Sorry for the tardy response, we're currently mid major house renovation so what time I'm getting is being eaten up, that being said I've had a good bit of time trawling through the forum tonight! The Mk1 grille on Pandino looks brilliant, half tempted to nick the idea for mine, though would be a bit wasted in black, the body colour grille really stands out in red. Look forward to seeing how you get on mounting those spots too something else well worth considering .

Last couple of delays on this axle nearly delt with (this thread so far has pretty much just been refurbing that, can't wait to move on :bang, mate who has brake pipe flaring tool should be home from Tennerife Monday and the trailing arms and rear brake flexi pipe are both due to arrive on Wednesday!

I got a spare hour so figured I'd check if there was any rust under the car that I'd not be able to get access to once the axle was back on, bizarely one of the spring mounting points at the top looked as good as new the other had some bubbles on, I attacked it with a wire brush and a chisel made from a 1" hack saw blade and fortunately got back to solid metal pretty quick...



Coated in Kurust, then back the following day with a load of hammerite...



While I was under there I had a quick look at the flexi-pipe for the brakes, I take it it's just held in place with a clip? Could not see any way of undoing it (from the car, I've already freed up the brake pipe to the master cylinder).

Didn't get too much time under there, in part as I'd just be twiddling my thumbs and in part due to storm Doris getting a little carried away and my legs sticking out from under the car into the rain! That being said, this picture pretty well shows the level of rust generally under the car, nothing I'm concerned about yet but clearly need to get on to this asap.



So retreated back to the workshop and while looking for the new bump stops I'd bought in (I knew I'd got some because they raised some eyebrows in the workshop when they arrived),



as you can see the old ones are well spent, but I did discover the rear bumper mounting brackets, one of which I sheared the bolt on when removing them...



I figured at the time they were probably very cheap so went a little hard on it, at work I had no internet access so couldn't check so figured I'd repair it anyway! I did consider fabricating a new one but figured as they look very light they were probably designed to be sacrificial in the case of a small bump the last thing the car needed was some heavy duty ones so I got to work.









Guess I'll probably see if the bolt has space and if not cut it down and then take both brackets to be re electro-plated and powder coated, I love that place, everything comes out looking like new again!

I also have rust at the bottom of my doors (doesn't everyone) but that'll be a project for another day, I've got to get the critical structural stuff spot on first before I start worrying about the more cosmetic however:

-Gold or Bronze would be a bold choice, not sure how it would look with the brilliantly retro look of your car with the red and Mk1 grille, though often I can't visualise these things and then the end product blows me away! To be fair my old Landrover had cream wheels but it had drums all round so less brake dust and like you say it was always covered in muck anyway .

-I had a chat with a mate who runs a car wrapping business and bounced some ideas off him. I had initally imagined a fairly fluid pattern over the black but I'm really not sure it would suit the car. The very thing that appeals to me about Panda's is their utiltarian simplicity and unclutured style, I think if I was not carefull then I would totally lose site of that so I'll tread carefully, some form of Panda logo could work really well though. Quite a few of the possible colour combo's we discussed I initially dismissed out of hand but then when the colours were offered up to the car they did look really smart so watch this space (well maybe in about a year!).

-Back on to the red wheels, they tend to look really smart on rat cars, which does not really fit with my plans but I've been looking a load more and still think they might be the best option. On the subject of rat look cars, I found pictures of a German Panda covered in Sacking material called the sackratte I think? Looked class though not sure how well the finish would hold up. Also you can now get rust paint, it has iron filings in it so the paint itself rusts, with the car in theory being protected and rust free underneath. It does look mad and I think it could look great on a Panda but I'm not sure I'd trust it, you put acid on to acelerate the process and if the paint underneath does not hold out you could be rusting your own car without noticing!

Apologies FDNY21 for not just quoting etc. but I have no idea how to do that, I'm more at home covered in oil than at a keyboard. Also are you considering running with a Fire Dept. theme on your car at all?? Oh and very jealous of the roof rack on your more recent edition, one day I'll make one up for my car, though no idea how I'll attach it with minimum impact on the car!

Cheers again


Phiz

Still debating white and gold/bronze, I sort of need a choice in a couple of days too...

I haven't considered a fire dept. theme but it would make sense. With my name and all, it would be interesting to have the fire truck stripes from the FDNY. The only catches are the logo and the money really. Not sure if they get touchy about other people having their logo on other things or not... and money, well, I don't have it Something to consider one day

The roof rack on Erwin/Chaz is nice, I was hoping to use it on Pandino but turns out the mounts need holes drilled into the roof, they are on the black car at least!

I prefer the Sisley roof rack as it bolts on to the rear screws/washers in between the top of the boot and has little clip mounts on each side. I still have a bit of regret that I didn't take it off the one that was being scrapped in Wellington - I wanted to take it, but it fell to bits because it had rusted so much. It still wouldn't fit in the car so the bloke scrapped it in. I should have taken it and fixed it, but not much I can do about that now :bang: Only way to get it in the car would have been to break it more though...

FDNY21 said:

I prefer the Sisley roof rack as it bolts on to the rear screws/washers in between the top of the boot and has little clip mounts on each side. I still have a bit of regret that I didn't take it off the one that was being scrapped in Wellington - I wanted to take it, but it fell to bits because it had rusted so much. It still wouldn't fit in the car so the bloke scrapped it in. I should have taken it and fixed it, but not much I can do about that now :bang: Only way to get it in the car would have been to break it more though...

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If only you had a roof rack eh

firstcar-Y10 said:

If only you had a roof rack eh

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Roof-rack-ception? Ahh... that was a good one, credit to you

Ah the irony! If it was just the metal components that had rusted out I'm sure something could be fabricated up without too much trouble. I did some frame work for a super modern kitchen a bit ago and the dimensions of the box section were unobtainable so I got the steel folded and seam welded it up, could work here too??

Re the roof bars on Chaz, my only concern would be the length, it's a very low priority but for my 'adventure panda' one day it'd be great to have a roof rack that could take a couple of spare wheels and a couple of peli-cases, ideally securable. Also it's be great if we could get our kayaks on it, though they are pretty long (over 9' long). I've made roof racks before but only for cars with existing mounting points. Did make one for a van and it broke up the air flow in such a way as to make a terrible buzz, that would be more of a problem if I'd drilled holes in the roof of the car to fit it! Plus I'd need to get the roof lining out to fit the thing, which is a bit of a pain.

What is your deadline on the wheel colour, have you got the tyres off ready to go? Bit of an issue on the red wheel front, my other half is seriously not convinced, I've been searching for images showing how cool they can look but nothing has done the trick yet! I'd sort of convinced myself it was the best option and could really set the car off nicely.

FDNY theme could really suit the car, with the top half of the car done in white, the stripes, maybe your favourite number on the door as the engine number.

The more I look at your pictures of Pandino the more I realise how great the mk1 grille looks on it, as said before in black you would completely loose the benefit of it but as I might well be changing that on mine (watch this space, again possibly in a very long time!) it is something I would love to do. Was it expensive? I know it got damaged in transit but was it a UK ebay purchase or did you have to go further afield? If I do find one for an affordable price and fit it I'd love to have some more info on how easy it was to fit. I know you made up metal spacers but I assume the original fittings on the car were unaltered, so it would be really simple to put it back to original? Looking at your photo of the new clear indicator fitted (nice touch) it does look like a really good flush fit .

Scratch that last request, I've just come scross your seperate thread FDNY21 about the grilles and the link in that to an older one where issues are covered!

Phiz said:

Ah the irony! If it was just the metal components that had rusted out I'm sure something could be fabricated up without too much trouble. I did some frame work for a super modern kitchen a bit ago and the dimensions of the box section were unobtainable so I got the steel folded and seam welded it up, could work here too??

Re the roof bars on Chaz, my only concern would be the length, it's a very low priority but for my 'adventure panda' one day it'd be great to have a roof rack that could take a couple of spare wheels and a couple of peli-cases, ideally securable. Also it's be great if we could get our kayaks on it, though they are pretty long (over 9' long). I've made roof racks before but only for cars with existing mounting points. Did make one for a van and it broke up the air flow in such a way as to make a terrible buzz, that would be more of a problem if I'd drilled holes in the roof of the car to fit it! Plus I'd need to get the roof lining out to fit the thing, which is a bit of a pain.

What is your deadline on the wheel colour, have you got the tyres off ready to go? Bit of an issue on the red wheel front, my other half is seriously not convinced, I've been searching for images showing how cool they can look but nothing has done the trick yet! I'd sort of convinced myself it was the best option and could really set the car off nicely.

FDNY theme could really suit the car, with the top half of the car done in white, the stripes, maybe your favourite number on the door as the engine number.

The more I look at your pictures of Pandino the more I realise how great the mk1 grille looks on it, as said before in black you would completely loose the benefit of it but as I might well be changing that on mine (watch this space, again possibly in a very long time!) it is something I would love to do. Was it expensive? I know it got damaged in transit but was it a UK ebay purchase or did you have to go further afield? If I do find one for an affordable price and fit it I'd love to have some more info on how easy it was to fit. I know you made up metal spacers but I assume the original fittings on the car were unaltered, so it would be really simple to put it back to original? Looking at your photo of the new clear indicator fitted (nice touch) it does look like a really good flush fit .

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It could have been fixed, yes, but it wouldn't fit in my father's car with all the other pieces of Panda I had in there at the time so I ended up leaving it with the bloke, who ended up scrapping the metal in

Others here have used the Sisley roof rack to carry kayaks I believe, so you'll *probably* have no worries... basically the normal CLX/Selecta roof rack does seem to be a bit of a pain to fit, especially on a car that has had not had it before, as far as I know. But on the other side of the argument, finding a Sisley roof rack would be much harder than finding a roof rack from a CLX. I'd imagine people have tried making their own roof racks before? Or getting some general ones that have those plates that fit around the tops of doors/windows I think...

Attached a pic of a Sisley, owned by the bloke who scrapped his other (blue) Sisley. It has one red wheel on it, which may swing your argument, or make it worse I'm bringing the wheels to be restored tomorrow. I'm pretty sure I'm going to go for white. The gold probably does look okay with red, but I think gold goes better with blue, just like white goes better with red We'll see if that was the right choice or not... or maybe I'll change my mind again before tomorrow

It's got to be number 21 on the doors I'd have to do that as a DIY project though, not sure how I feel about doing it. Maybe an idea for the future, or for me to get someone else to do when I get money (which I'll inevitably spend on the Panda or another one anyway)

I know you found details on the mk1 grille but I'll let you know anyway. It wasn't too expensive, I suppose up to £50 for a shaped piece of metal may seem it, but they are very rare by now. I was wanting a mk1 grille for a little while and this one came up on eBay (though the seller is on this forum as well). I won the auction and then the delivery came but in its banana shaped form, the delivery company would have nothing to do with it (thanks Parcelforce) but the seller was kind to give me a discount on it. I restored the mk1 to a straight shape, gave it some coats of red and then clear lacquered it. In all, the project probably did come to £50 or so, including paints.

The grille was a UK purchase but you may struggle to find one for sale. It's the sort of thing that you may have to wait for it to find you before you find it. Not literally as someone else will buy it if you do that, but just check every now and then and see if it comes up

The original grille for the mk1 had little metal plates attached outwards, mounted on the little indentations you will see on your mk2. The mk2 removed the plates as it didn't need them. You could either attach the plates like they were previously, or do what I did - I used small pieces of metal, cut to size with holes cut in the right places, so that the hole used for the mk2 grille joined up to the mk1 mount. I don't think I ever took a picture of it, I'll put it on my list of things to do on the car today so I can show you later!

The mounts for the front facing part is the trickiest bit. I had to bend some metal and hope for the best, I don't think you want to see a picture of that, it looks pretty back street garage. But it definitely holds well! I need to remove the grille at some point so that I can paint the metal plate black and think of a better solution for the side that isn't accessible through the grilles, and I need to space the grille up slightly as it's ever so slightly too far down! I should probably touch up the metal grille too, as I've got a couple of little stone chips that go back to primer

Always the way with these sort of things, I'll keep a look out for a set of roof bars at an affordable price (if such a thing still exists) or alternatively get to work fabricating something, though like I said, a little worried I'll drill the roof, bolt it on and then end up with it making a load of noise or not really being functional!

Pandapanda (who I bought my panda off) has a 4x4 with what I think from memory was a Citroen Berlingo roof rack cut down and modified to fit, might be an easier option than starting from nothing, though would limit me in terms of originality.

I think in terms of looks white with red does sound like the way to go, guess you'll just have to keep on top of maintenance with them to keep them looking smart . Cheers for the Sisley pic. but I'm not sure it would support my arguement too much!

Not too sure how I didn't work out your 'engine number' on Pandino would be 21 FDNY21! I've never done vinyl wrapping myself but it does seem like it would be doable, my mate who does it professionally said the hardest parts/time consuming bits are bits of trim which need removing/cutting round etc. and curves, both of which are fairly uncommon on Pandas. The main thing is worse case scenario you can remove it all with no damage to the car, so if you can pick up some cheap vinyl (possible offcuts for the strips/numbers) it could be pretty cheap and low risk! Once my Panda (possibly Ivan) is on the road then I'll start looking at the cosmetics though...

After reading all about mk1 grilles last night I thought I'd have a quick look online, found one on an Irish site for 28 euros. Figured I'd message the seller but it would not let me send a message unless a purchase was going through so I made an offer of 20 euros so I could message the seller re postage... it's in the post to me know! It looks pretty rough but I'll strip it and repaint it anyhow, possibly modifying it to be a direct fit to my mk2... Would be great to see the pictures of your fittings though so I can get an idea of what I'm up against!

Hopefully I'll get the brake pipes flared tomorrow, then the axle back on later in the week!!

Phiz said:

Always the way with these sort of things, I'll keep a look out for a set of roof bars at an affordable price (if such a thing still exists) or alternatively get to work fabricating something, though like I said, a little worried I'll drill the roof, bolt it on and then end up with it making a load of noise or not really being functional!

Pandapanda (who I bought my panda off) has a 4x4 with what I think from memory was a Citroen Berlingo roof rack cut down and modified to fit, might be an easier option than starting from nothing, though would limit me in terms of originality.

I think in terms of looks white with red does sound like the way to go, guess you'll just have to keep on top of maintenance with them to keep them looking smart . Cheers for the Sisley pic. but I'm not sure it would support my arguement too much!

Not too sure how I didn't work out your 'engine number' on Pandino would be 21 FDNY21! I've never done vinyl wrapping myself but it does seem like it would be doable, my mate who does it professionally said the hardest parts/time consuming bits are bits of trim which need removing/cutting round etc. and curves, both of which are fairly uncommon on Pandas. The main thing is worse case scenario you can remove it all with no damage to the car, so if you can pick up some cheap vinyl (possible offcuts for the strips/numbers) it could be pretty cheap and low risk! Once my Panda (possibly Ivan) is on the road then I'll start looking at the cosmetics though...

After reading all about mk1 grilles last night I thought I'd have a quick look online, found one on an Irish site for 28 euros. Figured I'd message the seller but it would not let me send a message unless a purchase was going through so I made an offer of 20 euros so I could message the seller re postage... it's in the post to me know! It looks pretty rough but I'll strip it and repaint it anyhow, possibly modifying it to be a direct fit to my mk2... Would be great to see the pictures of your fittings though so I can get an idea of what I'm up against!

Hopefully I'll get the brake pipes flared tomorrow, then the axle back on later in the week!!

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Sisley roof bar wouldn't come under "affordable price" as far as I know The CLX roof racks are cheaper and you can make bars to go between the rack once it's on, the only issue is the fitment as you need to bolt it in. They are easier to find than Sisley racks though. You may get lucky, but I'm sure a lot of us are hoping that...

You're right, there are other ways to go. Other roof racks made to fit, custom roof racks, what ever you need really. If you need custom then you can make it how you like. I don't *need* a roof rack really, so I'm not in a hurry to get one.

I heard if you put some kind of wheel sealer type cleaner, it holds its colour better and it is easier to clean so I might have to get a bottle or what ever of that. If I go white then I'll definitely have to. I do think it will suit the red colour though, so white is a good choice. I suppose there's only one way to find out about how white wheels are to live with

The vinyl would be doable, I could try myself or there is a local company, but right now I'm not going to go for it. I suppose I could go for some subtle stripes, or something like that, but I don't want to go all out just yet! The ideas are brewing

That's cheap for a mk1 grille, lucky you found one so quick as well! I had to paint mine as well. It was already in a beige which I assumed to be a primer of sorts so I went over in some coats of red and lacquer, and as I progressed I honed my skills and it came out well. Set it off nicely with a Fiat Abarth badge from yourbadges UK (or something along the lines of that). One problem I found is that the two holes for the original Fiat badge are quite far apart, so you have to be careful when buying your badge for it, unless you can find an original big Fiat badge for it.

Re the fitment, here's mine...


It's not pretty by any standards, but it's much better than tying everything on with cables. The metal plates go from the original mk2 drilled hole to the mk1 grille as seen. I cut down some spare metal in the garage to fit it, luckily it was a pretty handy shape already so it didn't take much.

The hardest part to do is the front facing mounts, which you can see in the bottom right. The issue you have with the bottom left one is that you can't get to it easily. You can see that all I've done is attach another cut up/custom metal plate to the original mk2 mount, and then shaped it so I can bolt the mk1 grille to it.

Another problem with the front facing mounts is that they push down the mk1 grille slightly. You may be able to see that the metal on the top mount is bending downwards, only slightly, which is where the front facing mount is pressed against the corner of the grille. The grille has an extra bit of metal on each corner. The easy recitifcation for this would be to cut the extra bits of metal off on the underneath, and then the mounts shouldn't move it - then, the metal will hold the grille slightly higher. That's what I need to do basically, it's just time consuming taking it off and on, and I've got other things to do so I'll get on that at another opportunity!

If you want to know more about the grille fitting then let me know. If you wanted to change the grille to fit perfectly then I think cutting the little corners of metal off would help, and you'll either need some metal to bolt between the mk2 mounts and mk1 grille, or you'll need to modify the actual grille to fit i.e. weld some metal on to the grille with a longer thing piece that goes to the mk2 mount. Or just weld in a piece of the original slots for the mk1 bit. The choices are there, you'll find a way to go about it easy enough - my test fit was a few zip ties (though I don't recommend that as a permanent option)

Yeah I've seen a couple of roof bars (even the CLX ones) for sale and they have been pretty pricey, I'd guess making up my own will be my only option unless I do get lucky... I'll keep my eye out while I'm round and about, maybe a scrap yard somewhere near by might have one!

Talking of being lucky my mk1 grille arrived at my parents today (can't get things delivered here as if it gets left with neighbours it would never be seen again, though doubt you'd get much crack for a panda grille). My dad says it looks like a new pattern part, never been fitted still in primer that has some surface rust on the front from sitting in storage! No idea how it came to be up for sale but pretty chuffed with it. Does mean I'll not be hacking the grille itself about (seems a shame for what may one day be on a mk1 anyway) so I'll probably fit it in a similar way to you FDNY21. Thanks for the info and image, I'll let you know if I get stuck when I come to fit it, which realistically is still a long way off, cosmetic stuff is very much bottom of the list. This includes wheel colour as until I know if I'm going to do any vinyl wrapping etc. I'll not know what colour they'll need to be so for the time being they can stay silver and rust coloured!

Some form of product on the wheels makes sense, I guess it's the same as giving a car a good waxing, makes it much easier to keep clean in the future. Look forward to seeing what colour you end up with and what impact this has on the overall look of Pandino. Keep thinking on those stripes, I guess the longer you mull it over the better you'll get it, these things take time and no point rushing something when a bit longer wait will get a much better result.

Anyhow, I've got a few hours free on Sunday so hopefully I'll get a gap in this horrific weather long enough to get the axle back on and this thread will finally move on from being a long drawn out axle resto and might get interesting!

Phiz

Phiz said:

Talking of being lucky my mk1 grille arrived at my parents today (can't get things delivered here as if it gets left with neighbours it would never be seen again, though doubt you'd get much crack for a panda grille). My dad says it looks like a new pattern part, never been fitted still in primer that has some surface rust on the front from sitting in storage! No idea how it came to be up for sale but pretty chuffed with it. Does mean I'll not be hacking the grille itself about (seems a shame for what may one day be on a mk1 anyway) so I'll probably fit it in a similar way to you FDNY21. Thanks for the info and image, I'll let you know if I get stuck when I come to fit it, which realistically is still a long way off, cosmetic stuff is very much bottom of the list. This includes wheel colour as until I know if I'm going to do any vinyl wrapping etc. I'll not know what colour they'll need to be so for the time being they can stay silver and rust coloured!

Some form of product on the wheels makes sense, I guess it's the same as giving a car a good waxing, makes it much easier to keep clean in the future. Look forward to seeing what colour you end up with and what impact this has on the overall look of Pandino. Keep thinking on those stripes, I guess the longer you mull it over the better you'll get it, these things take time and no point rushing something when a bit longer wait will get a much better result.

Anyhow, I've got a few hours free on Sunday so hopefully I'll get a gap in this horrific weather long enough to get the axle back on and this thread will finally move on from being a long drawn out axle resto and might get interesting!

Phiz

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Was the primer a beige type colour? That's what mine came with, was ready to paint straight over! That sounds like really good going for the money you paid too, good find. Fiat would have produced it initially and had it in primer, and they likely sold them as spare parts - after many years pass, they no longer need the parts as spares so sell them off to other companies cheap (Partsworld UK for example, have a lot of old Fiat and other Italian car stuff from original manufacturers, like the Panda 1000 and fire badges I bought from them).

The way I fit it does work but I'm still looking at better ways. I think the corners are the main issue, so either bending them outwards slightly or trimming a tiny part of the end off of the corner may work better, but who knows. If your original mounts haven't been bent previously then you may have better fitting than me anyway as one of mine is ever so slightly further back than the other one. If you do have to modify the corners then I doubt there'd be any issue still putting it on a mk1 Panda so if it did come to that then it's not the end of the world!

My steel wheels on the red car are still silver/black and rust coloured, lucky my hubcaps cover the whole wheel so they look great The Uno Turbo wheels are almost sanded down completely, so they're almost ready for primer. The primer is going to be white even if I want gold painted wheels, so I can put the white primed wheels against the car to see how I like it! As you say, it's the effect of waxing a car you want, so some of the wax I have for the cars at home should at least do something for the wheels too seeing as how the wax is for protecting car paints.

On the topic of stripes, take a look at these...



The first one is the Wheeler Dealers car before the painted it, a nice stripe but the red wouldn't work on my red car. Which is where the second one comes in, a red car! Ignore the rust, you can still see the stripe, just about. I quite like it, I suppose I could get it to go across the boot as well! Maybe something to forward on to the local company to ask how much that would set me back? :idea:

The primer on the mk1 grille is grey, from what I've seen of it (a pretty hazy photo) still not been back to my parents to pick it up yet! No idea how the seller in Ireland came to have it, might be worth asking if he has any other bits (though more for mk1 owners than me) as he seems to sell quite a few classic car parts online. I'll do as little to it as possible to make it fit my car, ideally just making up mounting brackets, though if like you say I need to cut a little off the back which will remain unseen, I'll do this first before getting the whole thing plated.

So I spent a rainy Sunday afternoon finally getting the axle back on the car!



I wasn't able to find any of those cable tie fixings with brackets included which the original brake pipes were held on with, which is a pity as they looked pretty neat so I cut off the clip part and then cable tied these to the car with fresh cable ties.



Only issue I've had with the brake lines so far (I've not bled the brakes yet so fingers crossed no leaks on the unions) was the on one side it was a little close to the shock absorber so I bent the pipe in a little. I followed the route of the original brake pipes, which was not symetrical, I assume due to the exhaust pipe?



Sadly I didn't get any photo's of the work in progress as it was lashing it down with rain but as you can see from the last photo the rain stopped as soon as we finished to the point where by the time we left the puddles had all gone from around the car (though much of this water may have been absorbed by my jeans and hoodie!).

Had my mate Martin around to help me fit the axle and we only had a couple of small issues getting it on.
-Firstly I'd got new bump stops as the old ones were split around the base and the metal inside had all but rusted away. I figured they would just pop in, turned out I was wrong. Gift of hindsight it would have been easier to fit these before we attached the axle at the centre mounting, but we didn't and as I'd already linked the brake pipe I wasn't up for taking it off again. We ended up greasing the nipple on top then using a piece of tube and a block of wood to force the bump stop up off the axle while jacking the axle up with a trolley jack. Fortunately I had some tube in which was a perfect fit over the bump stop and just put pressure on the base itself.
-Next issue was getting the trailing arms on, we just could not get the holes to line up no matter how we had the car jacked up/down etc. Our solution (not pretty so no idea how you are supposed to do it), was for Jenny to sit in the boot of the car while martin rocked the wheel forward/backward and I got the bolts in. Amazingly this worked!

Other than that I managed to lose one of the nuts for the shock absorbers, which turned up just before we left. I left the Haynes manual at home so I've not torqued up any of the bolts (will get them all done before moving the car anywhere). I also seem to have mislaid the little guide the handbrake cable sits in (at the back of the rod) so I've not put the new cable on yet. Once these bits are done it's on to welding up the boot and making the new straps for the fuel tank (which Jenny started today plasma cutting the sink, more photos to follow).

On the subject of stripes FDNY21, I happened to see a pretty smart looking job done on a Panda on Vernons website www.limitededitionsunlimited.co.uk . Think I found my way there via the Panda facebook group. You've probably seen the car in the flesh I guess but on the home page one of the images which comes up at the top is a red mk2 panda with cool looking 4 spoke wheels on and grey stripes changing to chequer pattern at the back. Seriously smart looking car but then I guess VmanC is pretty well best placed for custom panda graphics!

Looking forward to see how those Uno Turbo wheels come out in white and possible gold, but not as much as I'm looking forward to getting mine on the road!

Phiz

Looking for a thread on timing belt change and came across the car mentioned above on here! Charmander, now owned by blu73!

Phiz said:

The primer on the mk1 grille is grey, from what I've seen of it (a pretty hazy photo) still not been back to my parents to pick it up yet! No idea how the seller in Ireland came to have it, might be worth asking if he has any other bits (though more for mk1 owners than me) as he seems to sell quite a few classic car parts online. I'll do as little to it as possible to make it fit my car, ideally just making up mounting brackets, though if like you say I need to cut a little off the back which will remain unseen, I'll do this first before getting the whole thing plated.

On the subject of stripes FDNY21, I happened to see a pretty smart looking job done on a Panda on Vernons website www.limitededitionsunlimited.co.uk . Think I found my way there via the Panda facebook group. You've probably seen the car in the flesh I guess but on the home page one of the images which comes up at the top is a red mk2 panda with cool looking 4 spoke wheels on and grey stripes changing to chequer pattern at the back. Seriously smart looking car but then I guess VmanC is pretty well best placed for custom panda graphics!

Looking forward to see how those Uno Turbo wheels come out in white and possible gold, but not as much as I'm looking forward to getting mine on the road!

Phiz

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Nice job on the axle there! It may not have been pretty, but if it works, it works One of the Uno Turbo wheels wouldn't come off my black Panda CLX so I tried all sorts of things to get it off. Hitting it with rubber mallets was first port of call, then giving the wheel a shock (jack up, suddenly un-done), even tried letting the car down onto a brick that was only half under the wheel, hoping it would dislodge it. Even though no bolts were on the wheel, it still wouldn't budge. So, I threw some boiling water from the kettle at the centre of it and then threw my spare wheel from my red Panda Fizz at it a few times and it fell off. As I said... if it works, it works

I'd recommend the test fit before painting of the grille, just in case

Ah yes, Charmander! Was originally bought by Vernon and done up for his daughter, before selling on to Didge. Didge then sold it to Blu. Blu has done an engine conversion on it to a 1.2 I believe, you'll be seeing more of it when it's finished this year!

The graphics were a nice addition, and the wheels are Fiat 127 Palio wheels, though Blu has some extra wide steelies on there at the minute. I haven't actually seen it in the flesh but I hope to do so later this year

I contacted my local company about some striping, here's the quotes I got:
1) Original Fizz decals + fitting (£100)
2) The Panda stripe as seen in a couple of images above + fitting (£80)
3) "Flashback" style rear window Panda sticker + fitting (£20)

Not sure what to do about those at the moment. Got them on hold and will probably leave them, but who knows...

You'll see the wheels soon, hopefully Tuesday for primer. I'd be surprised if you were more excited to see my wheels than getting your own car on the road!

Well I spent about an hour today looking for the handbrake part I've lost! Think I've put the damn thing somewhere safe... so safe I can't find it . Might be easier to buy another one if I can find what to search for (hand brake cable equaliser/yoke?), then when the original turns up keep it as a spare, though knowing my luck they'll be worth a fortune!

Sounds like it had been stood for quite a while FDNY21? I'll definitely get the grille fitting nicely before I even consider the finish on it, though again will be a while before I get on to that! That's the only issue with this project so far, many hours and pounds gone and unless I've run you over you'd never know . MOT man had better be impressed! The exciting bit kicks in when I start making slight customising choices, hence looking forward to seeing how your wheels turn out. Those 127 Palio wheels look brilliant, definitely know what colours I'd go for if I had those, though in a way I think steelies might be more inkeeping with the more utilitarian look that I like... not that it matters as they are no doubt out of price range and rare as hens teeth anyway!

So after discovering the Charmander thread I ended up reading it beginning to end (well the present anyway), bit of a late one in the end! Was like reading a Novel, though got to say in the middle after all that work I was rooting for the 750 engine, be interesting to see how it all is with all the mods. Filled in the gaps from the links to Pandino with the tachometer too from previous reading! Can understand the wheel change for the upgraded brakes but a pity in a way, the look of that car was just right.

I wonder how much of the vinyl costs comes down to the fitting, I guess including prep. it's a fair bit of work, might be a skill worth aquiring. Lasts 5 years, personalisation without being permanent, makes a lot of sense really. I always wanted to do a custom paint job on a car but all cars I've owned fall in to one of 2 catagories, too good to potentially ruin or too crap to pass it's next MOT.

Oh plus I think due to the angle of the corners on the stainless sink I'll only get one tank strap out of it... off to message a kitchen designer mate for some more stainless.

Phiz said:

Well I spent about an hour today looking for the handbrake part I've lost! Think I've put the damn thing somewhere safe... so safe I can't find it . Might be easier to buy another one if I can find what to search for (hand brake cable equaliser/yoke?), then when the original turns up keep it as a spare, though knowing my luck they'll be worth a fortune!

Sounds like it had been stood for quite a while FDNY21? I'll definitely get the grille fitting nicely before I even consider the finish on it, though again will be a while before I get on to that! That's the only issue with this project so far, many hours and pounds gone and unless I've run you over you'd never know . MOT man had better be impressed! The exciting bit kicks in when I start making slight customising choices, hence looking forward to seeing how your wheels turn out. Those 127 Palio wheels look brilliant, definitely know what colours I'd go for if I had those, though in a way I think steelies might be more inkeeping with the more utilitarian look that I like... not that it matters as they are no doubt out of price range and rare as hens teeth anyway!

So after discovering the Charmander thread I ended up reading it beginning to end (well the present anyway), bit of a late one in the end! Was like reading a Novel, though got to say in the middle after all that work I was rooting for the 750 engine, be interesting to see how it all is with all the mods. Filled in the gaps from the links to Pandino with the tachometer too from previous reading! Can understand the wheel change for the upgraded brakes but a pity in a way, the look of that car was just right.

I wonder how much of the vinyl costs comes down to the fitting, I guess including prep. it's a fair bit of work, might be a skill worth aquiring. Lasts 5 years, personalisation without being permanent, makes a lot of sense really. I always wanted to do a custom paint job on a car but all cars I've owned fall in to one of 2 catagories, too good to potentially ruin or too crap to pass it's next MOT.

Oh plus I think due to the angle of the corners on the stainless sink I'll only get one tank strap out of it... off to message a kitchen designer mate for some more stainless.

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This link is from ePER (link is on the line of titles on Fiat Forum), showing the handbrake components, if that's of any help to you: http://eper.fiatforum.com/eper/navi...INT_MODE=0&EPER_CAT=SP&WINDOW_ID=1&GUI_LANG=3

The black Panda CLX has been sat for a couple of years I believe. It was fine before the head gasket went, but ever since it has sat, problem after problem is arising, hence welding and battery etc required so the fate of the car really is unknown.

The 127 Palio wheels are nice but as you say fairly rare. I think the standard steels in white would look good as well, with the black Fiat plastic hubcaps that go in between the four bolts. It's always exciting when you get to the bits you can do a little customization in

The tachometer is yet to go in actually, but if I get time this Thursday, I'll give it a go with Vernon. The 750 was a distributor type system rather than the distributorless type system I have with the 1000 so I've got to find the right place to read from basically.

I don't imagine fitting costs *too* much but I do suppose the precise measuring takes a good bit of patience. Other than that, I doubt there's too much else for preparation other than making sure the surface is clean, and then it is on to applying the decals. Knowing my luck, I'd get loads of air bubbles, so I won't even try

Indeed that link it mighty usefull, though not for this issue, after spending about as long as I've had to work on the car so far looking for the stupid part I gave up and ordered one (for £15!!!) from a fiat dealership in Rochdale :bang:. I have been looking for a microfiche type thing for a panda though and know that it'll come in loads .

Picked up the grille today from my parents and you were right it is a pinky brown (the only pic. I'd seen was tiny and clearly not in great light). The part is great, just very light surface rust from storage, it has a sticker on it and it new old stock . Will put it to one side for the time being but later on I'll get round to that!

Pity about the head gasket, trouble is once a car is left sat things start to deteriorate pretty rapidly, needless to say I'm finding my progress (or lack of) a little frustraiting at the moment, though hopefully I'll have more time to work on the car soon! My birthday is coming up so I'm sending parts lists across to my sisters at the minute. Head gaskets sound like they are the only regular killer of FIRE engines so hopefully mine is all good, I know there has been a coolant based issue but possibly related to an air lock around the heater matrix... again fingers crossed, I'll flush it out, stick a new radiator on and some decent coolant and hope for the best:worship:.

On the wheel front I agree re steelies with smaller centre caps, even just the really little metal ones covering the hub bolts could be great if they are available in the right size?

Will be interested as to how you get on picking up a feed for the tacho, though not something I think I'd look at on the Panda it's a cool project and you'll certainly get to really know the ignition system on your car which lets face it will become more and more usefull as the cars get older.

I think vinyl can be hard to stretch and fit, think a lot of pulling and heating is involved, though hardest on curves so the Panda is a potential great first candiate... I've yet to even get a rough estimate re what I'm thinking on mine, though really it's a while off yet anyway.

Phiz said:

Indeed that link it mighty usefull, though not for this issue, after spending about as long as I've had to work on the car so far looking for the stupid part I gave up and ordered one (for £15!!!) from a fiat dealership in Rochdale :bang:. I have been looking for a microfiche type thing for a panda though and know that it'll come in loads .

Picked up the grille today from my parents and you were right it is a pinky brown (the only pic. I'd seen was tiny and clearly not in great light). The part is great, just very light surface rust from storage, it has a sticker on it and it new old stock . Will put it to one side for the time being but later on I'll get round to that!

Pity about the head gasket, trouble is once a car is left sat things start to deteriorate pretty rapidly, needless to say I'm finding my progress (or lack of) a little frustraiting at the moment, though hopefully I'll have more time to work on the car soon! My birthday is coming up so I'm sending parts lists across to my sisters at the minute. Head gaskets sound like they are the only regular killer of FIRE engines so hopefully mine is all good, I know there has been a coolant based issue but possibly related to an air lock around the heater matrix... again fingers crossed, I'll flush it out, stick a new radiator on and some decent coolant and hope for the best:worship:.

On the wheel front I agree re steelies with smaller centre caps, even just the really little metal ones covering the hub bolts could be great if they are available in the right size?

Will be interested as to how you get on picking up a feed for the tacho, though not something I think I'd look at on the Panda it's a cool project and you'll certainly get to really know the ignition system on your car which lets face it will become more and more usefull as the cars get older.

I think vinyl can be hard to stretch and fit, think a lot of pulling and heating is involved, though hardest on curves so the Panda is a potential great first candiate... I've yet to even get a rough estimate re what I'm thinking on mine, though really it's a while off yet anyway.

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I know what you mean about putting things down and then not being able to find them, I put a sticker away (safely, of course) so that I could use it inside my car. Took me ages to find that! I put a hoodie of mine somewhere safe a few months ago as well, no idea where that is. Genuinely disappeared!

The grille sounds great, looking forward to seeing that on your car (and what ever vinyl you perhaps have planned?) when it comes to it! My mk1 grille is looking worse and worse off... I looked at it today and it has four stone chips now, one of them is quite big in comparison to the others as well. A partial respray may end up being rubbish, but a full respray seems unwarranted after only painting it originally a few months ago. Gah, not sure what to do about that :bang:

The head gasket isn't too bad to be honest. While I haven't tried it yet, I hear it's one of the easier things to repair. It's not like modern engines where half the engine bay has to come out! I got quoted £300 for the gasket but can do it myself for pennies, the issue now is everything else. It's suffering from rust in various areas, I was quoted £300 to get enough welding done to pass an MOT. On top of that it's all the lights, the battery, potentially new wheels/tyres, all adds up quite fast. I will put the money into it if I know I'll get it out at the end, but the issue is that I can't guarantee I'll get the money back for it. You can buy other Pandas for quite cheap still, so really the fate is unknown. Would be a shame to part it out but I can't keep it on the drive forever

As you say, head gasket tends to be the thing that goes on the FIRE engine, but bar that the engine is relatively bulletproof. Tends to be that way, anyway!

For the centre caps, these are what I mean: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fiat-Uno-Panda-141a-inc-4x4-Wheel-Centre-Caps-/231923470125

Little plastic caps, they go inbetween all of the wheel bolts. These are the proper small ones! The metal ones you mention I believe are the mid-sized ones, they go under the wheel bolts but don't cover the outer edges? I haven't found any of those for sale. The ones I have on Pandino are the massive plastic ones that cover everything, I like them, especially when they cover steels that are more surface rust coloured

Maybe the stone chipping on the original grille is one of the reasons for the change to the plastic one? I guess it is fairly exposed there. Vinyl will depend very much on cost as I've not really got a price on it yet (mainly as I've not really decided what I'm going to do!). Hopefully the vinyl will offer the bodywork underneath some extra protection, fingers crossed combined with good prep. cavity wax and waxoyl underneath I can keep the rust at bay!

It's not so much changing the head gasket that worries me, I've done one before in an assistant role and nothing too troublesome there, it is just the constant worry that the head may be cracked or warped afterwards, got to be 5-6k miles of worry before you start to get confident after a head gasket change.

Pandas are at that age now where the value is still low enough that many are getting scrapped/parted out. It happens with most cars at some point prior to getting fully recognised as a classic, some cars are not worth saving but it is just working out quite where you stand with this one. If it survives the next few years then even if it needs a load of work it will get done as the Panda becomes a rarer beast. It does appear to have the potential to be a really smart car, where has the rust got in? At least if you do part it out, rather than weigh it in, the parts will keep other pandas on the road. Hopefully the work I'm doing on mine will keep it sweet for many years so that by the time it next needs any major work it's future will be secure .

On the wheel front, having just seen how crap the Wheeler Dealer car looks with orange wheels I may proceed with caution on my wheel colour choice

I had misunderstood what you meant re centre caps, that is exactly the sort of thing I'm after (saved the link!). I thought you meant rather than fully covering the wheel (and any rust) like on Pandino you meant the sort which just covers the centre (including all 4 bolts). like the ones that just cover the hub nut, and ideally keep a little grease on it, though it does mean I'll need shinier wheel nuts, otherwise fingers crossed they will be the only visible bit of rust on the car.

Phiz said:

Maybe the stone chipping on the original grille is one of the reasons for the change to the plastic one? I guess it is fairly exposed there. Vinyl will depend very much on cost as I've not really got a price on it yet (mainly as I've not really decided what I'm going to do!). Hopefully the vinyl will offer the bodywork underneath some extra protection, fingers crossed combined with good prep. cavity wax and waxoyl underneath I can keep the rust at bay!

It's not so much changing the head gasket that worries me, I've done one before in an assistant role and nothing too troublesome there, it is just the constant worry that the head may be cracked or warped afterwards, got to be 5-6k miles of worry before you start to get confident after a head gasket change.

Pandas are at that age now where the value is still low enough that many are getting scrapped/parted out. It happens with most cars at some point prior to getting fully recognised as a classic, some cars are not worth saving but it is just working out quite where you stand with this one. If it survives the next few years then even if it needs a load of work it will get done as the Panda becomes a rarer beast. It does appear to have the potential to be a really smart car, where has the rust got in? At least if you do part it out, rather than weigh it in, the parts will keep other pandas on the road. Hopefully the work I'm doing on mine will keep it sweet for many years so that by the time it next needs any major work it's future will be secure .

On the wheel front, having just seen how crap the Wheeler Dealer car looks with orange wheels I may proceed with caution on my wheel colour choice

I had misunderstood what you meant re centre caps, that is exactly the sort of thing I'm after (saved the link!). I thought you meant rather than fully covering the wheel (and any rust) like on Pandino you meant the sort which just covers the centre (including all 4 bolts). like the ones that just cover the hub nut, and ideally keep a little grease on it, though it does mean I'll need shinier wheel nuts, otherwise fingers crossed they will be the only visible bit of rust on the car.

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It could well be one of the reasons for the change, but plastic grilles were exciting back then so it was probably just changed over so that everything was uniform and used the same material (as opposed to producing various different grilles). Maybe I just needed more lacquer on my grille though, I'll have to give it some more paint and lacquer at some point. My badge is a couple millimeters down on the left hand side so I was tempted to do it again at some point anyway... can do it all when I have to change the grille mounts!

Chaz comes with a spare head freshly skimmed with the head gasket so it would be fine as long as no other components were damaged. Don't have anyone other than my cousin interested though, and my cousin may end up getting a newer car instead, so it's still in the balance. That's exactly the thing, Pandas are getting sought after and scrapped at this point, they're starting to pick up albeit slowly, so once the demand rises further then the point where a car is supposedly "restorable" changes. As you say, it's just finding where I stand on this one. Unfortunately it's not for me as I want to end up with a 4x4 at some point next, and if I wanted to do up a 4x2 properly I'd do my Fizz rather than the CLX or find a different special edition. So, I have to find someone for it, or if the worse comes to worst, lots of people to part out to.

The Wheeler Dealers car is horrible unfortunately The 4x4 it was before was awesome, with the rare Panda stripes! If only it was still like that, shame it got painted with that horrible paint and tacky scheme...

You've got options on the hubcaps. In addition to the full size and the small size, there's the two mid-sizes, one is the one used on the 1000S I believe which was a black plastic type one, and then there's the silver plastic ones that were on various models as well. If I was going for repainted steels then I'd show them off with the small size caps, the small size ones are cheaper and easier to find too, so much easier to replace if you lost one! I'm going to wire brush my wheel bolts and then paint them black because I have black center caps for the white Uno Turbo wheels

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I said this a little while back on your thread: "Firstly, I removed what I could - depends on where it is on what you will use. Sandpaper, wire brush, or one of those wired discs that you can use in a drill. I used one of the wired discs to remove the most of it and used a wire brush to get into the bits I missed, then I went over with kurust. I didn't have primer but I went over in some good coats of stone chip shield and black paint, then waxoyl over the entire underbody when dry."

One thing to note is that you can use zinc primer as well, very good for stopping rust. I've got some surface rust coming out where I did my previous repair so next time I go over it I'll use some zinc primer. I know you used Hammerite so already some more durable stuff, but if you want to put some zinc primer underneath your stone chip/paint then I'd recommend something good like this Bilt Hamber stuff: http://www.bilthamber.com/paints-and-coatings/electrox

You can get good waxoyl for the underneath/box sections from them too, I'll be tempted by their products next time I go over. The Hammerite waxoyl is doing fine for me but the Bilt Hamber stuff looks great for the box sections especially as it gets everywhere rather than just where you spray.

And one other thing - when doing the underneath of the vehicle, Vernon tells me you can use the stone chip protection over the paint rather than the other way around. I think I put the paint on top instead, but doing it the other way does make sense as you don't need to see the underneath so I suppose it's some extra protection!