Not long had the panda and like it but the only problem is the weedy 1.2 engine, so is there any known engine conversion been completed ???

No, the Panda isn't really a good platform for swaps. There's not much space and the chassis isn't really geared to handle a lot of power.

Best bet is to just get a 100HP if you want a fast Panda, or if you're slightly insane, throw a bigger turbo on an MJ and up the boost. You'll have to uprate parts to handle the additional torque and you probably want an LSD as well.

Turbo- or supercharging the 1.2 could be an option, it's a pretty stout little engine. But again, you'll run into problems with the rest of the car simply not being built for more power.

Making the Panda fast will take a lot more time and money than buying, say an old E30/E36 BMW 3-series and modding that instead.

Dont really want a fast panda just something better than what I have. Does the 1.4 from the 100hp fit in ok. Ive the 4x4

Transmission on a 4x4 isn't really up for much more power

do you know the weak link in the gearbox, or is all of it in general weak?

Forced induction is the only way to breathe much more life into the 1.2, but the box won't take kindly to a chunky turbo and lots of bottom-end torque. I considered transplanting a 100HP into mine, but in the end plumbed for a Rotrex Supercharger conversion, as I imagined the full swap would be a headache in terms of electronics - little did I know! Transpires that even the 1.2 ECU is too smart for its own good and needed mucho tinkering to get the new maps to work with the new fuelling, etc etc. But, power increase is very progressive and doesn't burden the tranmission with gut-busting forces lower down. Sounds wicked too....

I deliberately kept increase to 'reasonable' levels and have ended up with a 100HP+ type output whilst keeping the std (lighter) 1.2 engine - as well as enjoying the 'journey' to extra power very much. Only has 110bhp and 100ftlbs - little more than a 100HP, but the spread of torque is good and as boost increases in a completely liinear fashion (10psi at 6500rpm), the engine has the character of a Honda VTEC and is only marginally less economic.

Bloomin' love it!

Phil

Sounds ideal ! How long did it take you and whats the damage to your wallet ? (pm the price if you dont want it known) I take it the mpg went down a bit.

R1NGA - Do you have the 4x4 setup?

main issue will be the differentials over heating with all that extra power,

( There was a reason they didnt put a 1.4 in )

I'm guessing that it's going to cost about 2K if you drop it off for a turn key conversion.

Why not sell the 4x4 and get a 100hp. Why would you want / need more power from an agricultural vehicle?

I like the 4x4 just would like some more power out of it.

Steveosaurus said:

I like the 4x4 just would like some more power out of it.

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Limit is the drivetrain...

The car is running very well and seems to be able to handle the extra get-up-and-go very well. Cost was a little more than the £2k suggested, but that was down to the development time for the fuelling and mapping, as the IAW 59F ECU is a bugger to crack. However, and as I have said before, mucking about with cars is a hobby and that means that as a bloke I don't try too hard to balance spend v's benefit. It was a fun journey and I would do it again at the drop of a hat.

The Rotrex blows harder at high revs than it does at lower revs - that's just physics. Most of the time the car lives in the 2000-4000rpm range, as it's a town car in the main and in this range the extra power is relatively low. Torque spread is very very good - 95+ftlbs from 2500rpm to 6500rpm, which makes it a very flexible cruiser. Remember that the std 1.2 produces 75ftlbs at about 2500rpm, so the gains are not huge at low revs.

No, where the big gains come are above 4500rpm, where boost is stronger and growing. The engine pulls really well right up to the 6500rpm limiter, but at high revs the loads on the box are much much less - there's not been so much as a squeak from the clutch, although I have a CG Motorsports +25% uprated unit in the garage just in case.

Why did I choose this car for my mods? In std form the Panda 4x4 is almost the perfect around town motor. The suspension is supple, long-travel and with 65 profile tyres which lend itself to a very good ride. It has independent rear suspension, rear disc brakes and a chuckable character that's utterly addictive.

Moreover, the car is economic (OK, not as good as a straight 1.2 Dynamic, but 38-41mpg is perfectly adequate) and monumental in the snow and completely unstoppable. I have always wanted a 100HP as they just look soooo cool, but they are hopeless in the snow, ride like a tea trolly and simple aren't as versatile. Look bloody good though I have to admit.

So I decided to try to combine the best bits of the car I already had, but with the performance of the 100HP - a best of all worlds. I've ended up with a smooth-riding, brilliant handling, raspy, economic muck about Panda that looks completely stealth but packs 110bhp in a 900kg package. I've had thumbs-up from 5-series owners amazed at the Panda's motorway abilities and it can easily pull the neck end of 6000rpm in top. It'll cruise in the same comfort at 80mph as it did before and average economy has dropped from 38.5 to 36mpg as a result of the mods. Remarkable I reckon for a doubling in power.

Rotrex chargers produce almost zero heat, are over 90% efficient and there's simply none of the heat management issues that you get from a turbo. I'll freely admit that the turbo gives MUCH better bottom end torque and there are many experts on this Forum who have produced brilliant turbo converted cars - Shakey being the most recent I think. Different routes to similar ends, that's all.

Happy to assist anyone else who is interested in doing the same mods, but it'll need to be a car without A/C, as the Rotrex mounts in the place where the compressor goes.

And it makes me chuckle when I read that all the big car manufacturers are running in their down-sizing programmes, which is why we're seeing small engines with turbo's cropping up all over the place. Very happy to know that I got there first!

Last part of the plan is to update the dampers, as they are very very cheap and high speed damping (shock movement, not the cars straight line...) is very lacking. That'll make the car perfect in my eyes, although I appreciate that not everyone will see it my way!

Can't see me hang in onto the Audi for much longer.....

Regartds,

Phil

R1NGA said:

Last part of the plan is to update the dampers, as they are very very cheap and high speed damping (shock movement, not the cars straight line...) is very lacking. That'll make the car perfect in my eyes, although I appreciate that not everyone will see it my way!

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I'd go for quality bits like Koni, doesn't need to be their fancy adjustable models, just the basic sports dampers they do. They'll be much more competent than the stock dampers.

I'd love to drive a supercharged 110hp Panda 4x4, I bet it's a riot

and if you need any advice on putting a turbo on the 100hp ive recently finished mine 150BHP and a pretty insane drive to be fair but twice the fun it was before!

I will look to the Konis or perhaps Nitron, as they are now part of the Ohlins empire and they did the development for my Renaultsport Spider - might ask if they'd do a deal on the Panda ;-)

jusdel30 - what ECU setup, MAP and injectors did you use in the end, out of interest? I ended up with 215cc units, a 2Bar Saab MAP sensor (thanks to Shakey) and a hybrid OEM/Dastek ECU. And what about Lambdas?

Couple of pics of my finished car. Note new grill, of which I am quite proud!

Phil G

Looks good and looks like a nice power curve you have there. Bet it drives well.

It does indeed drive well, in a Honey-I-Shrunk-The-Subaru kinda way....

R1NGA said:

It does indeed drive well, in a Honey-I-Shrunk-The-Subaru kinda way....

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Sif!

This will run rings around your Panda, plus it's got gold Speedlines which easily add 50 brake

... +60bhp probably, as those are the multispoke Speedlines - unusual car. Waaay too big though, obviously! Those were the days, when only farmers knew about Subaru's...