Panda (Classic) My Sisley, Panda 4x4 - division north

kolza · Oct 8, 2015

Modified hub/strut brackets been finished today.

The holes were opened, all ready to go back now.

Both bottom ball joint rubber boots were damaged, they came from panda 4x4 parts hoard as a part of complete leg assembly so been handled number of times and thorn as a results.

ball joint itself are fine and tight so i've purchased of ebey univeral boots only, managed to re-use top and bottom spring clip from the old one

£5 for set of four isn't much, if your joint is still OK and was not exposed to element for long time, worth to have a set in stock for those bloody MOT inspections and advisories.

Here is the link to the right size, fittment was pretty easy as for rubber boot all covered in grease.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNIVERSAL-SMALL-TRACK-ROD-END-BALL-JOINT-RUBBER-DUST-BOOT-COVERS-4X/171892423275?_trksid=p3693.c100102.m2452&_trkparms=ao%3D1%26asc%3D20140212121249%26meid%3D524bf4495976492195d79bc661be698f%26pid%3D100102%26

kolza · Oct 14, 2015

Just brought them back from tyreman,

As you can expect when you're not doing work by your self that there are multiple ****e looking marks down to bare steel made by tyreman. Will touch them up.

I can't wait till i'll have my own tyre/balancing machine.

https://www.fiatforum.com/gallery/data/3856/medium/2015-10-14_17-40-54_905.jpg

155/70 tyre on 5J rim, still not that narrow as I was expecting.

BTW: if Weeler sells brand new 8 spoke rims for £70ea - it's definately fair price.

kolza · Oct 21, 2015

I must make confession!

I've promised myself thst before i'll rip-out and scrap the current 999cc engine for Sisley the engine will be roughly inspected to indicate the cause of fault. Those who've been in Italy knows how bad the engine was smoking, and used over 11 litre of oil, the pinking was huge, and underpower was observed as well.

I have to say that i have contributed to that, there is no expanation to my stupidity.
The cylinder head was skimmend and rebuild shortly prior to departure, VALVES WERE GROUNDED IN, all was assembled keeping same shims order to let them sattle down keeping in mind to recheck valve clereance after few hundred miles and conduct necessary adjustments.

Sadly, this did not happend till this weekend.

Current valve clereance ( cold engine)

ex 0.35, -0.05,
in 0.15, -0.15,
ex 0.35, -0.05,
in 0.20, -0.10,
in 0.20, -0.10,
ex 0.30, -0.10,
in 0.25, -0.05,
ex 0.45, +0.05 ???

New 2x 3.85 shims were delivered today, allother can be swapped around including set from spare 4x4 cyl head.

Compression test results ( cold engine):

10.3, 10.5, 10.2, 10.5

New shims should solve the pinking, is it going to cure the smoking? Valve oils seals were new at the rebuild.

Time will tell

AndyPanda4x4 · Oct 21, 2015

kolza said:
I must make confession!

I've promised myself thst before i'll rip-out and scrap the current 999cc engine for Sisley the engine will be roughly inspected to indicate the cause of fault. Those who've been in Italy knows how bad the engine was smoking, and used over 11 litre of oil, the pinking was huge, and underpower was observed as well.

I have to say that i have contributed to that, there is no expanation to my stupidity.
The cylinder head was skimmend and rebuild shortly prior to departure, VALVES WERE GROUNDED IN, all was assembled keeping same shims order to let them sattle down keeping in mind to recheck valve clereance after few hundred miles and conduct necessary adjustments.

Sadly, this did not happend till this weekend.

Current valve clereance ( cold engine)

ex 0.35, -0.05,
in 0.15, -0.15,
ex 0.35, -0.05,
in 0.20, -0.10,
in 0.20, -0.10,
ex 0.30, -0.10,
in 0.25, -0.05,
ex 0.45, +0.05 ???

New 2x 3.85 shims were delivered today, allother can be swapped around including set from spare 4x4 cyl head.

Compression test results ( cold engine):

10.3, 10.5, 10.2, 10.5

New shims should solve the pinking, is it going to cure the smoking? Valve oils seals were new at the rebuild.

Time will tell

Nice Jacob!

I personally think it's the rings due to the colour and amount of smoke, but the valve stem oil seals (if they were pretty much completely disintegrated) could cause the same symptoms.

Good luck in any case

kolza · Oct 21, 2015

I'll just give a go as there is nothing to loose, i could gain some time and focus on the lift kit rather then engine swap.
Pristine 999cc is ready to go if needed.

panda1408 · Oct 21, 2015

I wouldn't have thought those clearances would cause the issues you have, but I could well be wrong, will be interesting to see how it runs with them correct in any case.

Out of interest Jacob, do you have the tool for removing the shims without removing the cam? Need to adjust some of the shims on my red 4x4 so was hoping to find one to save disturbing timing belt etc.

andyholli · Oct 21, 2015

kolza said:
I'll just give a go as there is nothing to loose, i could gain some time and focus on the lift kit rather then engine swap.
Pristine 999cc is ready to go if needed.

Lots to loose - a missed learning opportunity! - It's a detective challenge with knowledge as the reward (I might have gone a bit philosophical there).
Anyway - it will be interesting to know the truth.

kolza · Oct 21, 2015

andyholli said:
Lots to loose - a missed learning opportunity! - It's a detective challenge with knowledge as the reward (I might have gone a bit philosophical there).
Anyway - it will be interesting to know the truth.

A. youre absolutely right! I do try to promote such a atitude by myself.
By "nothing to loose " i was meaning " I will try to investigate that further as the shims costed only £4,8".
Don't know why but i've still prety much confidence in that engine despite the fact that the real mileage is unknow ( snapped speedo cable since 2007 till 2014).

Freddy, I do not have the original tool, but i've got few others which after small mod hopefullly will do the trick. In my case cam removal will save some hassle is the tool will not work as planned.

Would pissing thru piston rings stilll give correct compression test results?

panda1408 · Oct 21, 2015

kolza said:
A. youre absolutely right! I do try to promote such a atitude by myself.
By "nothing to loose " i was meaning " I will try to investigate that further as the shims costed only £4,8".
Don't know why but i've still prety much confidence in that engine despite the fact that the real mileage is unknow ( snapped speedo cable since 2007 till 2014).

Freddy, I do not have the original tool, but i've got few others which after small mod hopefullly will do the trick. In my case cam removal will save some hassle is the tool will not work as planned.

Would pissing thru piston rings stilll give correct compression test results?

A quick bit of googling reveals that the correct tool may be available from Fiat, I'll call in to my local dealer next time I'm passing to see if they can get one.

Have you tried putting some oil into the bores and redoing the compression check? An increase indicates piston ring issues.

kolza · Oct 21, 2015

Wet test wasn't done this time.
According to Fiat datasheet nominal compression for single stroke is 9.8.
So my results looks bang on for test up to four strokes.
Any chance for fiat part number of that shim tool?

Bartpanda · Oct 22, 2015

My wrecked original 1.0 engine from trekking had perfect compression, was very revvy and had nice amount of power considering it was small 1.0 with 150000 miles+, but was also smoking like mig 29 on afterburners{ but with blue smoke not black

} and after my "investigation" before throwing it to the yunkyard I had found oil rings to be ok only on cylinder 2, 134 were damaged/worn out, though all compression ones were ok. ... so dont bother thinking correct shimming will do the trick

use this 1.0 untill new powerplant is ready and drop it, forget it or make your lady very happy with a new and heavy coffe table out of its block

kolza · Oct 22, 2015

Bartpanda said:
make your lady very happy with a new and heavy coffe table out of its block

My Mrs do prefer solid wood furnitures over the glass/metal ones.

But...

combination of bare engine block + mechanical stool might look good in the unit.

kolza · Oct 24, 2015

panda1408 said:
I'll call in to my local dealer next time I'm passing to see if they can get one.

Freddy, if you won't get the tool from Fiat I can lend you this one when i'm finished.

Or alternatively you could fabricate one yourself.

I've used 5/8 from some cheap Argos set which I bought long time ago.

Done well today, the 1,4,5,8 shims are tricky as the circumference falls into cyllinder head.

panda1408 · Oct 24, 2015

Thanks Jacob, I'm sure I can fashion up something if no luck at the dealer, if not I'll take you up on your offer

I did manage to swap one on my red CLX a few years ago using a screwdriver bent 90 degrees, wasn't great but did do the job. Something better required for repeated use though.

kolza · Oct 29, 2015

I really can't decide what to do with the roof rack, i.e. which version i'll go for. I've got the Berlingo type to modified, nut recently i've come up with Nissan Pathfinder roof rails and a diy basket to go between rails.

kolza · Oct 31, 2015

Some new shiny bits were fitted today, yes - the lift process has begun.

Day 1 - Rear suspension

Parts fited:
- Heavy duty shackles +20mm,
- Rear shock + 80mm,
- Assistor springs ( different to the pair i had in Italy )
- 13" rims with Fedima 155/70 F/OS tyres.

690mm mark was made just with new wheels last night. 70mm lift achieved, car hasn't beed driven outside so whet it will sattle down by few milimeters.

Brake pipe bracket was replaced on the bottom side of tank lip to gain some slack in brake pipe flexi. The eye wich was pointing down and holding the hand brake cable, currently it will have to be relocated to opposite position.

Exhaust pipe end must be modified to streigh end as it is just 5mm from the new shackle

Front struts assemblies are ready to go in tommorow.

T.B.C.

AndyPanda4x4 · Nov 1, 2015

Looking good Jacob :thumbup:

kolza · Nov 1, 2015

Not much to report, the weather was far to nice to spend all day in unit, took wife for long miles walk round Wykeham forest instead.

Front of car supported, wheels removed, gearbox oil left to drain overnight.

AndyPanda4x4 · Nov 1, 2015

kolza said:
Not much to report, the weather was far to nice to spend all day in unit, took wife for long miles walk round Wykeham forest instead.

Front of car supported, wheels removed, gearbox oil left to drain overnight.

Nice to see you have your priorities in the right order

there will be no excuse tomorrow now!!!

northernchap · Nov 2, 2015

Wheels are looking really good! Plus the lift is going to make a big difference. Panda stance FTW! :slayer:

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