General EPS has died.

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General EPS has died.

tron9000

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so my girlfriend's '52 1.2 stilo is poorly again :(

The EPS warning light is coming and she had to drive a good 10 miles home without power steering with bairn in back.

She had been to the garage to get it reset through the ECU header as before. It got reset, she back out of garage, fault came back, this also indicated that the EPS fuse hasn't blown either (cos it wouldn't have worked for that brief moment) so this time its well a truly knacked!

So i plan to give something back to this forum and actually form a guide for changing an EPS unit in a stilo, whilst fixing my lasses car without paying a mechanic £40 and hour!!(y)

I found a guy on you tube who replaced his steering unit on a punto (it was in Italian, but I got the jist)

I had a poke around the same area in the stilo, and it looks like a similar setup, but if I can't find a replacement stilo steering unit, can I use a punto's?

cheers
 
Totally different (and better) steering column in the Stilo compared to the Punto.

I changed mine. Easy if you take the corner off the dashboard (undo fusebox cover screws) and remember to have a 3/8" socket on hand - that's 3/8" for the nut part (about 9.5mm) - 1/2" drive would be a good idea - this is to loosen the pinch bolt for the universal joint onto the rack. The correct size is metric but it is an external Torx (six-pointed star) - nice if you have it, but use a 3/8" imperial socket if you don't.

The upper plastic column cover has two screws near the steering wheel that you reach from under the column switch, by getting the rubber flap things off the stalks. The screws are probably 4mm Allen-key jobbies. Same size as the ones you undid to remove the lower plastic column cover.

The column is heavy but simply removed by undoing four nuts under its bracket.

You'll need to remove the steering wheel first, obviously, and you'll also need to remove the key barrel from the ignition lock. Just put the key in and press in a spring-loaded tang with a small screwdriver. Hopefully your replacement column is second-hand and comes with a steering lock - then you just pop your lock barrel in. You do need the key to remove the lock barrel. So, if the replacement hasn't had the lock barrel removed and doesn't come with a key, or if it is new, that's a huge pain as you will need to chisel out the steering lock bolts (maybe twice over) and somehow find new bolts to install your lock on the other column.

After that it's all pretty easy - you're probably best to swap over your column switch levers (AND steering angle sensor if the car has ESP and is pre-2004) plus the clock spring. Afterward, if you have ESP, you'll probably need to reset the centre position of the steering angle sensor (by using MultiECUScan, etc.) - otherwise you'll have an ABS/ASR failure. I did, but reset it quickly and the whole job was done in an hour or so.

-Alex
 
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spot on, thanks for that, will let you know how it goes and I'll take lots of pictures, as I can't seem to find any on the web.

Cheers(y)
 
Have you checked the battery? It's quite possibly this, so might be worth checking, and changing first :)

Good point - I should explain that I changed mine only after I read multiple fault codes for internal faults and ECU faults. It would be very worthwhile to get MultiECUScan (or equivalent) connected first to check what faults you have before undertaking the replacement.

-Alex
 
its not the battery. checked, double checked, triple checked, its not the battery.

reasons why:

  1. it starts
  2. bat voltage it at roughly above 12V
  3. charge voltage is 13 odd volts
  4. battery can crank the engine, so there's enough umff in it (plenty of CCA)
  5. its NOT the battery!
  6. I'm not taking it to the garage YET again to confirm that the battery is ok and get charged for the privilege (recession on you know)
  7. if it was the battery then (as said before) the fault wouldn't have cleared, and then come back again.
  8. its used on a regular basis, so its not like its sitting around doing nothing but draining the battery.
  9. Did i mention its not the battery?

New thread cos new problem, the thread before was essentially finished as the problem cleared.

and (if you read the first post in this thread) i asked if a Punto's steering motor could be used instead and that I was gonna take some photoies and put them up on here...which in my eyes counts as a new thread/topic to me.
 
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New thread cos new problem, the thread before was essentially finished as the problem cleared.

thanks, and I'll update with progress in the future.

Shame you didn't post the outcome on your previous thread like you said you would. The forum is a two way give and take thing, and the outcome may have helped other members. People that only 'take' soon get known, and then other members are less inclined to help them with future problems.
 
its not the battery. checked, double checked, triple checked, its not the battery.

reasons why:
  1. it starts
  2. bat voltage it at roughly above 12V
  3. charge voltage is 13 odd volts
  4. battery can crank the engine, so there's enough umff in it (plenty of CCA)
  5. its NOT the battery!
  6. I'm not taking it to the garage YET again to confirm that the battery is ok and get charged for the privilege (recession on you know)
  7. if it was the battery then (as said before) the fault wouldn't have cleared, and then come back again.
  8. its used on a regular basis, so its not like its sitting around doing nothing but draining the battery.
  9. Did i mention its not the battery?
New thread cos new problem, the thread before was essentially finished as the problem cleared.

and (if you read the first post in this thread) i asked if a Punto's steering motor could be used instead and that I was gonna take some photoies and put them up on here...which in my eyes counts as a new thread/topic to me.

Good luck getting it solved :wave:
 
Shame you didn't post the outcome on your previous thread like you said you would.

Bloke at the garage reset the faults and me girlfriend reports the problem cured!

Steering is "light". Though how long it will be like this for is another matter.

...hows that for an outcome?

Also I am fully aware of the way forum give and take works, I do post on other forums for the other vehicles I have fixed, hence why I'll be putting up photo's of my findings.
 
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just a little heads up, I've been busy taking photos this evening of how I changed the EPAS unit on the stilo.

As I understand, you guys have a problem on this forum with chrome throwing a hissy when you try to upload photos?

I have found out a little trick too with removing the barrel-lock holder too. I bought a unit without a steering wheel and barrel-lock holder.

EPAS warning light is still on. I'm hoping its just a case of resetting the centre position, so going into garage tomorrow to get it scanned and (fingers x'd) clear the fault.

its a bit late for uploading photies now, but hope to have them on by sunday (once i got firefox installed to upload them).

but in the mean time, i got meat to burn on the BBQ and soak up the awesome weather! cheers and watch this space.
 
I haven't tried Chrome - the problems I have are with only being able to upload one photo each message (iPhone) and a floating black bar that obscures the writing and gives too many other options (see pic below) making it hard to edit text. I got around the problem for the guide by placing comments, one with each picture. I know about the app, but I find it harder to use, doesn't seem to have all the graphics, and I couldn't find how to search (don't think it can upload either). Lots of work has gone into it and I'm sure it's excellent, I just prefer to get the full experience.

Glad you got around the steering column lock problem.

I think the other two went a bit overboard with their comments on this thread - I posted a question weeks ago and had a minimal response, so it goes both ways. I'm just interested to see how you got on! I still think it would be a good investment to get MultiECUScan set up and registered - can do it all online in a few minutes (Gendan sell a nice package of cables) and be ready for next time it's needed.

-Alex
 

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I posted a question weeks ago and had a minimal response, so it goes both ways.

Possibly because nobody knew the answer to your problem Alex?

Personally, If I don't know the answer, or have any constructive suggestions, I think it's better to post nothing rather than a lot of misleading waffle.
.
 
Possibly because nobody knew the answer to your problem Alex?

Personally, If I don't know the answer, or have any constructive suggestions, I think it's better to post nothing rather than a lot of misleading waffle.
.

That's a fair point :) no hard feelings

I'll get it sorted sometime... just been away for a while and got home last night. Was a horribly long day of six hours in the air and six hours in airports yesterday.

Looking forward to the outcome of the EPS fault... will the fault code clear, I wonder? As was pointed out earlier, we DO need the result posted...

-Alex
 
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I'm not it. just been a bit poorly (seems that BBQ backfired a bit!)

just resizing the huge photos and uploading them now.
 
Right, here goes:

First off, this is how I did it, I wouldn't take it as gospel and if anyone has any comments on ways to do things differently, then go for it.(y)

Once i get some more time and feedback pending, I'll post this in the how-to section.

List of tools:

  • 3/8 Rachet spanner
  • 3/8, 300mm extender bar with elbow joint
  • 3/8, 100mm extender bar
  • set of Allen/Hex sockets for 3/8 driver
  • E12 interal Torx socket for 3/8
  • Screw driver that takes different bits
  • Allen/hex bits
  • Trox(star) driver bits
  • A torch
  • flat head screw driver
  • thin cutting disc on angle grinder or dremmel
  • An extra EPAS unit
  • 22mm socket or pump plier/grips

I got my EPAS unit, off a 05 stilo, from ebay for £40 inc. P+P, utter (y)BARGAIN!(y) For that price what have I got to loose? If it didn't work, I swap back the old unit and go back to the drawing board.

They usually go for a bit more: £70-80 mark. This one however had no steering wheel & no ignition barrel housing, so I had to put more work in, which I didn't mind as I was on a budget.

You can buy them with everything, steering wheel & the lot (bar the ignition key barrel itself).

So, with that, I took photo's of the steps I took to swap EVERYTHING over to the new unit.

Disconnect battery before carrying out this work!
Turn your steering wheel so the wheels are facing forward.

ok, so here's the area you should be looking at:
DSC033781.JPG


open the fuse-box cover and undo the 2 bolts on the top edge with a torx/star bit, and the 2 near the hinge with an Allen bit:
DSC03377.JPG


DSC03376.JPG


Next; take a 4mm allen bit and remove the 3 bolts holding the under cover of the steering column as shown:
DSC033791.JPG


DSC033801.JPG


Remove the cover with the column adjuster in and then out once you've freed it up:
DSC033831.JPG


You should be at this point now:
DSC03393.JPG


using a 3mm allen bit, remove 2 bolts on either sized of the steering wheel, between the wheel and storks to free up the top cover of the steering column:
DSC03416.JPG

This will require you to be on your back in the footwell, I couldn't get photos cos the area where the bolt head was difficult for the camera to pick out, but you should be able to see where the bolt heads are.

I want to point out that I know some of these pictures, I've dropped the column before removing the wiring connections. This is so I had a good angle on all the photos I took.

Also, I found you cannot accidently put the wrong connector in the wrong socket, so if it don't fit putting it back together, then stop pushing ITS THE WRONG HOLE!So on-ward to removing the connections:

Pull the connections out of the back of the ignition barrel:
DSC03412.JPG


On the entry end of the Barrel is a connector on top of the barrel with a Black and white wire, remove that:
DSC03414.JPG


Then remove the white connector (wipers control):
DSC03413.JPG


on the top of the colunm is a backshell with a cable clip. Lift up the clip to free the 2 connector. Sdjust the colunm so that is fully out and remove the backshell, and remove the 2 connectors shown (indicators & lights):
DSC03418.JPG


DSC03421.JPG


Go underneath the steering wheel to find another connector and remove it (horn & airbag):
DSC03422.JPG


This should now free up the loow from the steering wheel:
DSC03419.JPG


Now disconnect the connections to the Power steering unit:
DSC03388.JPG


Now the fun starts! Take the internal Trox driver + rachet setup (see below) and undo the Torx bolt on the elbow joint behind the clutch pedal:
DSC03405.JPG


DSC03404.JPG


DSC03407.JPG


Pull the bolt out and with some very gentle persuasion, the joint should come off the splined stub. You'll notice in the picture below that theres is a small recess taking out of the stub, thtas where the bolt passes through, use this a reference point when putting the joint back on the splined stub:
DSC03420.JPG


This next part WILL require and extra set of hands to stop the unit falling on you whilst you undo the bolts!

There are 4x hex bolts holding up the unit to the dash. Get on your back in the footwell and locate them:
DSC03390.JPG

Get your missus to bring out a brew - I mean it, your gonna need one soon!


Whilst she's there ask her to hold onto the steering wheel whilst you undo those 4 bolts. Use a hex bit socket on an an extension bar, which should provide you with enough torque to crack the bolts:
DSC034081.JPG

mine had a rounded end, so you've got some wiggle get a better angle.
DSC03409.JPG


Hopefully, if all wiring connections have been freed, and you took the joint off the spline you should be able to pull the unit out:
DSC03411.JPG


Sup brew!


So heres the unit, next to my replacement:
DSC03424.JPG

now I have to get the ignition barrel, storks & wheel off the old unit and onto the new!

Now, alexGS, I know you said that I'd have to destory the bolts holding the igition barrel holder to the column, but I came up with a better way that doesn't mean find replacement bolts!

Take an angle grinder and fit the thinnest cutting disc you can find. then cut a slot into the heads of the blanked out bolts holding the ingnition barrel to the column.Alternatively, you can use a dremmel tool with a cutting disc:
DSC03429.JPG


Then its just a case of undoing them with a flat bladed screwdriver and viola! bolts you can re-use:
DSC03430.JPG


DSC03431.JPG


Take the ignition barrel holder off the old unit and fit to the new:
DSC03433.JPG

you can see the spring tab where you can take the whole key part of the ignition out. With the key in and a screwdriver pressing on this tab, you can remove this and put it into a new column, if it already has a holder.

Here's the new holder fitted:
DSC034341.JPG


Next, undo the hex bolt holding the brass clip:
DSC03435.JPG


Then undo the 3 bolts in the back of the steering wheel holding the airbag in place, with an allen/hex bit. (sorry it appears I forgot to take photos of this bit!)

Carefully move the the airbag unit out of the way. Then using a screwdriver...I mean chisel;) + a hammer, remove the nut cage around the 2 locking nuts holding the steering wheel to the column:
DSC03438.JPG

This will destory the cage, but its not going to be missed (so far I've driven it for a week and the steering wheel's not come off). Then using a 22mm socket or pump pliers or grips, undo the 2 locking nuts.

They are quite thin, and you can't really undo both at the same time, so you have to try and undo 1 at a time with the tool your using.

There is a plastic collar that fits round the column underneath the brass ring clip, just below the storks. on this collar is a cutout that accepts a metal clip on the column. Now, I broke this trying to get the wheel off the column, its not too important if broken, but you should use it as a reference when fitting the wheel back onto the new column

With this clip freed, the storks + wheel should come off. Cos I bust mine I just let the weight of the unit pull itself away from the wheel:
DSC03440.JPG


Now looking at the splines on the end of the steering rod:
DSC03442.JPG


you will notice there are 3 wider splines around it. They are different widths apart so you can only put the wheel back on one way. Try and lines these up with the grooves on the wheel's splines and fit the wheel back onto the unit.

Re-fit the locking nuts, tighten up the brass ring clip + fit the airbag unit back into place and HEY-PRESTO:
DSC034432.JPG


Now its just a case of fitting it back in by doing the steps in reverse.

Word of warning though:
When re-fitting the unit back into the car, make sure that wires and looms are clear of the 4 main fixing points before you torque up the bolts. I didn't and ended up with an alternator fault showing and the drivers side indicators not working cos I'd pinched the wires!

once you have unit back in place, all connectors back in place, don't put the covers on just yet, fire her up and check that all the important things are working: indicator lights, side lights, horn etc.

If not check you put all your connectors back, if you have then check that you've not pinched any wires whilst refitting the unit.

Your EPAS fail warnings may still come up as per usual, but so far we've been drving with it on for a week now and the steering works fine! So we plan to get it cleared if & when we sell the car. Hopefully clearing it won't cause a confliction, it shouldn't.

like I said before, I wouldn't take this as gospel, I did this all by eye and no manual, user beware and all that.

But if you do need a reference or proof it can be done yourself, then here you go.

Let me know what you think,

Cheers
 
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Nice writeup there. Lots of good points about solutions, particularly with the thin cutting disc - glad you could get enough torque on the screwdriver to undo those bolts. You can get new replacements for those bolts and in England the insurance companies are probably happier if you do, since, with slot-heads they might be considered a tad too easy to remove (just a thought).

I don't have a 'missus' so I managed to get the column out by myself - helps to take out all bolts except one that's easy to reach - then hold the wheel and undo the bolt one-handed. Getting it back up is a bit of a workout. Good that you pointed out how to clear the dashboard corner and also to take care with the wiring not to trap it.

I still think it would be a good idea to connect with MultiECUScan and clear that fault code, but the fact that the steering is working is a good sign. When mine had a fault code, there was no assistance.

One final thing - I removed the steering wheel nut without removing the cage - think it was a 23 or 24mm socket over the whole thing, seemed to come off easily.

-Alex
 
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to be honest, the bolts holding the barrel on weren't that hard to remove. Plus i don't think your insurance broker needs to know about them....so SHHHHhhhh:D. You could gunk them back up with some heavy duty epoxy i suppose, or tack them with a welder?

I tried to take the cage and nuts off as a whole, but i used an 23mm & 24mm socket and kept slipping, maybe cos it was a star type and not a hexagonal type?

My girlfriends not bothered about the fault light on the dash, plus we found an ECU reader from Machine Mart for the same price as the garage was charging for the privilege!

Like I said, we'll get it cleared when we sell it. But for now its all good! in fact we think its got lighter steering than before!
 
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