You guys really helped last summer with an my X1/9 overheating problem. Got it fixed and a new set of tires -- and all was well when I put it in my neighbor's garage for the winter. About a month ago it was driven from their garage to my shed and parked.

Yesterday I went to drive it, and the clutch peddle seemed from memory to go too far down. Then I discovered the clutch was still engaged. I assumed it was low fluid, but not the case. The little tank seemed to be full. There were no leaks in car under the Master or under the Slave on the concrete floor.

Today my wife watched the Salve as I pushed the peddle -- and she said it was moving.

Neither she nor I know how much it should move. So it could still be a hydraulic problem. Or, worse, something has gone wrong in the clutch.

What I just can't figure out how either problem could happen in a month sitting inside on a level concrete floor. (Unless it was happening very slowly in the garage during a very long and cold winter. But, I can't see how that could hurt clutch fluid or the clutch itself.)

Before having it towed, does anyone have any way to figure out which problem it could be?

And, if it is hydraulic -- let's say some kind of air bubbles -- how could that happen and how would I find-out and what could be done?

Thank you.
Steve

Bleed the system and see what happens, maybe all the seals are gone and need replacing.

With storage over winter, clutch centreplate may be stuck to the flywheel. Usual method to free off is a bit brutal, but cheap and effective. Once engine warm, select gear and start engine with clutch pedal down. Car will probably drive away, so ensure enough space. With pedal down, push brake to stop car. Car may stall, or clutch plate may let go. If it lets go, get it to the bite point and let it rub for a few seconds to "clean" the surfaces. There may be a bit of judder for a few trips, but should settle. Use it regularly to prevent recurrence.

Or it may be a hydraulic issue, so bleed and check as advised above, before using this trick.

The brutal method to be a good start because my wife says the Slave moved what she thinks is the maximum amount. Next, I'll have her push the peddle while I watch.

One question -- since the vertical bar connected to the Slave turns -- the fork likely moves. I have the FIAT manual which shows a static picture.

My guess is that the fork moves away from the clutch mechanism.

Does it pull the clutch plate away from the rest of the transmission or does it simply allow an internal spring to push the clutch plate away from from the rest of the transmission.

I think the fact nothing horrible happened the fork simply moved away but the spring couldn't push the plate back because its stuck.

Next, I'll look at the hydraulic system.

Thank you both.
Steve

The clutch fork will be on a pivot inside the bell housing, so that the outer end moves away from the flywheel, but the inner end pushes the release bearing against the clutch cover. All normal stuff.

Re: Clutch slave operating, but not clutch

Not normal stuff for me.

Here's what I understand from you: the forked arm pivots around the vertical rod that exits from bell housing and is driven by the Slave.

"… the outer end moves away from the flywheel, but the inner end pushes the release bearing …."

Is the outer-end the fork? I think it must be because I think the rod moves clock-wise (looking down). If the fork moves a way from the clutch, what does it do? Why is it a fork if not connected to anything?

You say, the end opposite the fork, "the inner end pushes the release bearing against the clutch cover." Correct?

I've got to Google more about how a clutch works to understand how the "release bearing" works.

Thank you, I'm getting there slowly with your help.
Steve

I Googled more about how a clutch works to understand how the "release bearing" works.

When Release Bearing is pushed IN it pushes in on the set of springs which moves the Pressure Plate away from contacting the Clutch Disk. The Clutch Disk should them move away from the Flywheel.

With the Clutch Disk away from the Flywheel, the engine no longer drives the transmission.

This happens in my car, but the Clutch-Disk is stuck to the flywheel. That stick must be broken. Correct?

PS: The fork-lever has a pivot point. The other end of the fork lever is driven by the Slave. When the Slave pulls, the fork pushes in on the Release Bearing. Correct?

Have a look at these two videos. Hopefully it will be a lot clearer then.

Re: Clutch slave operating, but not clutch

The bottom one I had viewed.

There's a problem where he says "the Clutch Disk is bolted up to the Flywheel." Then the first animation shows it's the Pressure Plate that is bolted up to the flywheel and the clutch disk is between them and connects to the transmission.

He then says "the Pressure Plate holds the Clutch Disk in place." Were the Pressure Plate bolted to the flywheel it would be always spinning so it couldn't hold the Clutch Disk in any way at all. Then the second animation shows neither the Clutch Disk nor the Pressure Plate are bolted to the flywheel. THIS IS CORRECT. The Clutch Disk and the Pressure Plate are bolted to each other. ALSO CORRECT.

What not explained is when the Pressure Plate is pushed inward by Throw-out Bearing which in turn is connected to the Fork -- which is pushed in by the Slave when the peddle is pushed -- the Pressure Plate moves back from the Clutch Disk. This is clearly shown by the second animation.

But why does the Clutch Disk move away from the Flywheel just because the Pressure Plate stops applying pressure on it? I assumed there must be a spring pushing the Clutch Disk away from the Flywheel, but I don't see one.

In my case, we believe stiction -- that happened in only a month -- will be released by the enormous drag of the transmission on the Clutch Plate as the Flywheel is moving.

I say moving because I fear the engine will either not start because the starter motor won't spin the Flywheel fast enough, or it will start and then stall under the load.

I wonder what a non-brutal solution might be.

Re: Clutch slave operating, but not clutch

How much travel do you get on the slave cylinder's rod?
I've checked some old videos I made when changing the clutch cylinders, and it looks like about an inch.
I believe the Haynes manual has the nominal value somewhere.

Re: Clutch slave operating, but not clutch

dvcx said:

But why does the Clutch Disk move away from the Flywheel just because the Pressure Plate stops applying pressure on it? I assumed there must be a spring pushing the Clutch Disk away from the Flywheel, but I don't see one.

Click to expand...

There is no spring. The centreplate does not move away from the flywheel, it just stops dragging because there is no pressure on it.

dvcx said:

In my case, we believe stiction -- that happened in only a month -- will be released by the enormous drag of the transmission on the Clutch Plate as the Flywheel is moving.

Click to expand...

Any rust on the flywheel surface caused by normal humidity in the air, or dampness in the centreplate lining material can cause it to stick onto the flywheel.

dvcx said:

I wonder what a non-brutal solution might be.

Click to expand...

Only non-brutal solution is to remove the gearbox and then the clutch.

Re: Clutch now working

We had out first really hot day today so I thought it's now or never. Expecting to be lurched -- the clutch worked fine! Everything is once again working: A/C, PW, etc..

It's taken a lot of money to get everything functioning. But I really did not want a car with a list of "not working" items.

Thank you for your great diagnosis.

Here's another puzzle. The dash is squeaking over tar strips and the steering column does the same when turning. I'm sure this simply old plastic sounds, but is there a way to silence the squeaks?

Re: Clutch now working

dvcx said:

The dash is squeaking over tar strips and the steering column does the same when turning. I'm sure this simply old plastic sounds, but is there a way to silence the squeaks?

Click to expand...

Could be something not quite tight enough. Stand on your head in the footwell and try to find every fixing that is mounting the dash and steering column. Ensure they are all tight.

As you drive, when safe, try to prod and push every separate part of the dash to identify which bits are squeaking against which others. Some graphite spray between the joints may help. Silicone spray can be used but tends to then attract dust.

Or:
Turn the radio up.