Hi folks, my first post here so please be gentle!

I'm hoping to complete the purchase of a used 100hp next week (private sale). I've been for a test drive, very happy with the car, paperwork all looks good. I just have two areas where I'm looking for advice. I have almost zero experience working on cars beyond very basic stuff so please excuse my ignorance!

1. Exhaust

The car was fitted with this 'FT853H' exhaust by Arnold Clark before the current owner picked it up. Google tells me this exhaust was intended for a Fiat 500 1.4, would this have any impact on performance or engine health? The number written on the bottom in marker pen in case you're wondering where I got that from!



2. Rust on the rear axle

I've seen plenty of threads about this already, I know there's been lots of discussion already about how to treat this etc. A friend of mine who has some knowledge saw these photos and thinks this looks like a DIY fix, but I wanted to ask on here too. Does this look salvageable or am I looking at an imminent failure/replacement axle? I appreciate it may be hard to tell just from these photos I took on my phone









Thanks very much for any input at all, fingers crossed I'll be picking up my first Fiat at the end of next week!

thx yourAdvice

1) exhaust look wrong. It's just looks puny and wrong. Just wrong. But it probably won't have any detrimental drawbacks to being fitted. Still looks wrong tho...

2) it's hard to say if it's imminent or if it's got a few years without physically seeing/poking/prodding/scraping. They tend to fail at the spring cups...


(Not mine, one I replaced for a customer)
So have a good poke round there. I'm currently trying to figure out an alternative to the mega money new beam, so keep an eye out on some of the active threads. If the rear beam is that condition tho, have a good look around the floorpan. What mileage is it? I bought mine with 90k and the beam looks brand new compared to that. But it's had money spent, decent rear shocks have been fitted at some point, not cheap muck

Advice - Buying 100hp - Rust & Exhaust

That's one rusty axle! Jack the car up and have a good poke with a screw driver to see how bad it is. Then if I bought it I'd remove it from the car, get it shot blasted and if needed, welded then primed with red oxide then hammerite black top coated. Then I'd be fitting new rear springs.

The exhaust looks like a pea shooter! That's something you can change in the future.

It's on 81k miles, but up in the North East of Scotland we have the sea breeze and main roads that are gritted/salted for maybe 5 months a year, so the underside of most cars in these parts looks pretty bad!

The plan as things stand would be to take it to my aforementioned pal's next weekend and wire-brush/POR15 all around the cups.

The exhaust does look horrible, sounds pretty bellow-y too but having not heard the stock exhaust in real life I don't have much to compare it to. Half tempted to pick up one of those £7 chrome tips off ebay just to hide my shame...

So I should be getting in about it with a screwdriver when I go to potentially buy this thing on Thursday really? I mean this is really dealbreaker stuff if they're about to fail surely! I'm looking at £1750 for the car which is a good price on the face of it, but not so great if I'm looking at a new axle...

Yes a good poke with a screwdriver.
It may just be surface rust or it could be serious corrosion. Do you have a toffee hammer? One of them would be ideal to have a tap of the metal with. We use them doing inspections on trucks. A solid but rusted axle / spring cup will ping when tapped but if badly corroded it'll be more of a dull thud sound when applying a quick firm tap.
If you buy it at the very least it needs the springs removed to get into the bottom of the cup to clean it up.
Red oxide paint adheres and protects metal with surface rust better than new clean steel. Then hammerite top coat then waxoyl to finish it off. It should last the car out after all that!!

I've treated worse than that.

My sister's 54 plate was touch and go in places, with large flaky chucks coming off around the edges of the spring pan, but I ground it back, treated it with a rust stopper and waxoiled it up.

That was nearly three years ago and it's still in good nic.

To get good access to all the nooks and crannies you really need to drop the axle off the car, but it's not too difficult.

You'll need new springs as they aren't in good condition and the bottom of the shocks are rusting through too.

With the obvious caveat that it's hard to judge the state of the beam precisely from a few pictures, I'd say it's seriously rusted, but still treatable providing you're prepared to remove the beam from the car to do it.

That said, I can't help wondering how much corrosion there is, visible or otherwise, on the rest of the car; personally I wouldn't want to take this one on, but I appreciate the difficulty of finding anything of that age that's lived its life in the harsh weather conditions prevalent in your local area.

Another indicator you can check easily is the state of the sump pan. I'd expect to find it either rusty, or replaced.

Thanks to everyone for their replies, I've contacted the seller with my concerns and he's been really reasonable. I'll definitely broaden my inspection of the underside to see how bad things are elsewhere.
dozer - when you say toffee hammer, do you literally mean those tiny metal hammers for breaking toffee, or am I being thick?

Advice - Buying 100hp - Rust & Exhaust

Chrshndrsn said:

Thanks to everyone for their replies, I've contacted the seller with my concerns and he's been really reasonable. I'll definitely broaden my inspection of the underside to see how bad things are elsewhere.


dozer - when you say toffee hammer, do you literally mean those tiny metal hammers for breaking toffee, or am I being thick?

Click to expand...

Lol. They have a small diameter wooden handle but regular length and a small head. There's probably a correct name for them but we call them toffee hammers. You would use one to knock in small nails into wood I suppose.

Re: Advice - Buying 100hp - Rust & Exhaust

A proper toffee hammer is made entirely of metal, is very small, and is used primarily for, er, breaking toffee.

What I think dozer is referring to is more correctly known as a 1/4lb cross pein hammer and is used primarily for knocking small nails into wood. Its secondary use is to cause small but painful injuries to the user's thumb when attempting to knock small nails into wood.

Re: Advice - Buying 100hp - Rust & Exhaust

Hi,
There is actually an official inspection hammer. Metal handle and plastic head. Sealy make one

Search MOT corrosion hammer

Robert G8RPI

Put a trim on the exhaust. Its really no big deal.

100bhp axles are like rocking horse poo and this one is heading south fast. A spray with Waxoyl/Dinitrol/ACF-50 or similar might help but it wont get under where paint or even metal is flaking. Seriously, the only reliable option is to take the axle off the car and do it properly. It's attached with 6 bolts, brake hoses and hand brake cables.

A grit blast and powder coat should be about £100. Cheap at 1/2 the price TBH. Make sure the coaters use a zinc passivate primer to stop any remaining rust. You will need to strip off all the pipes and hubs but a nasty grinder wire brush will need the same. It's a horrible job and not a little hazardous.

The blaster will show if it needs any welding work so get a good look before its coated.

DaveMcT said:

Seriously, the only reliable option is to take the axle off the car, clean down with a grinder and wire cup brush, prime and paint or maybe use Hammerite - at least 2 coats. It's attached with 6 bolts brake pipes and hand brake cables.

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Absolutely.

And you'll need to strip off, clean, lubricate and replace all the brake parts & the hubs, but that's a job that'd likely need doing anyway and should ensure several years of trouble free operation from the known-to-be-troublesome brakes.

Re: Advice - Buying 100hp - Rust & Exhaust

g8rpi said:

Hi,
There is actually an official inspection hammer. Metal handle and plastic head. Sealy make one


Robert G8RPI

Click to expand...

I know you're just showing us that one is available but using that would not tell us if a wheel nut is loose or a u bolt nut is loose etc. metal against metal is the only way to tell.
I'm trying to think what a plastic inspection hammer would be useful for.........!!!!
Vosa use the metal type in their roadside weigh stations also at the test stations.

Re: Advice - Buying 100hp - Rust & Exhaust

According to their website, that Sealey Hammer is:

"The only official design of tool fully approved for MOT use by VOSA in the UK".

The head is constructed from a hard plastic specifically designed not to damage good metal but to penetrate excessively corroded areas.

It's specifically mentioned in the MOT tester's manual.

That exhaust will affect emissions and performance and would have been fitted purely because of price. It Arnold Clarke fitted it it says everything I need to know about them and suggests comments I have read of them may be well founded. One of the best things about the 100HP is the refined exhaust note. You can get an entire system on the net for £195 and its not difficult to fit if you have a pit or access to a lift.

Now all this talks of axles has me worried so I am thinking of removing my axle and doing a total refurb with new bushes / bearings as well as a re coat. I may well do a post once it has been done.

If that were mine I would remove and shot blast as suggested herein and then get a little reinforcement done for peace of mind before refitting. I think thats what I am going to do although the last time I looked my axle didnt look a cause for concern.

I'm starting to feel ill...!

Thank you all so much for your input, really! I'd honestly hoped this could be a messy but straightforward DIY job but all the talk or removing/blasting/replacing brakes (and while I'm at it probably shocks & springs...) has got me thinking this is potentially a lot more trouble and expense than say, just finding another car...

Lifting the car, getting in about with a wire brush, and giving the essential areas a clean, prep & paint is totally feasible for me to do myself with help from a friend.

Getting the axle off the car, blasted, painted, having all that refitted... Almost all of that I can't do myself, and I'm not sure how happy a garage would be to have half a Panda taking up one of their lifts while all that was going on (and I have no where to store half a car myself...)

On top of that and there's no guarantee until the rust is cleaned off that the axle would really hold up for much longer anyway. So I'd have to buy the car to find out... it's a hell of a punt!

Argh. Glad I asked though, and really such a great response from you all, thank you. Really not sure what to do now!

petercresswell - which exhaust are you referring to? Could you give me a link? I've been looking but there's not many resources on anything other than the Ragazzon and the Marelli and both sound a little too boy-racer for my tastes from the videos I've seen. Something that sounds as close to stock (or the Abarth 500) as possible would suit me better!

Chrshndrsn said:

I'm starting to feel ill...!

Thank you all so much for your input, really! I'd honestly hoped this could be a messy but straightforward DIY job but all the talk or removing/blasting/replacing brakes (and while I'm at it probably shocks & springs...) has got me thinking this is potentially a lot more trouble and expense than say, just finding another car...

Lifting the car, getting in about with a wire brush, and giving the essential areas a clean, prep & paint is totally feasible for me to do myself with help from a friend.

Getting the axle off the car, blasted, painted, having all that refitted... Almost all of that I can't do myself, and I'm not sure how happy a garage would be to have half a Panda taking up one of their lifts while all that was going on (and I have no where to store half a car myself...)

On top of that and there's no guarantee until the rust is cleaned off that the axle would really hold up for much longer anyway. So I'd have to buy the car to find out... it's a hell of a punt!

Argh. Glad I asked though, and really such a great response from you all, thank you. Really not sure what to do now!

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Most of the axle is made from 3mm steel with some parts from thicker material. That takes some serious corrosion to rot through. However welds and joints tend to rot faster so cracks develop. Being thick stuff its much easier to patch repair than bodywork and has no need to look pretty.

I'm expecting to remove and replace my back axle this coming week. It's really not that bad to do. DIY clean and paint of the axle is far more hassle TBH. Doing it in place just isn't going to do the job properly and you will get metal crap into your eyes. Guaranteed.

You could find another 100bhp but they are all likely to have rotten rear subframes. This one can be grit blasted and coated for around £100 with perhaps another £100 (or less) if the spring pans need any welding work.

Having spent an afternoon to simply round off the sharp cut edges on my new axle, I really would not want the job of de-rusting it with a cup wire brush and angle grinder.