattsburgh International in Vermont, and they'll even serve you in French!

It isn't for nothing I've created the CPG (Canadian Price Gouging) factor in my video. We Canadians get ripped off time and time again for exactly the same products sold in both the USA and Canada. In fact, some cars sold in Canada are priced at 40% above the equivalent US price! And the physical differences between the two vehicles are frequently minimal at best!

Click to expand...

There is quite a few Irish people emigrating to Canada which I understand is doing pretty OK all things considered. In Ireland we have always had high prices compared to the UK and the excuse has been that we are an island off Europe with high transportation costs. At least your banks have been very prudent and it shows now. So with all this 'gouging' - where is the money going ?
What's stopping you buying the car in the U.S. and importing it to the Canada ? Is there some arrangement between Canada and the States to minimise duty, VAT, etc. ?