Hi folks, car would not turn over as battery was dead, tried jump leads, still dead. In the end had to push start it last night to get home. Fitted a new battery this morning, still wont turn over and have P0380 on ECU scan with pre-heat fault on dash. Is it likely to be the starter motor or a bad earth ? Is starter solenoid separate or built into starter motor ? Reversing lights also not been working recently and bulbs are OK, Thx David

davidthelodge said:

Hi folks, car would not turn over as battery was dead, tried jump leads, still dead. In the end had to push start it last night to get home. Fitted a new battery this morning, still wont turn over and have P0380 on ECU scan with pre-heat fault on dash. Is it likely to be the starter motor or a bad earth ? Is starter solenoid separate or built into starter motor ? Reversing lights also not been working recently and bulbs are OK, Thx David

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Hi, I'm assuming it's a diesel then? Does the engine turn but just not fire up or does the whole engine not turn over. If it does not turn over, is there at least a "click" from the solenoid area as you try the ignition?

Simon

as above.


If turning but not starting, then starter motor and solenoid are PROBABLY ok, then itll be fuelling issue (glow plugs if faulty wont help either).


if just a click, then its a stuck starter or faulty solenoid (built into starter). Bad earth certainly worth checking though, but if car is starting on a jump start then its likely to be the starter motor.

Thx, yes its a JTD. No click when turning ignition & its not turning engine over at all, but starts easy on a rolling start when I let the clutch out. I don't understand why I would get that code appearing if it was the starter motor that has gone. It had 4 new glow plugs fitted in the summer and have had no fault codes since.

When you have it running on a bump start grab the earth from battery to gearbox and tug/pull in all directions. It may still be broken inside the plastic sleeve. I had this on a neighbours van. If you have jump leads make a temp earth and try. Check for power going to the starter also as you could have a live problem.

Sounds very much like what happened to me. I fitted a new battery and it wouldn't start. It seemed the extra excitement provided by the new battery was enough to nacker the starter motor as it was used to a weak one. When I'd changed that, it transpired my alternator had seized solid, and the starter had tried to turn the engine over but the alternator was stopping it!
Have you tried shorting the starter to see if it's the solenoid?

Not sure how to short the starter motor, but I have checked all fuses both in dash and by battery that are related to ignition and the engine and none are blown. I have put a jump lead between the negative battery terminal and earthed back to the bare metal on engine and it turned over very very slowly when the key was turned.


I suspect I have damaged the electrics when trying to jump start the car on Friday night. Basically I tried unsucessfully to jump start my Stilo off my wife's car whist that was running with the jump leads. Will have to phone the garage in the morning and then bump start it to drive it there ASAP. Feeling really bad that I have electro-cuted my Stilo with my jump leads, hope I have not damaged the ECU !

My money is on the earth mate. You had it turning. That is not a good earth but you had it. Check the battery voltage to make sure you have not drained it and undo your earth al both ends or three if it also goes to car body and give a good clean. If still nothing try again with the jump lead but try closer to the starter or scrub clean a but of engine to clamp it to.

BTW. I don't think you killed your car. Jumped mine many a time with the old battery and in October I jumped a woman (Har, har) and had the leads the wrong way round with no damage. Buy did that spark

Ok its been in the garage this morning. 1st they thought it was the starter motor but that worked when they took it off and connected it directly. They concluded it was a bad earth, so they put a new earth wire from the negative terminal of the battery to earth on the engine. Now it starts no problem, however its comes up "engine fault" on the display has gone into limp mode and on Fiat ECU scan shows code P0180 "Fuel Temperature circuit malfunction" ECU received a very high single from the sensor, fault present now. I have re-set it twice and it comes back on.


I think the garage they have by-passed the problem and found a way to make it start, problem is what is the real problem?

check the wires that go to the fuel filter multi-plug for any defects, also check the plug itself, make sure its plugged in and isn't damaged. beyond that it could be the sensor itself . if you can use a multi-meter check the voltage to sensor, the supply should be between 12 and 14v. good luck

Thx for your reply, I don't have a multimeter but maybe there is no power getting to the fuel temperature sensor at all because the normal earth has been by passed. My hunch is the ECU was saying don't send power to starter motor for some reason and this has now been by passed by the new earth connection which runs from battery negative terminal to the engine block.


The car was running perfectly with no warning lights until Friday night and I am pretty sure it would not start only due to the battery just giving up after 5.5 years. Have had old battery checked and its scrap. So I still think the problems are something to do with using the jump leads

No problem. the sensor should be still getting a 12v supply, but if your saying the earth cable has been relocated then it may be that the sensor is getting a poor ground/earth. I cant see why they would relocate the ground cable. it may bee worth while cleaning the original ground and then re-bolt the new ground cable back in the correct location, making sure that there is good metal to metal contact. Also if you have a light tester you can connect it to the battery and test the ground on the sensor-multi plug, if the light illuminates then you have a good ground.
Also, no damage or problems should arise from jumping the vehicle so long as you put the positive lead to the positive on Battery and the neg to neg. if you didn't then there is a chance that you have short circuit the ECU. Not implying that this is what you did, just giving you an example.

also the ECU usually only stops the starter from working in the event that the immobiliser isn't deactivated when key is in ignition but even then bypassing the original earth wouldn't solve this problem if you see what I mean.

Thx, I checked the 2 electrical plugs that plug into the fuel filter assembly and they were both disconnected and hanging loose. Plugged them both back in and cleared the Engine fault on ECU scan and now all seems to be fine. Totally puzzled as to how they were disconnected unless either the garage unplugged them for some reason, but I doubt it. Or they were blow off by a power surge, don't think that's would happen either. I also tried old battery and to my surprise it started the car !


Thx for all your help

good stuff buddy, glad I could help, its likely that someone hasn't connected them back up after working on car. Take care m8