General Panda 4x4

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General Panda 4x4

Well I think the Panda has poor rear room, in absolute car terms.

I think that word "absolute" is dead on the money! For its size, I think the rear leg-room in the new Panda is pretty good (in fact, comparable to the 1994 Clio we've just scrapped (RIP) -- which I always thought was quite TARDIS-like...); and I was quite happy to sit in the back of it, for an hour or so, during our test-drives. (However, having said that, my partner, who was sat in front of me, driving, is quite -- in her daughter's word(s) -- 'tincy'...!) ;)

Trying to do the same in a 500 was excruciatingly uncomfortable, though: and any ideas we had of occasionally ferrying around our sons (who are both well over six-foot) -- when they come to stay -- in one were soon quashed...! :eek:

FIAT, generally, I feel, are pretty good at making the most of interior space -- and even the Punto is pretty good for carrying us and three just about grown-up kids; and we didn't have -- amazingly! -- any complaints on a recent return trip to London (about 80 miles, each way...)! (y)
 
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Well I drive a Doblo, and I loved it at first sight, so fashion has never mattered to me in cars, or much else. But I'm not alien to good design, and fashion and design can work together, or not, as the case may be.

I've been reading the Indian motoring press a lot recently re the new Duster, and there they often refer to 'butchness' in cars, and their imposing presence on the road - and this matters to them as it makes other road users get out of the way apparantly:eek: (I guess they mean rickshaws and cows:D)

But I wonder if the same isn't true for a lot of people here too if they were only prepared to admit it?

One other current design feature I dislike is the trend towards high belt lines. This makes for dark, claustrophobic interiors (so they then add glass roofs?:confused:), and it means it is impossible to rest an arm on the window sill. Yet another factor contributing to the buried feeling so common in cars now.

The new Kia Sportage is particulrly bad, as are Audis and the Nissan Juke, which a dark pit of a car to be in, even if it is high built.

PS. Re high seating positions: apparantly judging distance is more accurately done when sitting with the same eyeline as when standing, so the safest seat height would give an eyeine about 5'9" off the ground...

I don't want electronic parking brakes, auto wipers and lights, electric mirrors, in-built sat-navs, keyless entry, or a whole host of other annoying things, but I do want good visibility and a decent view out, and ease of access. Oh, and A/C and central locking :D

All harder and harder to find I'm afraid, which is why the Panda is so attractive. I can rest my arm on the window sill, as I can in the Dacia Duster by the way, which, notwithsatding it's problems, is still top of my list...
 
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I think I'm going to get one....

Either in orange or white.

I was going to buy a previous model Cross, but it was too compromised for what I needed it for. The rave reviews of the new Panda show that it's matured as a car, but is still very much a Panda.

From the more ruggedised looks of this generation's 4x4, and the fact it has the lockable diffs previously reserved for the Cross, I'm also wondering if a new Cross will come out at all.

Now I need to decide - diesel or petrol? :chin:

Pros/cons anyone?
 
Petrol I should think. The TA is very torquey, and it is light, adding to the skippy-puppy nature of the Panda.

When I drove the TA I changed up very early and the engine didn't mind a bit. I think some people think this is not good for the engine because they think it's struggling, but the reality is that this is simply the noise quality of the engine and it has a lot of torque very low (like a Diesel) and it pays to use it.

And I'd guess the TA will cost less to buy too.

And petrol costs less than Diesel, and there isn't a DPF either.

And yet the cars I am looking at right now are Diesels :eek:

PS. Orange or white sounds good to me. I love the look of the green but I'd never buy one. Green is the least safe colour - ever driven down a dappled road overarched with trees in summer - so I'd be tempted by white and save some money.
 
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They seem to have stopped making them for the summer.

I've seen only one that wasn't a demonstrator, I think. I have seen a few more Ups, but not many.

I wonder if people are waiting for the new plates, but according to the dealers (all makes) I've encountered a lot of people just aren't buying cars. I wonder why ;)

Also, the Panda is expensive - I think. The VW/Skoda competiton is cheaper and has better reviews. If the Panda had a killer low price it would fly off the shelves, but Fiat is trying to go upmarket, apparently, and the price partly reflects that.

You can get a much larger new discounted car for the same price as the little Panda too, and this is tempting for most people.

Hell, the excellent Suzuki Swift is cheaper with the vat free deal, and I'd buy the Swift before the Panda any day (probably). I've driven one of those too and it is a great drive :D

PS. I've just read that the Panda factory will be making temporary closures next month, and again in October. They are hoping that the nw 4X4 will boost flagging European sales, apparantly, but cutting the price would be more sensible I'd have thought.

French manufacturers are in trouble too; Peugeot Citroen is in dire straights and Renault is only held up by it's low cost brand, Dacia, which is doing very well worldwide (cheap cars) and by the sales of Nissan, and the hopes of new models produced in conjunction with Daimler. VW is taking over the world, and what's left is going to the Koreans. If it wasn't for good Chrysler sales in the US Fiat would be dead in the water by now. Frightening...
 
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Yea, I think it's a case of Fiat having lost their way a bit. Gone are the days when you'd see hundreds of Mk 1 Puntos, Cinquecentos etc - i.e cheap Fiats. The last Panda could at one time be had for five grand. They need to get back to their roots and cut down on the whole expensive option thing. The Koreans have filled the gap that Fiat have vacated. Warranties also need to be more competitive.
 
Re: I think I'm going to get one....

Now I need to decide - diesel or petrol? :chin:

Pros/cons anyone?
If you do any significant motorway driving, then definitely diesel. That's where majority of your mileage will go and TwinAir fuel economy at decent motorway speeds is abysmal.
If you only stay in the city, then petrol most likely. Economy will still be less then diesel, but you won't be clocking enough miles to justify cost differences, also petrol responsiveness is better for city driving. Also you'll have troubles with diesel DPF regeneration if you rarely go outside city streets.
 
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Re: I think I'm going to get one....

If you do any significant motorway driving, then definitely diesel. That's where majority of your mileage will go and TwinAir fuel economy at decent motorway speeds is abysmal.

You've confirmed my thoughts - diesel it is then.

Plus the extra torque should help off-road and be a more relaxing drive due to less gear changing.

Now, can UK dealers order me a LHD one?
 
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As for the sliding seat: I read that it actually only slides forwards, so liberating more boot space and further reducing rear legroom, but I'm prepared to stand corrected as I haven't seen an example, and testers are notoriously inaccurate over details.

I assumed it's like the option on the previous Panda - about six inches of movement with the standard setting about three inches further back than the normal one. If I remember correctly there are four intermediate positions.
 
I hope this is so, but I read a review which mentioned that the sliding seat only liberates more boot space. This makes no sense to me because the option to carry two adults comfortably would be a greater benefit. Whatever the reality, it should be standard, not an option ;)
 
Its a shame that fiat have decided not to fit the new multijet 3 85hp into this model.
Still, it has 30% more torque than the old panda cross so should go well enough.

This is why I dropped my ideas of buying a used cross earlier this year. Waiting for the new model with the uprated motor was the best decision for me.

My friend who is the sales manager at my dealer will be getting a launch model. I'll be able to borrow it for a few days. Can't wait!!
 
You can fairly easily chipmod or "box"-mod any Panda MJ up to 100BHP (its the same engine as in Puntos, the only diff is ECU settings after all).
 
You can fairly easily chipmod or "box"-mod any Panda MJ up to 100BHP (its the same engine as in Puntos, the only diff is ECU settings after all).

You can, but the gearboxes aren't sufficiently specced to cope with it.
I'm sure there's someone on this forum that has fitted a tuning box to their panda cross, but had to turn the power down due to clutch slip.
 
Your mileage can vary, I've seen different reports, I guess that depends on how careful you'll be with it. Gearbox will cope, it's not enough increase to trash it. Clutch could be a concern, true, but I doubt it will be a problem if you don't go too crazy and go up only to about 80-85 BHP.
 
Interesting that the 4x4 version of the 2012 Panda seems to have generated the most interest here. Not surprising, though as 4x4 Pandas are unique, versatile and, well, interesting!
I've owned both a Climbing and a Cross from the previous model range and enjoyed them. I'm waiting for the new 4x4 but have reservations. I'm afraid I find the 4x4 models offered to us in the UK are too much like Tart's Handbags, overspecced and too "ornate". In addition, my Cross was not very well built and this is one reason I want to change to a new car.
Like Ulpian I've looked at the Dacia Duster. In fact I've pre-ordered a base model with 4x4 which will cost less than £11,000 on the road. To be honest, I need a bigger car than the Panda now but I also love the very basic spec and technology of the Duster. The sort of car you park up in the supermarket and don't care if somebody bumps it. Very little to repair, especially very few electronic devices.
In addition, Homeward, it's based on the floor pan of your old Clio so you would feel entirely at home.
Watch this space for reviews of the Duster and the new Panda 4x4 when I get my hands on them.
 
In addition, Homeward, it's based on the floor pan of your old Clio so you would feel entirely at home.

Watch this space for reviews of the Duster and the new Panda 4x4 when I get my hands on them.

Sadly, they don't (yet?) do an automatic -- which I presume will also apply to the Panda 4x4.... :(

Apart from that, the Duster was very tempting... -- for many of the reasons you outline above... -- and I look forward to your reviews...! However, I shall try not to lose too much faith with FIAT -- for the moment... :cool:
 
Interesting;)

I couldn't agree more. I'd go for the 4x4 Panda TA in a shot, if the spec and the price were right. Let's see. I too like basic cars, but sadly for me this includes A/C an adjustable seat and remote locking. The rest I can live without, even a radio, as a very decent one can be had in Halfords for £100. I'd rather have a comfortable driving position with soft suspension and some roll, and no electo-frippery, than a techno-wonderworld with a hard ride, an automatic parking brake and keyless entry, and automatic lights and wipers - NO NO NO!

I've just read in the Telegraph two lists of the best and worst value cars. Interstingly the Skoda Citigo is rated as the best new car deal, with low initial cost, low tax and low insurance, plus great residuals and dealers.

Doctorchris will be happy because the basic Duster comes second. I've gone for the (too?) expensive top one (non-4x4) at £13,000, which is excluded from Rutherford's list, because I want A/C ;) Very clever Renault (n)

Unfortunately the new Panda sits in the middle of the Worst 10 group, because, according to Mike Rutherford...

"The latest version makes no sense at all. The consumer who buys this rather than its similarly priced and brilliant sister, the 500, is nuts".

Rutherford is looking at the very good residuals gained by the fashionable 500 of course. I'd expct the 4x4Panda to hold its value more like the 500.

By the way, if I do go ahead with the Duster I'll also let you know what I think.

It is interesting that the Skoda Rutherford likes is on my list too, and would be mine now if it was only a bit higher off the ground. Right now my back is hurting, and just getting out of bed this morning was bad, let alone out of a low car :cry:

PS. The only automatic Duster is sold (as a Renault Duster) in South America. it comes with a 130bhp two litre petrol engine, but then the Brazilains don't much like Diesel because they major on cane-grown ethanol.
 
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