Hi, according to manual, the gearbox oil is Tutela ZC 90. I believe this can be replaced with any 90W gearbox oil. Am I right?
I am refusing to support local Fiat dealer by buying anything there (bunch of stealers/bodgers).

Any gearbox oil with viscosity GL/4 or better. Refill with car standing flat. Use garden hose and funnel. When oil comes out the filler hole it is full...

Had to edit... so full of typing errors. Had to get up as my kid doesn't care whether it is weekday or weekend or sunday for that matter.

Morten.

Be careful - most gearbox oils contain EP additives, including oils that meet GL4 and GL5 standards. I'm not disagreeing with Morten, but there are some gearbox oils that shouldn't be used.

The oil for a 45 FIRE gearbox should not contain EP additives. You can identify these by the sulphurous smell - it's really distinctive. The oil without EP additives should be no more smelly than engine oil.

I use one of two different oils - Castrol VMX, or the Tutela ZC90 oil from a FIAT specialist. There is little price difference and both seem to work the same.

Children don't really mind what day it is, they don't get bogged down with such details and live every day to the max...

The Tipo-style gearbox, used in the Uno Turbo after 1988 and in the Mk2 1372cc models, uses an 80W EP oil. This is the commonly-available gear oil. All other Uno gearboxes use the non-EP oil, so please take care not to put in the common stuff or you may have problems with synchros and bearings breaking up.

-Alex

Eh-hm, this gets interesting.
I bought gearbox oil SAE 90, API GL-4, MIL-L-2105.
The text on the can says "designed for lubrication of gearboxes (except of hypoid ones) requiring higher viscosity".
As the "EP" is not mentioned anywhere on the can, I suppose it is non-EP oil .
I was unable to locate Castrol VMX. It may be that it is sold with different designation here.

alexGS said:

Be careful - most gearbox oils contain EP additives, including oils that meet GL4 and GL5 standards. I'm not disagreeing with Morten, but there are some gearbox oils that shouldn't be used.

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Interesting. Still many thousands of things I don't know anything about... Still learning.

Morten.

And even more interesting still! According to the Haynes manual, the mk1 gearbox is supposed to be filled with Multigrade engine oil, SAE 15W/40. They recommend Duckhams Hypergrade.

Engine oil in a gearbox?

I remember filling my first mk1 gearbox with this kind of oil, and it ran fine right up to 105,000 miles when I got rid of it.

Yet the Fiat handbook recommended the Selena oil or whatever, and that seemed to have a different rating.

I need to change my gearbox oil soon. Anyone know exactly what kind a mk1 Uno should be filled with????

Chas

Well, if you can survive different language, this is what comes from the booklet sold with the car (1988, original ):
Tutela ZC 90: Oel SAE 80W/90, nicht EP fuer mechanische Wechselgetriebe, enthaelt verschleisshaemmende Zusatzstoffe.
Which, I believe, translates as:
Tutela ZC 90: Oil SAE 80W/90, without EP, for mechanical gearboxes, containing anti-wear additives.
Now, does anyone here speak German

That text is the same as in the English Uno handbook. 'anti-wear' additives are not the same as 'extreme pressure' additives. EP additives are required for hypoid bevel drives (basically, most rear axles) so it sounds like the oil that you have should be OK, (CZ)enda. Check the smell, if it seems weird then compare it with any EP gearbox oil that you can find.

Chas, yes, that sounds very familiar to use engine oil in the gearbox. The FIAT 128 Haynes manual made the same suggestion. There are apparently two viscosity scales for oils. Gearbox oil weight 90 is said to be equivalent to engine oil weight 50. So, you really can use engine oil in the gearbox. But it should be the thickest engine oil that you can find, and also try to use a basic mineral one (not semi-synthetic etc.)

I have had mixed success in the past with engine oils in FIAT gearboxes. In the 128 it worked perfectly (the 2nd gear syncro worked better with engine oil than with gearbox oil) but in the Uno 70 I found that the gearchange was worse (a bit ragged, in the words of my mother). In an X1/9 that I had recently, there was no noticeable difference between engine oil and Castrol VMX.

Unfortunately, oil branding is very different on this side of the world, so I could believe that you would have no hope of locating Castrol VMX! Similarly, most of our engine oils seem to be thicker here (because of the warmer climate I guess) and until the last year or two there were only a couple of choices of semi-synthetic.

Until recently, there was a total dearth of support for transverse-engined gearbox oil on our market, which was amazing considering that most cars are FWD these days. I'd still prefer to use a gearbox oil rather than an engine oil, since the anti-wear additives are a different package to the additives for engine oil. But, it's better to have the gearbox full of engine oil rather than almost empty of gearbox oil...

-Alex

1986Uno45S said:

And even more interesting still! According to the Haynes manual, the mk1 gearbox is supposed to be filled with Multigrade engine oil, SAE 15W/40. They recommend Duckhams Hypergrade.

Engine oil in a gearbox?

Chas

Click to expand...

Our Ritmo (Strada) Abarth is always filled with fully synthetic engine oil... (the gearbox).

Morten.

Very well, gentlemen !
Thank you for your support, I will use the SAE 90 oil and see what it does
Those who do not know already may also find it interesting that there were PSA engines (used in Citroen BX 14, Visa, Talbot - not sure about type - and PGT 205) that shared engine oil with the gearbox.
As this solution was not used after 1988 anymore, there must have been something unsatisfactory about this idea - I do not know what.
Thank you all again !

Thanks for the advice Alex and Morten

I shall use engine oil in my gearbox when I get round to changing it. It's always been a bit notchy and reluctant, even when I changed all the linkage bushes. My first mk1 45 had quite a slick gearbox in comparison (it was only a four speed though), and I ran that on engine oil quite happily.

I am wondering if my five speed 45S has gearbox oil in it that might be too thick? Maybe that is why the change can be reluctant and sticky at times, especially when it is cold. I'll change it for engine oil and see if it makes a difference.

Fingers crossed!

Chas

Good idea Chas,
I've also had great success with engine oil flushing agent added to the gearbox prior to draining (I kid you not), mostly on gearboxes that were filled with too-thick 90EP oil. The gearbox needs a good drive to get the flushing agent through it. Maybe leave it in for a week or so of gentle driving, or just one good trip should do it. Then drain out and replace with your chosen oil. Should be a noticeable difference.

Hard to say which way it might swing though, because on my Mum's Uno 70 it was the engine oil that made the change reluctant and crunchy, though that's subtly-different to 'sticky'. Only you will be able to know for sure - let us know what you find?

My plastic funnel with the garden hose attached never seems to be too far away these days...

Thanks,
-Alex

alexGS said:

Good idea Chas,
I've also had great success with engine oil flushing agent added to the gearbox prior to draining (I kid you not), mostly on gearboxes that were filled with too-thick 90EP oil. The gearbox needs a good drive to get the flushing agent through it. Maybe leave it in for a week or so of gentle driving, or just one good trip should do it. Then drain out and replace with your chosen oil. Should be a noticeable difference.

Hard to say which way it might swing though, because on my Mum's Uno 70 it was the engine oil that made the change reluctant and crunchy, though that's subtly-different to 'sticky'. Only you will be able to know for sure - let us know what you find?

My plastic funnel with the garden hose attached never seems to be too far away these days...

Thanks,
-Alex

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Well, I haven't changed the gearbox oil yet, but I've done something that has seemed to affect the gearchange action.

When fitting the anti-roll bar a month or so ago, I managed to puncture the outer driveshaft boot. It was only a small hole, but after a few weeks it started chucking out grease

Anyway, nothing for it but to take the driveshaft off and replace it with one from my stack of spares. Of course, while removing the inner boot from the gearbox, loads of oil spilled out from the gearbox. All over the driveway (ooer!).

It smelt funny, sort of pungent, so I guess it must have been the EP90 or stuff with anti wear properties?

I didn't have any oil to refill the gearbox, so just bunged it all back together with the intention of giving the gearbox a flush and oil change at a later date.

Obviously my gearbox has less oil in it than it should do, as it left quite a slick on the drive that took ages to clear up. However, even though it is low on oil the gearchange is MUCH better! It's no longer as hesitant, and it doesn't baulk the gears as bad as it did.

I can only assume that the oil it had in it was way too thick, and must have been causing drag on the selector shafts and drive dogs. This might explain its stubborness when filled to the correct level.

I have half term coming up in a week, so I'll go and buy some proper ENGINE oil rather than gearbox oil and do a change after a flush through. I'll report back on whether it makes any difference!

Chas

1986Uno45S said:

I can only assume that the oil it had in it was way too thick, and must have been causing drag on the selector shafts and drive dogs. This might explain its stubborness when filled to the correct level.

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Just out of interest, what sort of stubbornness did you encounter? I've noticed that 1st and 2nd in my mk2 Uno can be really difficult to get into at times -- problem is that I don't have much more than basic common sense knowledge about engines/gearboxes and their workings.

First gear is generally worst; even when completely stationary there are times when it takes 3-4 attempts at pulling back/pushing forward the gear stick to get it into gear -- it feels as if there just isn't a 'gap' for the gear change system to get through and the gear lever is stopped about 1/2 way between neutral and 1st. Same problem with 2nd gear, but it just doesn't happen as often.

I do understand the theory behind synchromesh, so I obviously make sure that the revs are at the right level before changing into 1st (as far as I understand it, 1st gear is the only non-synchromeshed gear); this seems to be something other than the synchromesh system stopping the gear selection though.

Hi Tony,

Have you tried double-D-clutching to get in gear? If she won’t glide into gear, release and re engage clutch then try again .

tonyfurnell said:

Just out of interest, what sort of stubbornness did you encounter? I've noticed that 1st and 2nd in my mk2 Uno can be really difficult to get into at times -- problem is that I don't have much more than basic common sense knowledge about engines/gearboxes and their workings.

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It was 1st and 2nd that were the worst on mine, and sometimes 3rd. 4th and 5th never seemed to have a problem:chin:

tonyfurnell said:

First gear is generally worst; even when completely stationary there are times when it takes 3-4 attempts at pulling back/pushing forward the gear stick to get it into gear -- it feels as if there just isn't a 'gap' for the gear change system to get through and the gear lever is stopped about 1/2 way between neutral and 1st. Same problem with 2nd gear, but it just doesn't happen as often.

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That's exactly the problem I had. Sometimes 1st would be so difficult to get into I'd have to pull away in 2nd. And 2nd would often engange with a slight 'crunch'. A very firm push would often get 1st into gear while stationary, but I wasn't happy forcing the gear lever like that.

3rd would also be a bit crunchy and reluctant, but as mentioned 4th and 5th never seemed to have a problem.

The other weird thing was that sometimes all the gears would engage fine, then for no reason 1st, 2nd and 3rd would play up!

tonyfurnell said:

I do understand the theory behind synchromesh, so I obviously make sure that the revs are at the right level before changing into 1st (as far as I understand it, 1st gear is the only non-synchromeshed gear); this seems to be something other than the synchromesh system stopping the gear selection though.

Click to expand...

A slight 'blip' on the throttle when pushing the gear lever into gear sometimes helps. But it might be worth checking your gearbox oil to see if it's the right type. It gets a bit confusing because Fiat changed the gearbox oil throughout the life of the Uno, and they also changed the gearboxes depending on the model.

Early'ish mk1's seem to require engine oil, and that's what I'll try on mine next week (I'm on half term and can do some work on my car - :woot Later gearboxes seem to need different oil specifications. Checking all my manuals (early and late Haynes, Porter and handbook) seem to give conflicting advice

When I change mine next week I'll report back and let the Forum know if it makes any difference.

It does seem ironic though that with far less oil than it should have my gear change action has never been better!

hmm well I might look into the oil situation then, when I've similarly got some time & money ... mine's a mk2 5-speed gearbox (car is 999cc IE FIRE, 1994), so I don't know whether they're perhaps more prone to it or not. Thanks for the pointer though louis, I'll see if a little extra clutch work might free it up a bit!

Hi,
Can anyone suggest a good gear oil for my 1999 UNO 1.7 diesel ?
the mannual suggest to use 80w90 GL2 grade.
But here in our market we get only GL4 with EP should I use this oil or is there somthing without EP but of GL4 grade?

Please help me