Hello dear forum members!

I have a problem with my FIAT Marea 1.9TD 100 (1910) vehicle, as it won't start. All clues lead to failure at preheating. I tried to measure the system with a multimeter.

As it is virtually impossible to disconnect a heater plug :bang: to measure resistance on it, I started with measuring voltage between car earth and the heater plug during ignition (when the control lights up on the dashboard) to check the preheating control unit relay.

As I measured zero voltage, it would seem that the control relay is faulty. I wanted to have a closer look at that device. After hours of looking for it, I still haven't found it

I checked the manual, but it only gives a broad hint. Could someone help me find it?

Attached is photo and manual page.

SzilardMarea said:

Hello dear forum members!

I have a problem with my FIAT Marea 1.9TD 100 (1910) vehicle, as it won't start. All clues lead to failure at preheating. I tried to measure the system with a multimeter.

As it is virtually impossible to disconnect a heater plug :bang: to measure resistance on it, I started with measuring voltage between car earth and the heater plug during ignition (when the control lights up on the dashboard) to check the preheating control unit relay.

As I measured zero voltage, it would seem that the control relay is faulty. I wanted to have a closer look at that device. After hours of looking for it, I still haven't found it

I checked the manual, but it only gives a broad hint. Could someone help me find it?

Attached is photo and manual page.

Click to expand...

not sure,
are we talking DIESEL FUEL Heater/ or glow plug control..??

Gazole ou Bougie de Chauffage..??

Charlie

Do you have the right manual page?

I didn't know the TD had airflow meter, I thought only JTD had it.

As far as I understand I'm looking for the glow plug control. Different manuals have different names for this equipment.

Heater plug contrul unit, glow plug contol, pre-postheating relay, glow plug relay etc. The stuff that heast up the glow plugs for starting the engine.

It should be the right page. It's from a bundle I found on this side. There are two files, one for 96-98 (it should be TD, I linked it from that one) and one for 98-99 (That's when JTD was introduced as far as i know). My Marea is '98 TD, and it is by far the most accurate drawing I came across.

But I checked all the available schematics, because the placement of this unit differs wildly between types. So, just to be sure, I checked every position given in any schematic and still couln't find it.

SzilardMarea said:

As far as I understand I'm looking for the glow plug control. Different manuals have different names for this equipment.

Heater plug contrul unit, glow plug contol, pre-postheating relay, glow plug relay etc. The stuff that heast up the glow plugs for starting the engine.

Click to expand...

Lindsay Porter manual suggests it MAY be under the battery tray / shelf

2 x types / models,
1 is a plug-in "relay"( like indicator . headlight etc)

other is a dedicated unit,

Charlie

please post PICS as to what you find under there..,

thanks,
Charlie

It's already dark there, sorry for the lame pics. I try to continue in daylight with perhaps removing the battery and that big pipe next to it to get a better view.

I noticed a little something under the EGR valve, but I could't get a better view. Kinda visible in the 2nd pic. It's incredibly crodwded under the hood.

Under the battery seems to be nothing, but I need to remove the battery to be sure.



PS There is a red wire on pics 3 and 5 which seems to have been cut for years. Wonder what it does

As I said, I think you are looking at JTD manual.
201 in this picture, near battery negative

I'd strongly recommend checking the fuelfilter incase you got water in fuel. Old mechanical injection systems rarely die unless the fuel is bad.

For glowplugs, check the 60A (in 3) main fuse, and 152 in the picture as it is the fuelpump control box fuse (controls glowplug controller).

Thanks for the tip! And for pointing out I had the wrong manual

I've already checked the 60A fuse, it's intact. I'm going to look for 152 and 201. 152 should be under the hood? I cannot pinpoint it on my photos. 201 could be under the battery, gonna check it today.

Fuel filter should be ok. As I try to start the engine gasoil fog comes from the exhaust just fine. Problem is it wont't ignite inside the engine.

BTW it has a electro-mechanical Delphi-Lucas injection piece of sh*t system which no injector expert even dared to try to fix. For almost as long as I had the car (cca 6 years) it was running with the electrical injection control cable disconnected because connecting it only made things worse.

Anyway, the starter motor runs smoothly but not even a single explosion can be heard. And there's no voltage between glow plug and earth during ignition, which is controlled by the relay as far as i understand. I can hear some buzzing relay-ish sound when I turn the key and the icon on the dashboard lights up, but no voltage whatsoever can be measured. 152 controls 201?

edit, woops, i took too long to write my post and you answered my question before i asked it

you need to take out the battery, the control unit a 5cm box which is bolted on to the rear of the battery tray.

like neveth said, i would be looking into a fuel supply issue first, is your exhaust puffing smoke while turning over? are there any warning lights on the dash? does the key code light go out, and the glow plug light operate normally?

the td will start (eventually, and with a lot of smoke) without glowplugs unless the temperature is really too cold
@neveth the air flow meter is under the battery tray, the plug can be accessed by passing your hand left through the hole in the battery tray.

and if you use a small squirt of start pilot, does the engine start and run normally afterwards?
the fast clicking/buzzing sound which lasts for about 5 seconds after switching the ingnition on, is the timing advance solenoid on the lucas pump.

i tell a lie, perhaps you do not need to take the battery out after all, the control unit looks like can be unbolted from behind by putting your hand down by the brake fluid reservoir, just see if you can stop the nut falling down the other side.

(air flow meter and plug visible on bottom left hand side Neveth)

franglais said:

is your exhaust puffing smoke while turning over? are there any warning lights on the dash? does the key code light go out, and the glow plug light operate normally?

the td will start (eventually, and with a lot of smoke) without glowplugs unless the temperature is really too cold
@neveth the air flow meter is under the battery tray, the plug can be accessed by passing your hand left through the hole in the battery tray.

Click to expand...

OP says it does puff smoke.. but doesn't appear to heat/combust.

I would try "cycling " the glow plugs,
turn ignition on and off several times..NOT cranking,
then after 4 or 5 glowplug heating cycles.. then crank engine,

should at least "chuff" through 1 or 2 cylinders..,

in my experience of FIAT diesels,
the glow plugs always work when removed and tested,
it's lousy connections that stop them "glowing":bang:

Charlie

Tried that already, no change whatsoever. I see why it would work with faulty glow plugs, so I gave it a dozen or so tries. Anyway, I disassembled stuff, going to post pics soon.

Dismatled the battery. Under the tray, I found anoter tray (pic 1), slightly corroded. After an hour of tedious work the corroded tray came out. Underneath I found the little bugger (pic 2).

The com link is still looking good, but the others have a slight corrosion problem (pic 3). Two of them were connected steadily under the layer of rust, but the third one is missing. I don't know if it's on purpose or there should be a wire.

An interesting note, is that the red wire (seen on last pic) from the previous post would fit to that bolt like a glove.

Next course of action will be to find a connection schematic for the box, and/or to measure if the red wire leads to somewhere important (glow plugs, battery etc).

Thanks for the instructions to find it :worship:

here, this might help. page 9 of the TD75 service manual, td100 is missing, or perhaps considered so similar it doesn't matter.

soak those bolt-up connections, remove and scrub clean,
Charlie

Problem solved! Missing connection is Battery Positive according to TD100 schematic. No wonder it wouldn't start.

I'l get a new connection for the red wire and clean the rest of them. Let's hope that was all and it will start after fixing it.

hmmm :chin: must get me a copy of that TD100 manual.......