Sweetsixteen said:

This can be a difficult call, raising the age-old question:
How do you sell a car that you know will give the new owner serious trouble, even though the trouble is at the moment hidden?

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That's the moral hazard.

Personally I'd try to do exactly what Robert has done - get your money back, and then plaster enough details around the internet so that anyone contemplating buying it will easily find the history if they do a google search.

Selling privately without disclosing the history would not be an option for me; in extremis, I'd most likely put the car into an auction.

jrkitching said:

That's the moral hazard.
Selling privately without disclosing the history would not be an option for me; in extremis, I'd most likely put the car into an auction.

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Ah ... but would you still disclose, at the auction, the potential problem with the car?

As I see it, however you sell the car EXCEPT BACK TO THE SUPPLYING DEALER you still face this moral hazard. An auction doesn't let you off the hook.

If the dealer gets the car back, then - quite rightly - he is the one who has to face the problem, and the come-back will still be on him if the next buyer hits trouble.

Sweetsixteen said:

Ah ... but would you still disclose, at the auction, the potential problem with the car?

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Fortunately I've never had to make that call.

But I'd bet serious money that it's exactly what most reputable dealers would do, if faced with a 'problem' car.

Sweetsixteen said:

Ah ... but would you still disclose, at the auction, the potential problem with the car?

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That's a moral question, but legally you have no obligation. Most people say nothing about condition. Virtually none of the consumer protection legislation applies to auctions. Apart from outright premeditated fraud, the buyer carries all the risk.

If buying a used car anywhere, put the registration in Google. Ignore the pay for info sites but see what else pops up. Do the same for the dealer. Most have trading names so a CCJ or similar search may not show up relevant data.

Robert G8RPI.

with the dealer

Agree with JR on this one.

Retired now, but previously in the Trade for many years. There is a good nucleus of honest dealers who clearly identify any known issues when selling.

If you're able to log on to Autotrademail for example (nothing to do with Autotrader - this is a dealers-only trading site) you will see the very accurate and honest descriptions from most of the dealers when describing their stock.

Legal necessity or not, thank goodness there are still honest sellers out there!

jrkitching said:

Selling privately without disclosing the history would not be an option for me; in extremis, I'd most likely put the car into an auction.

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This is what I done with my old Bravo, sold it to WBAC, took a hit, probably about £2k at a guess if I'd held out for a private sale, but didn't want the hassle, have the time, and had morals to not sell it to someone privatly.

As it happens the DVLA now show an export marker against it, so thing WBAC exported it, but at least if sold through a dealer the buyer would have had a warranty to cover the looming costly gearbox rebuild.

WBAC?
Ah yes ... the World Ballet Art Competition!
Yep - they buy Bravo's.

Apologies about the delay in updating.first of all peoples ford had the car in there workshop for a month they reckon they fitted new piston rings valve stem seals skimmed the head and changed the cam belt..anyway we were not happy but reluctantly took the car back again.two days later checked oil it needed 2 litres of oil to fill it up anyway after speaking to a senior manager at people's ford and threatening court action they told us to return the car and we were refunded in full. And we are now the proud owners of a grande punto gp. All I hope is by posting our troubles that we stop anyone from dealing with PEOPLES FORD and going through the hell we suffered.

Great result.
Pleased for you.

Now we'll never know what the problem really was .... until another poster contacts the forum having bought the car!

Glad it worked out in the end. Looks like Peoples Ford finally came through. As a Franchised dealer (even for another make) they have more incentive to avoid court action than a used car seller. I'm sure the manufacturers look at any court actions or bad publicity when it comes to franchise renewal.
Please post the index number (reg. no.) here so members can make informed decisions if it comes up for sale.

Robert G8RPI.

In response to previous posts and hopefully to help any one on ff to avoid it its reg is ML59YRC ITS A WHITE 1.1 PANDA ECO ACTIVE AND AT TIME OF RETURN HAD 23000 MILES ON IT.

Due to getting rid of the car I find myself with the following surplus items
1. Set of white roof rails originally from a panda alessi these are genuine fiat parts that are 3 months old with 1 or 2 very minor scratches

2. Set of panda front and back team heko wind deflectors that were put on the car 3 months old good condition

3 brand new still in packaging the tailored mat co. Tailored panda front and rear mats drivers mat has built in anchoring fastner point

Anyone interested in any of the above drop me a message