interesting, how much smaller final drive are we talking about here

With the Seis it's only the equivalent of 500rpm or so.

My punto mk1 stock has got 165/65/14 tyres, I think the mk2 stock is 165/70/14 tyres. This is equivalent 2.9% increase in diameter, which is equivalent to 2.9% reduction in final drive. So if MK2 keeps the sames final ration as Mk1 then they will be going faster at a given rpm. My suspicion is that they gone lower. After some searches I believe the Mk2 final drive is around 3.43:1. My Mk1 old box final drive is estimated to 3.75:1. This is a lot of change and I am suspecting tomorrow when I will proper test the box on the motorway that this will be the case. The 5th gear will be a lot of an overdrive, and I will not be able to get top speed in 5th, it will be 4th for top speed. I hope I am wrong.

just came back from highway with my mk1, top speed a little above 160km/h and above 170 going downhill 155/70 13 and 145/70 13 tires, so smaller the tire higher the top speed on stock stuff?

2,9% for 1cm smaller tire? from 170kmh to 165kmh top speed

how did u change gear ratio?

flisko said:

just came back from highway with my mk1, top speed a little above 160km/h and above 170 going downhill 155/70 13 and 145/70 13 tires, so smaller the tire higher the top speed on stock stuff?

Click to expand...

Smaller the tyre the more (tyre) revolutions to cover a given distance, so higher indicated top speed.

fingers99 said:

Smaller the tyre the more (tyre) revolutions to cover a given distance, so higher indicated top speed.

Click to expand...

only indicated not real?

Yep. The speedo is driven off the diff, so reflects gearbox revolutions. GPS would give a more accurate representation.

ohh gps forgot about that

Final verdict as follow:

It turns out that the box I got from a 2003 MK2 has the same gearing as my old 1998 Mk1 box. My initial impression was wrong.

I just driven it today on the motorway and the speedo shows same speed as before i.e. 60mph/3000rpm. Also the miles meter is exactly as before.

So Mk2 box, probably from a 1.2 8V, 60bhp, has same ratios as the Mk1 box. The top of box is not the same but the Mk1 top can be swapped over. The speed sensor will need to be swapped over, too. The inner CV joints also are not the same the Mk2 one is slightly stronger (bigger) but cannot be fitted to the Mk1 driveshaft, so the Mk1 CV joints need to be swapped to the new box. Fortunately that worked fine.

So all together is worth considering a Mk2 box when replacing the original box on a Mk1. As the boxed are used, than is more likely a Mk2 box will be in better shape then a used Mk1 box, so for this reason is worth doing the mods above to make it fit.

If anyone doing it reads this post, the trick is to replace the cups one at a time (I'm assuming that's what you did) or the diff will tend to drop (can be fished back into place with a broom handle!).

Good outcome, though.

fingers99 said:

If anyone doing it reads this post, the trick is to replace the cups one at a time (I'm assuming that's what you did) or the diff will tend to drop (can be fished back into place with a broom handle!).

Good outcome, though.

Click to expand...

Yes, I see what you mean. I was lucky. The replacement box came with one CV joint fitted and cup. I was hoping to use it and then fitted the other cup to the box. After fitting the box I realised the cup and CV joint on the new box was not suitable and I could not use. So I need to get it out and replaced it with my old one. So I guess I was lucky. My worry at the moment is that the drive shaft seals as they have been disturbed by the cups removal may start leaking!!!

In my -- I've done two -- experience it either happens immediately (they get nicked when the shaft goes out or in) or you're OK for the forseeable future. When I nicked one the road was covered in transmission fluid before I'd even got round to bolting up the hub nut!

Looks like I should be OK as there is no licks.
However, the gearbox may still be slightly different after all.
When I was driving yesterday I was getting 70mph but the revs where showing just below 3500rmp. I am pretty sure before the MK1 box was showing revs just above 3500rpm.
After doing some searches from some German sites evidently(mechanical minded)

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rc...=fXFOe4bViYvwsvywUZSFeg&bvm=bv.63934634,d.ZG4

mk2 fifth = 0.897, mk1 fifth = 0.902
mk2 final = 3,438, mk1 final = 3.563

Fifth and final driver are slightly different. Overall the gearing is slightly longer which I did originally only noticed in town driving but should make motorway cruising less noisy. I already noticed that but most of it is down to quieter box.

Also by looking at my old box before I chucked it away is possible that the carrier bearings on the diff go (outer race thins out) making the diff noisy, which means a fix by just changing those bearings may be an option as the diff should be serviceable without removing the gearbox.

Anyone know if a mk2 punto 5speed will fit a 1999 punto 16v sporting???

if mounting are same you can fit it

is your sporting a mk2 with 6 speeds?

'99 sporting is mk1 Flisko

To answer the question, yes it will fit but not sure what the differences in ratios would be... If it were me I would look at fitting the mk2 6 speed instead, sure one can be got for similar money as a 5 speed.

I've heard the 5 speed has better ratios and tbh I don't get on with 6speeds because I forget I've got another gear?? Yeah it's a mk1 1.25 16v sporting (FIRE).
I get a discount at the salvage yard near me because of my work and they don't have a 16v but do have 8v's and mk2 16v gearboxes, just not 100% if my clutch will fit, mountings are the same or if my gear linkages will connect up right.

8v and 16v gearbox is same, atleast in mk2

Do you know if the mk2 box will fit a mk1?

yeah it will bolt up fella don't worry about that.... you may as well get a new clutch kit while your at it, which need to match your flywheel, i think its same as mk2 but just buy one for your car and it will fit in the box no worries..

basically anything FIRE engined bar tjets will bolt on, and also the flywheels and clutches are all interchangeable too... the only differences are ratios and size of clutch plates (which means flywheel must match clutch).