Hi well ive had my bravo for about 6 months or so and it was supplied with a red key and 1 blue key.

the blue key wont fit either door but the red key does and the blue key wont start the car but it will turn the ignition on, so i think i need to reprogram the blue key but to do this i need 2 blue keys dont I? so i was wondering do i get the red key copied and borrow my friends blue punto key and put the punto code on the copy to make a new blue key
or do i get my blue key copied and put my friends code on that one? (do i need to use my friends code or can i do a straight clone of my blue one?)

Anyway heres the real problem - the otherday for no apparent reason i was driving on the motorway and suddenly the car lost power in gear 4-5 normally its quite nippy for a 1.2 but it was really weak, my foot was to the floor and the car was strugglng to get from 45-60 normally this is easy!

The engine is also noisy, cliking when i turn the engine off and it also sounds as if air is being sucked or blown when i rev it with the bonnet open, its also drinking petrol like mad!

Ive had a friend look at it and he says the engine looks in good working order, the only thing he noticed was the Throttle body was making the ticking noise so im led to belive its that causeing my probs! but he also suggested the exhaust is blowing and he said it could be the timing belt but he couldnt check as he said he needed a special tool for it??

Also today i was driving and the clutch went really stiff and sticky, i pumped it a few times and it returned to normal :bang: please can anyone help! really need the car for uni!

so far we think its either:
1) ECU so i need a new blue key
2) Throttle body
3) Timing belt(??)

does anyone know if these problems would cause these symptoms??

so could this be down to the fact that ive been starting it with the red key all this time?

No the red key is the master key, which copies are made from, it wont cause problems with your throttle body or timing belt.
And when does the throttle body make the ticking noise? at idle? when being revved? you need to be a little more specific

Thanks for the reply mate,

Na I know that the key wont cause problems with the other parts, im asking would using the key, damage the ECU and make the car run badly? i.e. low power bad fuel efficency etc

Or is it unlikely that using the red key could cause these problems?
Basically i want to know if should i get a new blue key cut first, or change the throttle body or pay fiat to check the timing belt, whats it most likely to be?

also the throttle body is noisy when revved and also when the ignition is on NOT the engine and you turn the ignition off you can hear a clicking sound like a fan hitting somthing as it slows down, comming from the throttle, this sound happens 3 times :bang:

thanks again for your reply

kaosNW said:

i think i need to reprogram the blue key but to do this i need 2 blue keys dont I? so i was wondering do i get the red key copied and borrow my friends blue punto key and put the punto code on the copy to make a new blue key
or do i get my blue key copied and put my friends code on that one? (do i need to use my friends code or can i do a straight clone of my blue one?)

Click to expand...

yes, the punto code will give you a new blue key. use your red key to get it cut. also use the existing blue key's code to make a new blue key, but again use the red key ot have it cut so that fits the door locks.

next job is removing your ignition barrel and grinding the tumblers down to fit your red key (put red key in barrel, then grind off all protruding tumblers so they are flush with barrel). then refit the modifed ignition swithc barrel. now your red key and both the blue keys will open all the doors and start the engine. good as new.

kaosNW said:

Anyway heres the real problem - the otherday for no apparent reason i was driving on the motorway and suddenly the car lost power in gear 4-5 normally its quite nippy for a 1.2 but it was really weak, my foot was to the floor and the car was strugglng to get from 45-60 normally this is easy!

The engine is also noisy, cliking when i turn the engine off and it also sounds as if air is being sucked or blown when i rev it with the bonnet open, its also drinking petrol like mad

Ive had a friend look at it and he says the engine looks in good working order, the only thing he noticed was the Throttle body was making the ticking noise so im led to belive its that causeing my probs! but he also suggested the exhaust is blowing and he said it could be the timing belt but he couldnt check as he said he needed a special tool for it??

Click to expand...

is it only powerloss? or also a misfire? does it still rev as highly as before?

kaosNW said:

Also today i was driving and the clutch went really stiff and sticky, i pumped it a few times and it returned to normal

Click to expand...

check brake fluid level, if its dropped check on top of gearbox for a wet patch. a slave cylinder leak is common, but easily fixed.

kaosNW said:

:bang: please can anyone help! really need the car for uni!

so far we think its either:
1) ECU so i need a new blue key
2) Throttle body
3) Timing belt(??)

does anyone know if these problems would cause these symptoms??

so could this be down to the fact that ive been starting it with the red key all this time?

Click to expand...

1. you dont need an ecu
2. TB problems are very common on the 1.2. try replacing it.
3. dont assume your timing belt is a problem. it needs replacing every 70k, so do it if it needs it. if the timing belt has slipped it could explain your power loss. so would a head gaskt leak, also common on the 1.2 another option is the HT leads causing a misfire, again common on the 1.2. i'd check for all these things.

jug said:

yes, the punto code will give you a new blue key. use your red key to get it cut. also use the existing blue key's code to make a new blue key, but again use the red key ot have it cut so that fits the door locks.

next job is removing your ignition barrel and grinding the tumblers down to fit your red key (put red key in barrel, then grind off all protruding tumblers so they are flush with barrel). then refit the modifed ignition swithc barrel. now your red key and both the blue keys will open all the doors and start the engine. good as new.



is it only powerloss? or also a misfire? does it still rev as highly as before?


check brake fluid level, if its dropped check on top of gearbox for a wet patch. a slave cylinder leak is common, but easily fixed.




1. you dont need an ecu
2. TB problems are very common on the 1.2. try replacing it.
3. dont assume your timing belt is a problem. it needs replacing every 70k, so do it if it needs it. if the timing belt has slipped it could explain your power loss. so would a head gaskt leak, also common on the 1.2 another option is the HT leads causing a misfire, again common on the 1.2. i'd check for all these things.

Click to expand...

Thanks for all that mate!

Its powerloss and missfiring aswell! and it seems to be revving just as it used to, its weird how the clutch started sticking and being stiff around the same time as the missfire/powerloss, but the clutch has done this before and stopped after being pumped!

also ive been told its most likely the throttle body or timing belt slipped, but my mate said you need a special fiat tool to check the t belt, is there any way around this?

kaosNW said:

ive been told its most likely the throttle body or timing belt slipped, but my mate said you need a special fiat tool to check the t belt, is there any way around this?

Click to expand...

both are good suggestions.

you do need special tools to reset the timing, but you dont need special tools to do a compression test to see if the timing is actually the problem. a compression test will tell you if the belt has slipped. it would show as lower pressure than expected on all cylinders.

Is it the TPS that is clicking?
When I first bought my 1.2 it did this, run flat, use loads of juice then when at idle it clicks loudly, then out of the blue it is ok for a while, when it was ticking the revs where high around 2k, so I use to tap the TPS with the handle of a screwdriver, clicking stopped revs dropped, eventually I took it off, opened it up carefully as the clips will break and cleaned out the grease from inside it which was all hard, give it a squirt of silicone grease and it was ok after that no clicking at all.
Mine has just had a stage of running flat, starts fine, ticks over fine yet any type of presure on the engine, overtaking, pulling out of a junction it lost power, jerked in the end I only had about quater to half throttle before the jerking bit came in and power went, changed TPS, no change, changed HT leads, no change, checked plugs ok, changed coil, BINGO sorted thanks to Jug, perhaps you should look at thread "jerky turkey" see if any symptoms match mine.
As for the clutch, again done it! does it crunch going into reverse are the gears quite hard to get especially going down the box, clutch is noisey when the car ticks over but goes silent when the clutch is pedal is pressed, if so, then there is a distinct possiblity your release bearing is chewing its way through your presure plate, (common fault), if it is hard to get into gear and crunches but makes no noise, then try the clutch slave cylinder just under the battery, give the little rubber boot a squeeze or press in back towards the cylinder to see if any fluid comes out, mine looked great for weeks then I pressed it and saw all the fluid in the boot, seems the seal around the rod was so good, the brake fluid just leaked out of the cylinder and stayed in the rubber boot, so a visual inspection gave the impresion it was good.
Just a few ideas based on my car.

well i ran a compression test, all normal so i doubt its the Timing belt
Its drinking fuel like mad and also slighlty backfiring now!
we found a air leak behind the throttle body and sealed it up but that hasnt really helped so we think its most proberly the throttle body, or TPS

So tomorrow im going to try and get a TPS or throttle body from my local scrap yard! anyone no how much i should be looking to pay for the TPS? or body? also can anyone reccomend anywherer in north west london for parts?

We think if its not the throttle body/TPS (which is making a noise even when ignition is turned on and off again(without engine being turned over)) it could be the HT leads which i will have to change if the tps doesnt fix it!

Well i got a throttle position switch today, fitted it and it sounded a little better but its still missfireing and backfiring a little when i put my foot down!! like its ok taking off, as soon as i go into gear 2 to speed up and put my foot down it starts missfiring and juddering! seems to be getting worse

Today we were running diagnostics on it and it normally says u1600 - (because its started with red key) but it also said there was another problem with injector 1!!!

so tomorrow in the light we are going to clean injector 1 and all leads, see if that works, if not ill have to buy a new injector and see if that fixes it, does it sound like an injector problem? the diagnostics have never said that before and we ran it again and it didnt say it again so we think its on its way out working a bit but causing missfires. Is this likely?

the injector fault code often happens when an HT lead is the actual problem.

the 1.2 injectors are very reliable (i've never heard of a failure)