Technical Rear subframe or trailing arm bush replace?

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Technical Rear subframe or trailing arm bush replace?

minisandfiats

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My Multi has failed MOT on rear bush, tyres and CV joint- tester said rear trailing arm was a "dangerous fail"! Ouch!

Quoted £300 to fix which doesn't seem too bad, but don't know if I will as car has done nearly 200k and think there is other stuff looming.

Been to Loom's scrapyard (Derby) this pm, they have a couple of Multis in. Is there an easy way in checking the bushes on the trailing arm without a wheel on? If so I might have a go at getting and swapping subframe?

Reading on forum bushes are a bugger to do aren't they?

What do people think?
Thanks!
 
The Trailing arms pivot on Bearings (Taper-Rollers), usually incorrectly called 'bushes', one pair in each Arm, they're like Motorbike swing-arms.
The Trailing arms are mounted to the Sub-frame, which is mounted to the Chassis via four Alloy and Rubber Mounts (usually called Bushes).

If the Trailing arm Bearings are very badly worn (as it sounds from the tester's comment), then they can be a right PITA to remove, expect that £300 quote to climb if they have problems replacing the bearings.

I, and many others, have been through it, twice personally, both times I removed the Sub-frame from the car completely, made the job so much easier in the long run.

The Bearing kits are only around £25 per side, and aren't a bad job for a fairly competent home mechanic.

Sub-frame mounts

Trailing arm bearings

You could check the state of the trailing arm bearings by trying to move the pivot point (the front of the arm), try to lever it up/down/fore/aft with a large screwdriver or crowbar.

Same for checking the bushes the sub-frame is mounted on, try to lever the sub-frame away from the chassis, should be very little movement, just the slight 'give' in the rubbers.
 
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I have a complete sub frame available…..abs sensors and brake lines.. £125.00…. does need one trailing arm bush doing but easy as its all off…..I'm in County Durham….
 
Thanks for that! It's the trailing arm bearing it failed on.

When I jacked it up, there didn't seem much movement, but I did think they had gone as the rear wheel has severe negative camber (pointing in at top)!

Might have a go at levering it again, and possibly attacking one in scrapyard. County Durham a bit far as in Derbyshire, but thanks for offer!
 
Trailing arm bearings?

Even when the wheels are leaning in noticeably, you might not feel any movement.
My original Multi went through an MOT not that long before I did the Bearings, they were totally kaput, weren't even any rollers left in two of the Bearings :eek:
 
That's weird! Was hoping to check arms of one in scrapyard and using it if decent, but if it's difficult to check wear without wheels on that might not work!
 
Hi


Can I second that about the lack of play. As bikedoc said, there's very little to notice. It's only when you take them apart that you realize how bad they are. On both sides, the outer bearings had lost their balls, so to speak! All that was left was a mixture of ground up rusty metal (the races) and not a lot else.


I replaced both of mine with the subframe on the car (luxury of on street parking only at the time) The best thing I did though was buy a steel cutting disc. I managed to cut the axles off, drop the swingarm out of the way, using a crow bar between the swing arm and the subframe, and then bray the remnants out using a drift and a Fiat's best friend. One side took me just over 2 hours, while the other took me the best part of the day, as the seat that the bearing presses onto was knackered so I had to reshape it and do some shimming to get the spacing and bearing tension correct.


I would suggest that the £300 would go up steeply with anything like this.


BTW, mine has done nearly 190K, and I put it's first clutch ever in just before Christmas. I thought about getting rid, but I figure that I've replaced all of the common issue items now, and things should be okay now??
 
Oh noooooo! That's probably jinxed it now James :eek:
Multi owners know not to tempt fate in that way (y)

. . . if it's difficult to check wear without wheels on that might not work . . .
With a decent size Prybar (big tyre lever for example), you will get movement in the pivot area if there's any wear.

I would suggest however, that you assume any secondhand sub-frame will need new bearings.

If you've got a complete sub-frame assembly sitting on the floor, it would be silly not to fit them, then you'll know you'll have a trouble-free rear end for a good long while, as long as the mountings are good, and to be honest, I'd consider replacing those as well, start from 'scratch' so to speak.

It will save you time/money/grief in the long run.

While you're at it, fit grease nipples to the arms as well, they should outlast the rest of the car then.
They need to go near the outer ends of the pivot 'tube', so they feed grease in between the seal and the bearing . . .


Have a read through these to give yourself an idea . . .
Sub-frame removal and T-A Bearings

There's more . . .
 
Wow, that is a good deal.
Tempting to put new parts on/in, but I hate replacing parts that don't really need to be.

Got plenty of other things that suck up my cash, four Kids (20-26) that are still living at home for starters . . . :rolleyes:
 
I only mention it in case someone here has corrosion to the machined seat for the needle roller bearings. If they're badly shot (or you've mullered the arms smacking the old bearings out) then this is a cheap way out.

The main problem I can see with using them is that you'll almost certainly need to fork out on new ABS sensors as well, as you'll have little or no chance of getting them out of the old arms in one piece.
 
I only mention it in case someone here has corrosion to the machined seat for the needle roller bearings. If they're badly shot (or you've mullered the arms smacking the old bearings out) then this is a cheap way out . . .
In which case, you won't get the £90 surcharge back, so they'll actually cost you £146 each . . . :rolleyes:
 
I certainly have jinxed it, but I gave up trying not to tempt fate about 2 months after I bought mine. I now assume that every job will take a day, and if I have any time left over, then it's a roaring success!
 
Thanks for replies!

How did the MOT tester check the bearings if there is no play visible? Must have used a big lever I support, although wheel has a lot of negative camber!

Will get wheel off, jack it up and have a damn good pry.
 
Like you surmised, a bl**dy big lever!

I think the one that tested mine only put the lever under the tyre and yoinked it up and down, which probably wouldn't show up the play.
 
did mine over the weekend its not for the faint hearted my other half took the whole sub frame off replaced all bushes and trail arm bushes the main prob on ours where the brake lines total nightmare but replace them as well deffo need a heat gun for the stubborn nuts and copper slip when replacing makes life a lot easier in the future and remember to take pics if have rear drums
 
. . . and remember to take pics if you have rear drums.
I hear you! (y)
Car manufacturers do like to make even the simplest devices way too complex in a lot of cases . . . (n)

Having had a Multi with rear Discs (and a Honda previously), and now this one with Drums, I'd much rather have the drums on any future car(s). :rolleyes:
 
ooooooo reading you're post made me think
about my multi.
they would not let me leave with mine
the arms the springs and the bushes both sides gone.
and its only a 07 plate
so it had to be done
so all that cost me £600 two yrs ago:cry:
and was done by garage.
but its a easy job for them as it was on a ramp
both wheels off.
and they said there was nothing left of the bushes.:mad:
but hey if you want a new multi mine is up 4 sale
 
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