stylers
Member
aye - be careful of that ould washed diesel up there around the border - nasty stuff 
General Bio Diesel
- Thread starter SamBowcock
- Start date
Currently reading:
General Bio Diesel
I've already posted this under another thread, but I'll say repeat my biodiesel story here. In a nutshell:
Be very careful!
I'd been running my 1998 Marea HLX125 TD on biodiesel since early July 2007 without any problems. I'd been obtaining my biodiesel at suppliers in Bolton and Sheffield.
It was all going fine until a cold snap hit in early November. The biodiesel I was using at the time had not been treated for cold temperatures. I started experiencing intermittent power losses in my injection system; a bit like someone putting the [COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]brakes[/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR] on. Initially, this was only happening at high motorway speeds, i.e. 70mph+.
At the time, I didn't associate it with biodiesel as a fuel leak had been found between my fuel filter and [COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]injection [/FONT][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]pump[/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR]. That was repaired, so I filled up with another tank of untreated (for cold temps) biodiesel. I did this on a cold day; it felt like -5 degrees celsius, and the biodiesel had been stored underground overnight.
Within 20 minutes of setting off, I lost power big-time. It was definitely down to the fuel, and I gradually replaced it with ordinary diesel over the next few weeks, gradually restoring the [COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]car's [/FONT][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]performance[/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR] from a low point where it had become capable of a top speed of only 40mph.
In mid December, having put my earlier problems down to using untreated biodiesel, I decided (stupidly it turns out) to completely fill my tank with biodiesel that had supposedly been cold weather treated to be okay down to -15 degrees celsius. Within 3 minutes of leaving the filling station, I lost power completely and stalled. I restarted and then limped back home at a top speed of 15 mph, stalling about 10 times on the way due to power losses. That evening, I had a nightmare when I decided to limp back over to Lancashire (I work away from home, so was not prepared to lose income over this. I decided to drive back in the small hours when the roads were quiet, as I'd undoubtedly have caused an accident if I'd done this during the day). The journey lasted over 6 hours, and involved limping through Manchester city centre at 4am at 15mph (no way was I going round on the M60 with a car that badly crippled). I ended up calling out the AA twice within a three day period. The first was to jump start me that Saturday night, after my car stalled so much initially that I flattened the battery. The second was to tow me to a garage in Lancashire a few days later, after my car proved impossible to restart.
I had my [COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]fuel [/FONT][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]filter[/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR] replaced and my injectors cleaned, and it seemed as though that had solved the problem. I resolved to run on ordinary diesel through the winter from that point on. My car was fine until a few weeks ago, when the same problems started happening again; this time on ordinary diesel. I've since had the entire [COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]fuel [/FONT][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]system[/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR] cleaned out (fuel filter re-replaced), but this only marginally helped. My car is back in a garage now, and it's looking like my injection pump is knackered.
I can't tell you for certain if it's a Bosche or Lucas pump (but I will be finding out for sure). However, according to my car's handbook, it's supposed to be a Bosche pump.
This has turned out to have been an expensive experiment. I'd done over 10,000 miles on biodiesel before I started to experience problems. I've come up with the following possibilities for what could have got wrong:
1. Impurities in the biodiesel (refined from recycled rapeseed oil from restaurants, so meat could have been cooked in it) had built up in my fuel system over time, and eventually got to a concentration where they damaged the injection pump.
2. My problems have been down to a combination of cold weather and using untreated biodiesel. This damaged the injection pump when it gelled/waxed under the cold temperatures. The only problem with that theory is that the second batch that seemed to cause me the biggest problem was supposed to have been okay down to -15.
Rectifying this problem is probably going to cost me in the region of £300 - £400. It's already cost me £190 over the last five weeks. I'm currently keeping my fingers crossed that I've not suffered any engine damage.
If my car is fine after the pump replacement, and I decide my problems have been down to Possibility 2, I may repeat a subset of the experiment and just run on biodiesel in late Spring, Summer and the early Autumn. However, until a lot more knowledge is in the public domain and fuel technology has improved, I'm never running on it in Winter again.
Be very careful!
I'd been running my 1998 Marea HLX125 TD on biodiesel since early July 2007 without any problems. I'd been obtaining my biodiesel at suppliers in Bolton and Sheffield.
It was all going fine until a cold snap hit in early November. The biodiesel I was using at the time had not been treated for cold temperatures. I started experiencing intermittent power losses in my injection system; a bit like someone putting the [COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]brakes[/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR] on. Initially, this was only happening at high motorway speeds, i.e. 70mph+.
At the time, I didn't associate it with biodiesel as a fuel leak had been found between my fuel filter and [COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]injection [/FONT][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]pump[/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR]. That was repaired, so I filled up with another tank of untreated (for cold temps) biodiesel. I did this on a cold day; it felt like -5 degrees celsius, and the biodiesel had been stored underground overnight.
Within 20 minutes of setting off, I lost power big-time. It was definitely down to the fuel, and I gradually replaced it with ordinary diesel over the next few weeks, gradually restoring the [COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]car's [/FONT][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]performance[/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR] from a low point where it had become capable of a top speed of only 40mph.
In mid December, having put my earlier problems down to using untreated biodiesel, I decided (stupidly it turns out) to completely fill my tank with biodiesel that had supposedly been cold weather treated to be okay down to -15 degrees celsius. Within 3 minutes of leaving the filling station, I lost power completely and stalled. I restarted and then limped back home at a top speed of 15 mph, stalling about 10 times on the way due to power losses. That evening, I had a nightmare when I decided to limp back over to Lancashire (I work away from home, so was not prepared to lose income over this. I decided to drive back in the small hours when the roads were quiet, as I'd undoubtedly have caused an accident if I'd done this during the day). The journey lasted over 6 hours, and involved limping through Manchester city centre at 4am at 15mph (no way was I going round on the M60 with a car that badly crippled). I ended up calling out the AA twice within a three day period. The first was to jump start me that Saturday night, after my car stalled so much initially that I flattened the battery. The second was to tow me to a garage in Lancashire a few days later, after my car proved impossible to restart.
I had my [COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]fuel [/FONT][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]filter[/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR] replaced and my injectors cleaned, and it seemed as though that had solved the problem. I resolved to run on ordinary diesel through the winter from that point on. My car was fine until a few weeks ago, when the same problems started happening again; this time on ordinary diesel. I've since had the entire [COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]fuel [/FONT][COLOR=#F77E1D ! important][FONT=verdana,geneva,lucida,"]system[/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR] cleaned out (fuel filter re-replaced), but this only marginally helped. My car is back in a garage now, and it's looking like my injection pump is knackered.
I can't tell you for certain if it's a Bosche or Lucas pump (but I will be finding out for sure). However, according to my car's handbook, it's supposed to be a Bosche pump.
This has turned out to have been an expensive experiment. I'd done over 10,000 miles on biodiesel before I started to experience problems. I've come up with the following possibilities for what could have got wrong:
1. Impurities in the biodiesel (refined from recycled rapeseed oil from restaurants, so meat could have been cooked in it) had built up in my fuel system over time, and eventually got to a concentration where they damaged the injection pump.
2. My problems have been down to a combination of cold weather and using untreated biodiesel. This damaged the injection pump when it gelled/waxed under the cold temperatures. The only problem with that theory is that the second batch that seemed to cause me the biggest problem was supposed to have been okay down to -15.
Rectifying this problem is probably going to cost me in the region of £300 - £400. It's already cost me £190 over the last five weeks. I'm currently keeping my fingers crossed that I've not suffered any engine damage.
If my car is fine after the pump replacement, and I decide my problems have been down to Possibility 2, I may repeat a subset of the experiment and just run on biodiesel in late Spring, Summer and the early Autumn. However, until a lot more knowledge is in the public domain and fuel technology has improved, I'm never running on it in Winter again.
That's very interesting. Any update? I'm thinking about getting the 2008 Bravo 1.6 Diesel and run biofuel
stylers
Member
There have been lots of problems reported with ford TDCI engines where owners have tried WVO and biodiesel without thinking about filters etc. remember that the newer types of common rail injectors have very fine orifices and run very high pressures, and are more prone to clogging sometimes even with ordinary diesel. they're bloody expensive to replace, and have to be individually coded into to the ECU for calibration. Also, newer diesels are using particulate filters which are another thing to go wrong if there is excessive soot. I wouldnt try it in a new bravo.. at least wait until its a few years old..
Owen.
Owen.
i was using bio diesel in my fiat marea 2.4 jtd 1997 after 2000 miles the filter and injectors got clogged and then i got some used cooking oil from local resturant the filter and injectors got clogged in 1 day now also the injector pump is damaged. the money i saved will now be paid to the garage. my advice is not to used more than 25% bio 75% diesel 100% bio wil land you in trouble like me.
thanks mate that i found the hard way. today found out it was palm oil which froze inside the tank. the injectors are also damaged but the bump may be ok . the injectors cost over 200 pounds+ labour charges. my email is [email protected]
Last edited:
Palm oil is a no no - it's solid at room temp.
You would do better chatting up your local pubs, restaurants and small scale friers like kebab houses.
Make sure it's NOT been used for cooking meat, and ensure you filter it thoroughly.
You will also need a spare fuel filter or two - veg/bio tends to drag up the crud from the bottom of the tank.
Trev
You would do better chatting up your local pubs, restaurants and small scale friers like kebab houses.
Make sure it's NOT been used for cooking meat, and ensure you filter it thoroughly.
You will also need a spare fuel filter or two - veg/bio tends to drag up the crud from the bottom of the tank.
Trev
can some help me. after changing the injectors and cleaning out the tank. the pump has airlock or losses pressure after i drive for about 15 miles local but does 80 mph on the motorway. some say its the pump but my mechanic says its some pipe sucking air.
my email [email protected]
my email [email protected]
