babbo_umbro
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I don't see anything good coming from this TBH.
Couldn't agree more - if the Chinese buy Fiat I won't be buying another one, after over 50 years of Fiats, Alfas and Lancias.
General Facelift Fiat Panda 319.
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General Facelift Fiat Panda 319.
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Couldn't agree more - if the Chinese buy Fiat I won't be buying another one, after over 50 years of Fiats, Alfas and Lancias.
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The question would be, what will they buy, everything. ?
Like, Ferrari, Maserati, Alfa Romeo, to. ??
Or only the rest, Fiat, Lancia and Chrysler. ??
Or maybe only the Lancia and Chrysler part.
Like, Ferrari, Maserati, Alfa Romeo, to. ??
Or only the rest, Fiat, Lancia and Chrysler. ??
Or maybe only the Lancia and Chrysler part.
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Well Ferrari has been independent for a couple of years now so won't be part of the deal. Great Wall probably need to buy another car company because they sure as hell don't know how to make cars that the rest of the World will buy. As I said before - they'd be better leaving things as they are and just introducing investment.
It's almost 50 years since they filmed "The Italian Job". A story about the heist of some gold from China which was to intended for investment/engineering knowledge in FIAT, right?
If the Chinese get into the act sales will drop, purely because people will think quality will drop. Homegrown Chinese cars really don't cut the mustard, they don't sell well here, just look at MG and their figures. Far worse than any of the old communist eastern bloc cars ever were.
I'd think the Italians would be far from happy too.
I'd think the Italians would be far from happy too.
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Not necessarily: look at Volvo. They have thrived under Chinese ownership, and continue to make award winning cars.
So long as Fiat are left alone without interference. If the Chinese try to influence engineering or model line up then it could go wrong.
To be fair occasionally they get it right. Remember the Rover K series engine. The Chinese did major improvements that we could have done and renamed it the N series, total Bill of health with no head gasket issues or overheating. Pity the MG7 & Roewe 750 are no longer.
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That's honing and improving.
The 1.5 engine in the MG is an example of a Chinese engine. If that's what Fiat end up with I'll never buy another Fiat again. To be fair though - the Chinese are not daft - they know that Fiat are capable of designing and engineering with enough investment. Fiat have been strong innovators (e.g FIRE, common rail, multi-air) so it's a case of injecting cash and improving the management and direction of the company.
My daughter has a 2015 MG3, so far it's been fine, with the exception of subframes, suspension etcetera being poorly coated and rust. Body is OK as is the engine. The standard of finish is not quite up to western standards but look at the price. It is certainly liveable with though.
OP
OP
Although, a 1.2 FIRE with mild hybrid (like Suzuki) would be nice, and could work.
Personally I'd think the TA with a turbo would be ideal in a hybrid. The engine would run at a constant speed and would be tuned for peak torque on a narrow band of rpm. The engines small size and light weight would help to offset the generator, batteries and motors. I think it would be an ideal engine without its drawbacks.
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A TwinAir engine is not that light, i believe it weigh more then the 1.2ltr FIRE engine.
The TA unit is only 85kg, much lighter than the FIRE unit.
https://www.autoevolution.com/news/twinair-engine-explained-23000.html
https://www.autoevolution.com/news/twinair-engine-explained-23000.html
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It's more a case of the 100bhp not feeling anything like that - and being quite thirsty too. I drove one and liked the car in general but I didn't like the engine at all. It's not a comment about reliability and how robust it is - it's just not sweet and enjoyable like I expect a four cylinder NA engine to be. On the plus side you get loads of equipment for your money and they're a nice looking car in my opinion.
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But if you go back far enough Japanese cars were once all derisable. Now look at them.
babbo_umbro
Established member
Autoevolution's reputation for accuracy is hardly 100% - in another article it states that the TwinAir is the first two cylinder engine to go into a European production car - Fiat Nuova 500, Citroen 2CV and Dyane, Panhard PL17, Steyr Puch, various Jowetts, any others?
OP
OP
i have reed somewhere that it (TA85) was heavier then then the old 1.2ltr FIRE.
The later AC Invacars......though to be fair they had the Steyr-Puch 600cc lump.
I can't imagine the weight difference between a FIRE and Twin-air is majorly different to the weight of differing owners/drivers though.
If I wanted an electric car I'd want it to look 1950s futuristic - like the GM Impact. Brown velour ideally.
Seems odd the TA is heavier, it's crank is shorter and lighter the block is smaller, what could add to weight would be a heavier flywheel and the possible addition of a DMF, I stand corrected if I'm wrong but the logical side would make me think it's lighter.
Perhaps check the two cars side by side with the same trim levels.
Perhaps check the two cars side by side with the same trim levels.
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