Hi - i have a problem with my Brava 1.6 R reg 1997 - couple of weeks back the engine light started coming on which meant the engine just cutting out most of the time which was usually at junctions/lights etc if travelling along the light would come on a cause a very very slight jolt - took it to local garage who we usually use and his test showed a different reading each time first injectors, next day the key then the Cat - he advised we take it to the Fiat dealership as they will pinpoint exactly the fault - took it today had diags done and they tell me it was the RPM sensor - they cleared the error and said if it re-occurs they will fit another RPM sensor for 125.00 - question is are these readings from the dealerships reliable? I left the garage got a couple of miles down the prom and it started cutting on again and cut out couple of times - i can see one getting fitted and it turning out to be something else - cheers

rpm sensor is commonly the cause of this. fiat's diagnostic machine (examiner smart) is by far the most accurate machine for your car. the universal machines used at independant garages are pretty useless on all cars. they've lied to me far more times than they've been correct.

Thanks for taking time to reply - im having a new rpm sensor fitted so hopefully that will sort it out and keep her indoors happy - thnks

rojodiablo said:

Thanks for taking time to reply - im having a new rpm sensor fitted so hopefully that will sort it out and keep her indoors happy - thnks

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keeping her indoors happy will take a lot more than an rpm sensor, trust me

Correct - i'll re-phrase it - it will lessen the nagging from her indoors

Hi - had the RPM sensor replaced - problem still there - light comes on and cuts out now and then usually at junction/roundabout not only is this a pain in the butt it can be dangerous if there is a vehicle right up your behind - the FIAT diagnostics only showed this but obviously that isnt the problem so its back to the FIAT machine on Wednesday - see what error it throws up this time - where does it all end

Its a Fiat hun, it doesn't end....ever

as its a mk1 1.6 you really should test the injectors. diagnostic tests dont spot injector faults, even if the dealer performs the diagnostic they will easily miss it. its so common on this model that it should always be the first thing you test for.

at the right hand side of the fuel rail there is a connector for the injector wiring harness. disconnect it and you will see 5 pins. the centre pin is a shared earth for all 4 injectors, each of the other pins goes to a single injector. measure the resistance of all 4 injectors using a multimeter on these pins. each injector should have 14-16ohms in an ideal world. anything over 10ohms will not cause a noticable problem. if you find one or more is less than 10 ohms you must change it. a scrapyard injector will be fine, but make sure you test its resistance before buying. i suggest you buy spare injectors while you're there because this happens regularly on the 1.6. once you've done it a few times its only a half hour job to change an injector.

if you need any further info do a search for posts by me, using "injector" and "multimeter". that should bring up the numerous other posts i've written in the past, including detailed instructions for replacing an injector.

Thanks very much for taking time to reply and your advice - interestingly enough our local independent garage actually said their machinery was coming up with injectors firstly then key thats why he said go to FIAT cos they couldnt pinpoint exactly what it was - we are going abck to FIAT in the morning and they are going to put it on the diag again (free this time) and we'll see what it brings up - i'll be honest me and fixing cars dont go together but i will look at your other posts and read about changing injector - i'll get myself a multimeter first - thanks again.

if it is injector failure fiat wont spot it. they never do. you'd think it would be on their list of things to suspect on a 1.6
fiat wont do anything to the car during a diagnostic that doesnt involve the examiner machine, and the examiner doesnt seem to be able to identify injector failure.

i bought my first bravo very very cheaply because the owner had given up trying to fix it, after spending several hundred pounds their fiat dealer and a fiat specialist couldnt fix it, so i bought it and fixed it for £5 with an injector from a scrapyard.

Hiya Jug - well went back to Fiat - now they say electronic key code error detected on control unit - he explained in laymans terms kind of about "the brains" of it basically a new ECU plus other odds and sods - the crunch - new ECU 577.96 and 45.83 to fit it - add to that the diag charge from last week and RPM sensor fitted and it would cost me what we paid for car!!! What are the consequences of just "living with it" just carry on driving it around and firing it back up when light comes on and it cuts out?? Spending that much on it is a no-no, cheers for advice

fiat are wrong and they know it. they're blatantly telling lies. problems with the key codes will not illuminate the engine management light, and they would definately illuminate the orange key code light. since you dont have a key code light illuminated its almost impossible for the problem to be key codes (unless your key code light has been removed by a previous owner to hide the fault and the engince light is coming on as the immob stalls the engine).

there's a few things we can try just in case the problem is an intermittent key code issue. first you should remove the fusebox cover, and on the back of the fusebox you need to check that the key code unit is securely fitted. if it is loose it could cause intermittent key code problems. the key code unit is a black plastic box on the back of the fusebox where all the relays are.

next you should try reporgramming the blue key codes into the immobiliser. if you have the red key and 2 blue keys you can do this easily in 2 minutes.

insert the red key into the ignition and switch ignition on.
the key code light will come on for a couple of second and then go out.
now reomve the red key.
quickly insert the first blue key and switch ignition on. you only have a few seconds to do this after removing the previous key.
the key code light will come on for a couple of second and then go out.
now remove the first blue key.
quickly insert the second blue key and switch ignition on. you only have a few seconds to do this after removing the previous key.
now remove the second blue key.
quickly insert the red key again and switch ignition on. you only have a few seconds to do this after removing the previous key.
now reomve the red key.

this programs the blue keys into the immob. you need at least 2 blue keys with unique codes for this to work. if you have one key, or 2 copis of the same key, it wont work. if you dont have a red key you can never do this.

personally i would say i can be 100% sure the problem has nothing to do with key codes if your key code light works as normal and does not illuminate when the car cuts out. i can also be 100% sure any fiat dealer employee would know that. so they either told lies on purpose or the person you spoke to is less intelligent than the average farm animal. i guess either possiblity is equally likely. i suspect both is the reality.

Thanks for you swift reply jug you are very helpful - even tho i dont know much about this subject i do agree his explanation was a bit "salesman pitch" like and i got the feeling he was just spieling - they just just plug it in, look at what the readout displays and thats it it must be true i dont think they have the knowledge - having read what i have on here i very much dont believe them - firstly jug, the key code light does NOT illuminate so you'll be right on that one, secondly and probably most significantly we dont have the red master key so cant go down the reprogram route - i will however check out the fuse box as you suggest then maybe try and go down the injector route if i can get hold of any from a scrap yard or internet - either way it is driving us (well the wife) potty - thanks very much again -

another thought, sudden cutting out for no apparent reason like this is also often due to the crankshaft position sensor (CPS) or lambda sensor.

you can test both with a multimeter too.

lets try the lambda first. the connector is under the plastic cover at the back of the engine bay in roughly the centre, maybe a bit to the left of centre when looking in the engine bay. there are 2 knobs you need to loosen to get the cover off. behind it you will see some connectors, you need to disconnect the one that has a white wire (actually a few wires in a white sheath) coming out of it. disconnect this then hold the side with the white sheath over the wires. there should be 4 pins, 2 are for the heater element and 2 for the probe. the heater element should have a resistance of 4.3-4.7 ohms, test this using the C and D pins (as shown in pic below). the probe should have a resistance of 5000ohms max. test this using pins A and B (as shown in pic).



for testing the CPS you need to disconnect the massive connector on your ecu. then use pins 30 and 49 on the connector to test the resistance of the CPS using a multimeter. it must measure 575-750ohms at 20degreesC.

these are the type of test you can do when you need to manually find faults. using a diagnostic machine is all well and good, but when it doesnt work (happens often) you need to get back to old fashioned fault finding techniques. labour cost a lot these days, and skilled poeple are hard to find, so dealers and garages arent the best places to get this type of work done. DIY is the only way you'll fix this car without spending a fortune.

Check you fuel pump mate, i was haveing the same issue, changed the fuel pump and that sorted it. but i replaced the whole fule system to stay on the safe side.

Rampage94 said:

Check you fuel pump mate, i was haveing the same issue, changed the fuel pump and that sorted it. but i replaced the whole fule system to stay on the safe side.

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Think there is a old service news on this,there was a problem with fuel delivery from the pump.