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Old 25-11-2016   #31
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

what about using a water jet, like those on the carwash? it's not strong ehough to cut through, but might move the crap that's holding them together..
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Old 25-11-2016   #32
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

Quote Originally Posted by Franko500 View Post
So anyone got any bright ideas how to get this piston out?
I think either by rapid heavy impact or a hydraulic press.
The ones we used to use in the workshop would move anything, often with a sudden worrying but controlled "crack!!!" Most workshops will have different sized mandrels to spread the load.
If you could find an outer race from a suitably-sized wheel-bearing that fits nicely on the piston top, then had a thick steel disc on top of that, you could give it a fair wack, supported in a heavy vice.
I have a really heavy impact drill, a bit like a Kango, that can operate without rotating, it goes through concrete with ease...it's the weight. Hammer one of those on top of the protected piston and it would move in seconds.
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Old 25-11-2016   #33
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

Quote Originally Posted by AndrewHarvey View Post
Stick it in the oven......?
I would second that...
you could even put some oil on top of the piston as well so as everything heats up and expands the oil soaks through..

or
as alloy expands greater than cast Iron...
you could try lowering the temp of the piston when everything is hot by some cooler oil...
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Old 25-11-2016   #34
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

Problem is the shape of the piston crown is not flat. Check the photos.
Also difficult to support the cylinder without damaging. Already broken 2 fins of the casing!
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Old 25-11-2016   #35
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

I have played this game before.

There is no magical solution. If you heat and cool the cylinder barrel a few times, that sometimes breaks the bond between the piston, rings and barrel. Don't get it red hot as you don't want to damage the piston, maybe 150-200 deg C? I usually use a heat gun rather than gas as I find it a bit more gentle even if it takes longer.

And drown it in penetrating oil when it is hot. WD40 or similar seems to work ok. I use this Mouse Milk.


.
It is a product we get at work sometimes and I wouldn't drink it, but it is the best I have found.

If all else fails then a judicious application of violence may be the only way. Remember the Mechanic's Motto.... "Don't force it, use a bigger hammer"

I hope this helps.
Chris
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Old 25-11-2016   #36
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

Thinking about it, what I actually did with mine was very low-tech and I totally agree with Looigi on heat and then quench with any kind of penetrating oil.
I used a short chunk of high strength structural timber, trimmed to square so it fit down the barrel, stuck the barrel on the jaws of the vice (it's a big 'un) and wacked the timber with a 4lb lump hammer....quite a few times. I didn't need to save the piston but I don't recall that I wrecked it. the barrel was rebored and is in my car now. Good luck.

PS, You could hollow out the end of the timber for the domed top...how domed is it?
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Last edited by fiat500; 25-11-2016 at 21:38.
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Old 25-11-2016   #37
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

Sean, you're handy, you could make this (move on a couple of minutes in the vid).
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Old 27-11-2016   #38
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

I am glad to say that the other piston is now out!
I have heated, cooled, hit it, soaked it in oil, petrol, White Vinegar, Rust eater and WD40 and set it on fire!
Eventually I had to mount the cylinder in the largest vice I could find clamped around the lower section. This was risking damaging the machined face that sits on the block but it was the only way I could hold it still.
I then shaped a piece of wood to fit in the bore with a rough shape of the piston to spread the load. Whacked it as hard as I could with a large hammer a number of times and it moved!
Finally got it out to find that all the rings were rock solid in their grooves. They were completely packed tight with carbon etc.
I managed to remove the rings - broke a few getting them out and then cleaned the grooves out with a small screwdriver and part of the broken ring as this removes the crud and cleans it completely out to the point that the ring fits the groove again.
The oil control rings were solid. I'm surprised any oil got through to the rings from inside the piston. The pistons have cleaned up fairly well.
There's some slight pitting from corrosion on one of the pistons but I think it will be ok.
The Cylinders are both slightly damaged from the rings/corrosion. There is also a slight lip at the top of the cylinder although I am thinking this is from the original pistons as the top ring on the high compression piston doesn't go up this high.
Next step give everything a quick clean then take it to the machine shop to get them to put everything in their cleaning tank and then check and diagnose if these components can be used again.
I might strip the 500L engine and see what condition the crank and cylinders are as I could possibly use these.
Does anyone know if a 126 crankshaft is the same as a 500D?
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Old 27-11-2016   #39
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

Job well done. i can see why you want to keep those pistons; they do look quite special.
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Old 24-12-2016   #40
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

I finally got back in the garage today for a few hours.
Decided to strip my 1971 500L engine apart to see if I can use the crank and cylinders.
Oh dear!
It all came apart nice and easy. a couple of surprises though!
There was a 6mm diameter washer in one of the cam followers. Not sure what damage that has done yet until I clean the components. Don't even know where it came from as I don't recall one being used on the engine.
I removed the big end bearing caps to find one of the bearings had some of its bearing face missing. And yet the crank journal appeared perfectly ok with no signs of damage to the other half of the bearing either.
The front main journal appeared a little on the rough side although the bearing appeared ok with just a few minor marks around the diameter. I might get the machine shop to check it and polish it if its ok.
Then came the pistons. Now I was expecting 67.4mm. Oh no, appears that the bores are approximately 70mm diameter and another set of high crown pistons. The pistons look good but sadly the bores have scores going up one side and the piston ring was broken. So I think these cylinders are finished. But maybe I could have my D cylinders bored out to use these pistons instead.
Has anyone any suggestions as to what they are and what cc this will make it?
Oh and has anyone got any good methods of cleaning engine blocks and components i.e. leaving them to soak in anything?
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Old 24-12-2016   #41
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

They're on this thread Sean...540cc so-called "stoker" pistons.
https://www.fiatforum.com/500-classi...s-barrels.html
I've heard of oven-cleaner and alloy-wheel stuff being used. But because I just need things to be physically clean and grit-free, after my de-greasing (or "greasing" as Tony put it ), I put it in the dishwasher.
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Old 24-12-2016   #42
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

Be cautious of alloy components in the dishwasher as the salt in the washer can attack elderly aluminium
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Old 24-12-2016   #43
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

Quote Originally Posted by AndrewHarvey View Post
Be cautious of alloy components in the dishwasher as the salt in the washer can attack elderly aluminium
Good point. We don't use actual NaCl in our washer but the alloy does go dull. So maybe not my best advice. But I have road tested the result for a few years and not had any grit issues or warped and disintegrating parts. But I suppose time may tell?😃
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Old 24-12-2016   #44
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

Quote Originally Posted by fiat500 View Post
They're on this thread Sean...540cc so-called "stoker" pistons.
https://www.fiatforum.com/500-classi...s-barrels.html
I've heard of oven-cleaner and alloy-wheel stuff being used. But because I just need things to be physically clean and grit-free, after my de-greasing (or "greasing" as Tony put it ), I put it in the dishwasher.
I checked that thread earlier but they are different to mine.
From what I can make out they are 540 pistons though. Just not sure what make.
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Old 24-12-2016   #45
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Re: Fiat 500D Engine 1962

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