Hello all,

New to the Fiat Forum, and looking for a bit of help re. the Panda 4X4 1989
I need to replace the motor, mine is beyond help, and would like to know what will fit, what to go for. It's a 1000cc FIRE engine, but will any 1000cc FIRE go in, if I keep / swap the ancillaries or was the 4x4 motor different in any way ?

I also had a 1000CL a while ago and that was a 4 speed whereas the 4X4 is a 5 speed, so maybe the 4X4 had a different power curve, different cam ? The two took different alternators to, so some of the mountings are different. More broadly, could I get any 1000, or bigger FIRE engine, Punto, fuel injected, etc and fit that ? I can keep all my fixtures and fittings, if the basic blocks are the same ? My Engine no. is 156A3000, type 141AE53B, Spares no. 4046622

It's a great little car, too good to bin, but before I start digging on the internet and in the local breakers, can anyone help.

Any help very gratefully received

Regards

Welcome,

You're deffnately in corect place...

Any car pictures?

Re: biger FIRE engine please type 1242 in the search box, pleanty has been said.

Yes the 4x4 has a different cam (from either 4 or 5 speed 2wd models. Depending what the problem is with your existing engine most bits are interchangeable with any 999 or 1108 engine, 1108s are cheap & plentiful as everyone wants the 1242 for engine swaps. If you can re use the head with a replacement block it will make life easier as most engines you'll lay your hands on will be injected. If you're not bothered about keeping it original then a 1242 injection swap is a good option.

If you can find one a 1108 carb engine out of an Uno 60 is ideal - dead easy to fit.

dragonwagon said:

If you can find one a 1108 carb engine out of an Uno 60 is ideal - dead easy to fit.

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Sadly it was a rare engine option which was only available from '89 to '92 so not easy to come by. Easier to find a spare 999 carb engine on here to get it up & running again.

firstcar-Y10 said:

Yes the 4x4 has a different cam (from either 4 or 5 speed 2wd models. Depending what the problem is with your existing engine most bits are interchangeable with any 999 or 1108 engine, 1108s are cheap & plentiful as everyone wants the 1242 for engine swaps. If you can re use the head with a replacement block it will make life easier as most engines you'll lay your hands on will be injected. If you're not bothered about keeping it original then a 1242 injection swap is a good option.

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oops, let me amend that, SPi 1108.. Don't think the block changed much on the MPi but head & ancilliaries got quite different.

firstcar-Y10 said:

Sadly it was a rare engine option which was only available from '89 to '92 so not easy to come by. Easier to find a spare 999 carb engine on here to get it up & running again.

Click to expand...

Currently hiding one in the back of my shed - imminent rebuild project !

dragonwagon said:

Currently hiding one in the back of my shed - imminent rebuild project !

Click to expand...

Mmmm, nice

I keep wondering, what would be the cheaper option - buying a punto for £300 and using the 1242 engine etc as a swap or changing all the internals to 1108 on the carbed panda which is a bit gutless.

I suppose I should wait for the GTie before starting another project though!

Did you see Black betty the cinq was for sale Andrew? firstcar-Y10

dragonwagon said:

Currently hiding one in the back of my shed - imminent rebuild project !

Click to expand...

got £17 as scrap for mine

last year :bang:

Charlie

panda panda said:

I keep wondering, what would be the cheaper option - buying a punto for £300 and using the 1242 engine etc as a swap or changing all the internals to 1108 on the carbed panda which is a bit gutless.

I suppose I should wait for the GTie before starting another project though!

Did you see Black betty the cinq was for sale Andrew? firstcar-Y10

Click to expand...

I think I would find out why the carb'd 999cc was gutless, the carb'd cars usually have more pep than injection due to not having a CAT etc so perhaps you need a good service and maybe a carb clean?

panda panda said:

I keep wondering, what would be the cheaper option - buying a punto for £300 and using the 1242 engine etc as a swap or changing all the internals to 1108 on the carbed panda which is a bit gutless.

I suppose I should wait for the GTie before starting another project though!

Did you see Black betty the cinq was for sale Andrew? @firstcar-Y10

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Yup, kindly got a heads up before the ad went up actually. Nice, but not really the sensible daily driver I was looking for

panda1408 said:

I think I would find out why the carb'd 999cc was gutless, the carb'd cars usually have more pep than injection due to not having a CAT etc so perhaps you need a good service and maybe a carb clean?

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No way am I touching the carb with my hands of doom!

That's a guaranteed way of total destruction. Service? It has to be broken for it to warrant me to go anwhere near the oily bits - honestly I only ever make things worse

panda panda said:

No way am I touching the carb with my hands of doom!

That's a guaranteed way of total destruction. Service? It has to be broken for it to warrant me to go anwhere near the oily bits - honestly I only ever make things worse

Click to expand...

.......but swapping in a 1242 from a Punto is an easier option

firstcar-Y10 said:

.......but swapping in a 1242 from a Punto is an easier option

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yeah.. right..

if you have a panda with a carb its not that easy.

you need a fuel tank that has the fuel pump built into the sender/fuel level unit.
then you swap that out for a high pressure one from off a punto.. or pay silly money for an inline fuel pump.

i currently have this issue.

just dont forget to get the ECU, CODE box (just above the inside fuse box) and key from the dona punto if you go for a punto engine swap.

firstcar-Y10 said:

.......but swapping in a 1242 from a Punto is an easier option

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Who said I would be doing the swapping?

If the swap was done could an ecu unlock be done? Either at a specialist or is there a Manual way around. On the Peugeot/citroens pre multiplex you just turn the ignition on and unplug the ecu

Evening,

Many thanks for all the replies. Fantastic. Apologies for this late reply, but Ive been away from this computer for a few days. You can see that we live in France but always look back to England for anything like this. Brits are so much better at forums, anything to do with car clubs, classic cars, classic bikes, (got a couple of those too) etc. So thanks.
Carrying on with this engine stuff, I thought that the 4x4 would have a different cam, would I need to keep it if I got hold of an 1108 or a 1242 ? Or would the extra cc's make up for the difference in the valve timing ? Bit more grunt ? I reckon my head is O.K, but has been skimmed twice now, so possibly not ? if I needed to keep it, would it be a straight swop onto an 1108 or a 1242. Were they simply stroked, and or, only slightly bored so that any of the flat heads goes on any block ? There were / are millions of Pandas out here so I may be able to get a 1242. If so, and maybe if it was injected are the manifolds a straight swop so that I could keep the carb' ?
Apologies if there are too many questions here, but someone said I was in the right place and I'm trying to find what to go for before bringing something home from the breakers only to find that it's no good, doesn't fit, ancillaries don't mount, ignition, fuel, etc.

Again any help very gratefully received.

Cheers Tom. ( Louis is 14 often drove this car, off road, before and is badgering me to sort it !!)

Panda Louis said:

If so, and maybe if it was injected are the manifolds a straight swop so that I could keep the carb' ?
Apologies if there are too many questions here, but someone said I was in the right place and I'm trying to find what to go for before bringing something home from the breakers only to find that it's no good, doesn't fit, ancillaries don't mount, ignition, fuel, etc.

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There are level marks on cylinder head face - approx. 10mm diameter 1mm reces, should not go beyond this point as piston and valves will get in touch.

Above intake valves cyl 2 and 3 and below exh valve on cyl 1 and 4.
Photo shows my sisley head, one mark is nearly gone now.



For old the other question please have a read thru few last pages of John DragonMan - Falout project -lots of swap info there.

On bore sizes etc, 999 and 1108 are the same bore (70mm) with a longer stroke for the 1108, 1242 is a bigger bore too. If you want to keep the carb, existing head onto 1108 block would be easiest. If the head is not useable then an spi 1108 will take the existing inlet manifold & carb, just team with a low pressure electric fuel pump to feed the carb. If you're using a complete 1108 engine, probably keep the cam that's in it for simplicitys sake, no significant benefit to swapping in the 4x4 cam.