Greg1275 said:

With regard to Alix, that date does coincide with a period of ill health suffered by myself. I be will requesting that eBay and Paypal do provide me with records going back to that time and I will come back to you with the results as and when there available.

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As you sent me the invoice I think it is just a case of typing Paypal Invoice no.0161 into your paypal account and it will come up as paid on 25-8-2013 at 21:25hrs. Works on mine.

It's sad really that this could all have been much nicer for everyone involved on here. You could have advertised the items and taken any requests for parts on here for free ( l mean avoiding eBay and PayPal fees not giving away parts ), and built up trust that way. Instead you have come on here accusing one of our most liked and well respected forum members of lieing or having some agenda of harming your business, which I find frankly ludicrous. Then it turns out that another sale to another well liked and respected member of our forum has had a problem with a sale of an item from yourself and you are saying that you are requesting eBay and PayPal to send you records. You need only go into your PayPal archive online to see every payment to and from your account, and I believe you can filter dates too.

I'm not looking to pick a fight, but since we are the biggest group of panda owners in the UK and therefore probably your entire customer base it would have been a better idea on your part to come on here and have a nicer attitude is all. We have all been caught out by dodgy sellers on eBay, myself included, and since we are such a close knit helpful and friendly group we try to stop each other getting screwed over. I don't know if you have or havent been a dodgy seller, but you can't blame people for being cautious. Not trying to be harsh, just trying to stop you before you completely alienate your customer base, you can turn this thing around if its a misunderstanding I'm sure.

Well it's finally time to break the silence. Hello all and especially to you Mr. Greg Davies Greg1275...



Hi there nice to see ya, I am homeward's imaginary friend. On the 26th of August 2013 at 13:41pm I paid you £90 for door trim plastics and a pair of filler neck pipes with locking caps and keys.

Obviously this was never received and you basically fobbed me off with excuses for two weeks before blocking me on your old ebay account and then not answering any of my messages or calls.

I feel you have had plenty of time to make this right with me especially as you've still got the parts and are advertising them accross all kinds of social media, presumably to get more money out of unfortunate, trustworthy people.

I am not prepared to believe anything you say about "ill health", I got the excuse at the time that you were "a man down at work" and "either working or sleeping" so it doesn't really ring true with me, as this time period also coinsides with Alik's sale that you owe him for aswell.

So I think you could make this right with us by either supplying the parts we paid for, or simply giving us our money back - that's all we want!

Threads like this on the forum may be destructive and out of order with the ebayer in question, but for the same reason they are keeping us from getting involved with people like yourself, I'm glad in a way that you have come on here to explain yourself as atleast we can now get both sides of the story!

Payment from 26th of August 2013 of £90, you'll find it using the "Search" process in PayPal, refund or parts please as I am owed, many thanks.

onemanmade said:

It's sad really that this could all have been much nicer for everyone involved on here. You could have advertised the items and taken any requests for parts on here for free ( l mean avoiding eBay and PayPal fees not giving away parts ), and built up trust that way. Instead you have come on here accusing one of our most liked and well respected forum members of lieing or having some agenda of harming your business, which I find frankly ludicrous. Then it turns out that another sale to another well liked and respected member of our forum has had a problem with a sale of an item from yourself and you are saying that you are requesting eBay and PayPal to send you records. You need only go into your PayPal archive online to see every payment to and from your account, and I believe you can filter dates too.

I'm not looking to pick a fight, but since we are the biggest group of panda owners in the UK and therefore probably your entire customer base it would have been a better idea on your part to come on here and have a nicer attitude is all. We have all been caught out by dodgy sellers on eBay, myself included, and since we are such a close knit helpful and friendly group we try to stop each other getting screwed over. I don't know if you have or havent been a dodgy seller, but you can't blame people for being cautious. Not trying to be harsh, just trying to stop you before you completely alienate your customer base, you can turn this thing around if its a misunderstanding I'm sure.

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onemanmade,

All I have done within this thread is express my views based on the information available to me. As you know the other members of this forum, you are privy to more information than myself.

It has not been my intention to impugn the expressed views of any members of this forum, the problem that I faced was that homeward was broadcasting views that I had done something wrong without saying what that something was. This left me in a position where I was unable to address these apparent issues.

All i've been trying to do is to get to the bottom of the issues in order to bring closure to both sides. Andy has now finally come out and into the open and expressed his problem, which I shall address later in this post.

I wasn't previously aware of the fiat forum until some on facebook brought this thread to my attention.

eBay like any other sales venue is less than perfect and contains a small minority of dodgy buyers and sellers, both of which I have lost out to on various occasions. I always remember my grandfathers wise words of "you win some and you loose some" and "life goes on"
Alixcompo the problem I had with the simple invoice search was I have only sent 97 invoices numbered from 2 and 98. I then searched my all transactions view, which only went back as far as january this year. So im currently in the process of obtaining records from paypal going back further than this.
AndyPanda4x4 Thank you for finally coming out into the open on this issue, it would have been nice if you could have done this earlier. I have run checks on my both my ebay and paypal accounts using your facebook ID of "Andy Berryman", please let me know if i've got this wrong. I've taken screen shots of the results which are posted as follows.

Regarding the issue of my previous account, I stopped using that account in around 2006 after loosing my internet access following injuries sustained from a car accident. I subsequently forgot the username and passwords, by this stage my email account had been closed due to loss of the internet account. My girlfriend set our current ebay account up in 2008.

The only records I have of dealing with an "Andy Berryman" are a friendship request, which I accepted, followed by a brief exchange of messages via facebook over fiat panda parts that I had available for sale (screenshot attached).

If Andy and my self have had any dealings through my previous email account then were now talking about things that happened 8 years ago. 8 years ago I was still running fiat pandas, so I certainly wasn't selling parts as I needed them for myself. I dont think it would be beneficial for any of us to be going back that far.

In conclusion, I hope that I have now addressed the issues, bar Alix's as im still in the process of acquiring full facts before making a decision.

Just to start off, I'm writing this as a total neutral.

Is this thread appropriate? The reason for me asking this is a 'declared fact' was

'I don't know whether this is a single incident; or a misunderstanding'

If it is a genuine misunderstanding, then I think creating this thread and using the tag 'rogue seller' is a little on the harsh side.

However, I believe that the OP is genuinely trying to protect FF members' interests, which is to be applauded and is very nice to see.

Greg1275, first of all I'd just like to point out that there is no screenshot of any Facebook webpage, only the eBay/Paypal ones. Also, assuming you have searched for the correct Andy, I would just search for his surname. I doubt it says Andy on his birth certificate Do you have any Paypal or eBay notifications via email that could relate to these transactions, so you could go back into 2013 as required? It might speed things up, rather than wait for an answer from Paypal.

I hope this all gets sorted out amicably.

I'm obviously missing something here, but all you need to do is list the PayPal incoming transactions surely? As the date and time for the transactions is known, this only takes a minute & the PayPal screen print will answer the questions straight away.

I often use this to double check that I've correctly recorded all of the Pinky the Panda donations. Kind folk send small amounts to my PayPal account for Pinky & as soon as I spend money via PayPal it uses that balance - to check I need to look at the payments received (so I don't miss a 10p donation for example) I have no problem with anyone with legitimate cause seeing my PayPal receipts - I'd just blank off anything not relevant if I was worried about it.

I'm trying not to take any sides here, but I do know the people involved & am certain that they believe they have been done, from what I've read. This of course doesn't mean it's black & white, and it's good that the seller is prepared to state his case.

What happened with the complaint cases when the problem was raised with Ebay though - the last time a seller misbehaved with me & failed to respond, Ebay/PayPal were creditably quick to refund my money? The seller was pretty shocked when they took the money back!

By the way, I'm also not very comfortable with this thread, but as the Panda section is so close knit it's understandable. As a regular Panda parts buyer, I appreciate knowing when there's potentially a problem seller.

Thank you for responding chaos,

I did raise the issue of appropriateness with the mods when this thread was 1st started. In particular the issue of homeward broadcasting unsubstantiated comments on behalf of a apparently on behalf of an anonymous third party. custard responded to the complaint by suggesting that it was ok as I "had not provided any evidence".

To my mind this stance was quite clearly ridiculous when the 1st sentence of post 1 reads "I have been asked by another member of the Classic Panda section to relay the following message".

My primary concern has been the reluctance of certain members to reveal what is going on.

The missing facebook screenshot was caused by me forgetting to ad the shot to my last post, which I will remedy in this post. Thankyou for bringing this to my attention.

I would also like to thankyou for suggesting the email search idea, im slightly annoyed with myself for not thinking of it earlier. Ive run this search on my email account for the names "Berryman" & "Alexcompo" and again it showed no results, the screenshots are attached to this post.

Greg1275 said:

Thank you for responding chaos,

I did raise the issue of appropriateness with the mods when this thread was 1st started. In particular the issue of homeward broadcasting unsubstantiated comments on behalf of a apparently on behalf of an anonymous third party. custard responded to the complaint by suggesting that it was ok as I "had not provided any evidence".

To my mind this stance was quite clearly ridiculous when the 1st sentence of post 1 reads "I have been asked by another member of the Classic Panda section to relay the following message".

My primary concern has been the reluctance of certain members to reveal what is going on.

The missing facebook screenshot was caused by me forgetting to ad the shot to my last post, which I will remedy in this post. Thankyou for bringing this to my attention.

I would also like to thankyou for suggesting the email search idea, im slightly annoyed with myself for not thinking of it earlier. Ive run this search on my email account for the names "Berryman" & "Alexcompo" and again it showed no results, the screenshots are attached to this post.

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Now lets add context to the proposition my stance was ridiculous.
I had ascertained who the member in question was.
On this basis I decided to let the thread run.
By your reckoning I shouldn't believe 'unsubstantiated' points from a long term member,but should have believed yours.

Greg1275 said:

Thank you for responding chaos,

I did raise the issue of appropriateness with the mods when this thread was 1st started. In particular the issue of homeward broadcasting unsubstantiated comments on behalf of a apparently on behalf of an anonymous third party. custard responded to the complaint by suggesting that it was ok as I "had not provided any evidence".

To my mind this stance was quite clearly ridiculous when the 1st sentence of post 1 reads "I have been asked by another member of the Classic Panda section to relay the following message".

My primary concern has been the reluctance of certain members to reveal what is going on.

The missing facebook screenshot was caused by me forgetting to ad the shot to my last post, which I will remedy in this post. Thankyou for bringing this to my attention.

I would also like to thankyou for suggesting the email search idea, im slightly annoyed with myself for not thinking of it earlier. Ive run this search on my email account for the names "Berryman" & "Alexcompo" and again it showed no results, the screenshots are attached to this post.

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Go into your PayPal archive, there should be a date setting field there, you should be able to see all transactions within your selected timeframe

So ultimately Greg I messaged you through facebook to find out whether or not you are the same person who I was dealing with before, but also to find out whether or not you were still advertising these parts that we have already paid for, which you are and posting the screenshot of our facebook dealings has shown this.

I only came accross you again when you posted on the Italian Panda group advertising the same Pandas which I recognised from last year when I paid you the money. You were advertising a set of Yugo alloys which were on your grey 4x4, and you took pictures of the white one for me when I asked about parts. I have all of our dealings saved on my PC at home, which ofcourse is now broken. But I do have the paypal details which still match up with your email address gd1275@(onlineemail).com - I am not publishing your email in full on this public forum.

I have the paypal details from my end in picture format which I can PM you, but again I am not publishing these public.

As onemanmade says use the backdate search field in paypal to view your transactions from previous months.

I am unable to claim money back direct through ebay as the auction was suggestive of a car being broken for spares - contact for details. Paypal are unable to claim money back as I paid outside their covered medium ie. "send money to friends or family", which just shows you why it shouldn't be done - as this happens, completely my failing.

AndyPanda4x4 said:

You were advertising a set of Yugo alloys which were on your grey 4x4...

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Worth a read of this thread, then.... :chin:

Hadn't made the connection, before: but now it all makes sense.... :bang:

Three points -- as I keep having mud slung at me (although I'm still sparkly white, when I look in the mirror: so my clothes must be made of Teflon...):

1. A massive heap of thanks to those who have backed me up: publically and privately.
2. I would not have written what I had were there not a great deal of substance behind it... -- I just didn't want to drop AndyPanda4x4 in it.
3. If a period of ill-health were a good reason for not supplying parts -- and not just an excuse -- then I wouldn't have a 100% eBay record. As most people on this section of the Forum know: I have suffered such ill-health, increasingly, since 1996.

That's all he wrote.

Of course I forgot to add - I did contact homeward to write on my behalf as I had been told as part of my dealings with the authorities to, under no circumstances, announce that I was part of any of this. But as I said before, I felt my friends and co-pandits needed warning about a possible pirate, and because I know I can trust him 110%, homeward got the job - and it has now escalated into what we have here, with the mud being slung in the wrong direction - it will all come out in the wash though, so to speak.

homeward said:

Worth a read of this thread, then.... :chin:

Hadn't made the connection, before: but now it all makes sense.... :bang: :

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That's the one I meant in my first post in this thread. Sorry I thought they were Y10 wheels (Y10 Panda based, Yugo 127 based - easy to confuse!) - I couldn't recall which thread it was in.

Palio said:

That's the one I meant in my first post. Sorry I thought they were Y10 wheels (Y10 Panda based, Yugo 127 based - easy to confuse!) - I couldn't recall which thread it was in.

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Funnily enough, I knew what you meant (but also couldn't quite place them...): as, at one stage, I was thinking of bidding for them, as a favour to lewey (sorry to drag your name into this...): just in case it was him that the seller had taken a dislike to. How ironic....

All fascinating stuff.....just caught up with all this as its 91degrees outside and I thought it best to come indoors for a bit.

Keep up the good work...could be a new series of Sherlock out of this..

Palio said:

That's the one I meant in my first post in this thread. Sorry I thought they were Y10 wheels (Y10 Panda based, Yugo 127 based - easy to confuse!) - I couldn't recall which thread it was in.

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Those Yugo alloys were on ebay again within the last week.

purple haze said:

All fascinating stuff.....just caught up with all this as its 91degrees outside and I thought it best to come indoors for a bit.

Keep up the good work...could be a new series of Sherlock out of this..

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I take it you're not in the UK then! That deduction was based solely on your temperature description, amazing though that sounds!!

purple haze said:

...as its 91degrees outside and I thought it best to come indoors for a bit.

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I hope that's Fahrenheit...!

Once spent a day wandering around Maryland in 100-degree (and almost 100% humidity) weather. Lost about 5 lbs (whilst we're talking old money) in a day. Thank goodness for air-conditioned cabs...!

PS: I was a lot younger, fitter, and slimmer, then....

Haha....nah, a month in Florida. It seems to be full of Americans..

Still, back on topic....so, when are Andy and Alex getting their money?? Assuming their PayPal accounts are not " The hound of the Baskerville " ( works of fiction) or are we waiting for " The Brothers Grim" (famous writers of...well you know what genre) To get our answer??

purple haze said:

Haha....nah, a month in Florida. It seems to be full of Americans..

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At least it's not full of tourists...!