Thinking of fitting a VL36 to my Tjet and a little confused by some of the threads I have read on the subject.
I have read that it is a straight swap, also that it requires a remap.

If I was to get the full unit, would I require anything else such as sensors from an car fitted with a VL36 as standard? If not my intuition which may be wrong is that the ECU would still only allow the boost that it is programmed to allow so the VL36 would just be running at a lower capacity than the original unit but producing the same boost.

Car is currently standard except for BMC panel filter and esseesee intake pipe.


Cheers

Ben

hiya bud, im far from a mechanic so i cant answer a lot of the technicals, but i do have a vl36 on my punto t jet. from what i beleive its just the oil lines to the turbo that need upgrading, however yes the vl36 does just bolt inplace of the vl37. a remap will help or ive gone for a bluespark box which has given me better power with the vl36 through the range and boost holds better. IMO youd be better waiting and doing all the mods you want first ie catback, front mount etc before mapping if you dont want to pay to get it mapped more than once.
if i can find a td04 13t and downpipe ill have a vl36 for sale. cheers
FF boffins feel free to correct me on any of this!

Cheers Alex, the last time I played with cars rather than just fixed them out of necessity it was timing lights and carbs

So you reckon the standard ECU map and sensors on the T-Jet will allow the vl36 to produce more than the 0.8 bar the vl37 does and hold it a bit longer without running lean or throwing a fault without remapping?

Cheers

Ben

as i said mate, i cant help much with technical questions although there are a few on here who can :worship:
mine wasnt mapped and ran ok with the vl36 but a bluespark box has helped up the boost, before the box i was considering an upgraded actuator or bleed valve for the vl36 to set the pressure slightly higher. problem is without a map youll hit limp mode if youre looking for significant gain.
if youre paying for a custom map have you considered a td04 turbo upgrade instead? thats the way im heading, but have been advised by the guys on here ill need upgraded injectors etc. the world of cars eh :yum:

Hi Ben,

I have done the vl36 swap on my t-jet and I didn't have to replace a thing apart from the gaskets (Some people don't bother but, rather do it now than later on!). As said above the turbo bolts on directly without any additional work needed. Upgrading the intercooler is advised though!

You will need to get it remapped to get the most out of it. However, it can be ran on the standard map until then. I didn't remap it until a couple of months after fitting but, I did also fit the forge front mount intercooler at the same time as the turbo.

No need to upgrade the sensors as I know of people running the TD04 on standard sensors.

Hope this helps.
Regards.

DH1995 said:

You will need to get it remapped to get the most out of it.

Click to expand...

Sounds like only changing the turbo & I-C wasn't enough, did you anyway felt "something" more than subjective before remapping ?

Regards, Bernie

I don't understand what you are trying to ask Bernie? You asking if I had other mods before remapping?

Thanks DH.

Do you know if it was running lean when you took it for the map?

Think Bernie is asking if there was a quantifiable difference or if it is like more power from fitting a cone filter. Sounds better, must be faster!

Presumably you did notice some difference pre remap?

Struggling to find anyone local to custom map that is not crazy expensive or does not have a few horror stories attached.

Cheers

Ben

Thanks Ben, you replied exactly what I was planing to :-D

Regards, Bernie

I have no idea if it was running lean, I got very little info from the remap or the graph to be honest. I'd assume it was running a little lean as I also had a custom cat back exhaust and induction kit fitted before the map.

You could feel a difference from changing the turbo but, doesn't kick in until later in the rev range because it wasn't mapped in. You could feel when it did decide to kick in though! On the standard map I was running 153bhp according the dyno.

It isn't cheap to remap unless you go for a generic one from somewhere that doesn't have a rolling road. Getting a custom map is expensive but, in my opinion worth it.

Regards.

Thanks, just the kind of answer I was looking for.

Ben

You can install the vl36 directly, but you will only have some more lag without any top end added power.

Here is a graph of my the VL37 (120hp t-jet):


This was taken in 4th gear, as you can see the ecu does not begin to open the wastegate (through the boost valve /n75) until the desired pressure is achieved.
After the max pressure for that load (throttle/rpm) is achieved the ecu stats opening the wastegate, but just enough to keep the desired max boost.

You can also see that the turbo is not at the limit as the pressure is being controlled by the ECU.
The reason for the ECU lowering boost:
-longevity of turbo
-longevity of engine
-to keep the turbo in the maximum efficiency range (not to say it can't still be pushed a little more)

Now for an estimation of what the vl36 will do without a tune:


-It will start spooling later (the compressor inducer is slightly bigger =>heavier)
-but after it will reach max boost, it will follow the exact boost curve of the vl37. (the black line will be the boost curve delayed by ~100-200rpm)

Note: the VL36 might be spinning slower to reach the same boost ( so instead of 130k rpm the vl37 would need fo that boost... it will be at 120krpm)

You can also see the maximum pressure the vl37 makes on the t-jet aprox 0.9 bar ~13 psi... that is on overboost (you can see the
hump in the graph)
After overboost max pressure is 0.75bar.
At 5300rpm boost is about 0.5 bar.

Thanks Aurick, so even with the bigger compressor VL36 won't produce any more boost or power unless told to by ECU. Not the answer I was hoping for!

Thanks

Ben

You might feel it more powerful... overboost might be slightly bigger.. because of extra inertia in the compressor wheel. But overboost only takes like 1-2 seconds in initial acceleration.

Hi Ben,

Did you proceed with the VL36 turbo upgrade? Something that I'm also looking in to - just trying to ascertain the cost involved, worked required and other things to consider.

Ben D said:

Thinking of fitting a VL36 to my Tjet and a little confused by some of the threads I have read on the subject.
I have read that it is a straight swap, also that it requires a remap.

Click to expand...

Cheers,

Dan

Not yet. I've decided to go for a md527 hybrid from turbo dynamics. They can rework existing vl37 to produce 180-200 BHP for sensible money. There was a 500 abarth Euro 6 with one fitted that got good results, I'd expect about 190 BHP from a Tjet, smaller cams but the euro 4 tends to make more than the euro 6. Will cost about £600 plus a map. Unless you find a decent VL36 you'll probably want it overhauled before fitting so costs of hybridisation of existing turbo is good value.

Cheers

Ben

Thanks for the prompt response Ben - Interesting theory, I'd like to know more on this if possible!

I've been offered a VL36 which has only 9000 miles of wear - checked over by a local garage to; apparently in good condition - for just over £100 which seems very cheap IMO. That'd increase power output from 120BHP to 150BHP.

I'd likely do the following alongside with it at the same time:

• FMIC - Airtec (£300)
• Catback Exhaust System (£400)
• Remap/Dyno (£200)

Plus the £100 for the turbo and some extra money for gaskets, fitting and whatnot. Looking around the £1000 mark with a hopeful 180BHP outcome which is an additional 60BHP from standard (50% BHP increase).

Hence why I was looking for further details on how to install the VL36 and anything else I need to consider.

Seems good value for money, let me know your thoughts.

All sounds good, if the turbo is sound that's an excellent price. Hopefully Aurick will see this as he's recently put a VL36 on his 120 bravo and drove it a while without a remap.

I'll probably be fitting same intercooler before the turbo and will also put a forge actuator on new turbo. I put a cat back exhaust and decat pipe on a while back and just had a 200 cell cat fitted under the car which seems to have made a fair difference to under bonnet temperature. Intake temp is always lower now and recovers much quicker after idling or hitting traffic. Noticed a drop in low down torque after the exhaust was fitted so with the lower temps after moving cat I'm still debating whether or not the intercooler is required or whether it may just contribute to lay low down.

Turbo change shouldn't be too difficult to do yourself, I'll change oil, filter and coolant at the same time.

I'm going to do mine ok no December after MOT once I know emissions and cat are all ok.

Cheers

Ben

In reality you only need the vl36 turbo and a tune for the 180+ hp.
Mine got 194, but i also have a catless downpipe.
My predictions on the previous page were pretty close.
With no tune it gained some extra power ..even tho on the same boost pressure, the vl36 could flow more air.. so it got about 150 hp without a tune (not sure what stock would measure.. but i would think close to 125hp).
After the tune it got 194ps at 6300rpm.

100£ for a vl36 is really good. totally worth it ...even if you need to replace the CHRA (you can find good quality ones on ebay for about 150-180 euro). The hot side of the turbo housing tends t crack, so it's good to have an extra(also the vl37 hot side housing is interchangeable)

I've got an 150 euro ebay CHRA on mine (with original VL36 compressor housing and VL37 exhaust/hot side housing) , it's going strong after ~10k km.


Think about an LSD before exhaust or FMIC, i've put on the winter tires.. and i can barely put any power down.

Morning Ben & Aurick,

I hope it is; apparently it's been checked over by a garage and is in working order. Externally, it looks okay - hopefully you'll both be able to give me your thoughts below:



Ideally I'd like to do the turbo myself, oil & filter change shouldn't be an issue - I've not done a coolant flush but I'm sure it'll be straight forward enough. In what order would you do these steps?

As for the FMIC and exhaust systems are something I've considered, but if they aren't necessary for the remap - I'll hold fire for now.

Aurick, that's a great result you're running on the VL36.
I could always compare/swap the hotside from the VL37 if required?
Apart from the Turbo (oil filter, oil and coolant change) including new gaskets and a remap once done. Do I need to consider anything else?