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Old 04-07-2017   #31
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Re: Fuel Smell

From what I remember seeing when I was working in that area, and from the odd photo of the vents I can see on the web it looks like maybe you can just prise out the seals from the top of the tank perhaps with a screwdriver blade or something (no sparks !) and then push the new ones down into place, presumably having fitted them around the vents first. Perhaps using some grease or something to get them into place without damaging them. That would be my best guess anyway...
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Old 04-07-2017   #32
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Re: Fuel Smell

Thanks for the comments Criibus, I wil be having a go at this during down time in the winter as I am enjoying the car in the summer too much to take the seats out and back panel. I just restrict mmy fuel tank to half full and no big smell.
So any advice before I satrt is welcome. I will certainly use an old wood spatula or aluminium blade to prize out the seals.
Thanks
SteveD
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Old 24-07-2017   #33
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Re: Fuel Smell

Hi, I announced some time ago that I had cured my fuel smell, last week it returned. I think because I had filled to the max with fuel. Had really bad smell both in the boot & the cabin, really strong.
So I decided to take the advice of the above post from Cribus and isolate the separator and the carbon filer. However once I started to remove the back panel, I decided to remove the the separator altogether, used fuel pipe and T piece to join the two valves on the tank, and exited the pipe through the same hole as the blue fuel pipe would have gone to the carbon filter.
Moving to the front of the car, I also removed the carbon filter. However I retained the solenoid, this has two pipes one from the canister(this I removed replacing it with the pipe that comes from the separator) the other pipe goes to the inlet manifold.
The blue plastic pipe that came of the separator and exited under the rear of the car, has a connector I removed this and fixed it to my new pipe from the vents, then connected this to the pipe that went to the front carbon filter (now connected to the Solenoid). Unsure if this connection is the right thing to do, but my thought is that any fumes will perhaps be redirected to the engine, rather than just exiting under the car.
All would seem to be working OK. Removing the carbon filter and separator I could see no evidence of leaks or splits in the pipe work. Just hope my efforts were worth the time.
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Old 24-07-2017   #34
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Re: Fuel Smell

Hi Dave, Yes that sounds like it makes sense. You got the segregator out which is more than I managed, I couldn't see what held it in place ?


My only thought is what if the solenoid isn't doing what it's supposed to do and manage the release of vapour into the intake ? That's what made me suspicious of the canister set-up and decide to just jettison that as well as the segregator.


Hopefully your arrangement will be the solution but if you still get the smell, maybe try running the vapour to the rear underside just to see if it helps ? Oh and I kept releasing the fuel cap now and then in the early days to make sure there was no pressure building up in the tank (there never was).


Touch wood I've still had no fuel smell even when filling right up. Been a good long while since I did the work.
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Old 25-07-2017   #35
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Re: Fuel Smell

Hi Cribus,
That is an interesting point regarding checking for pressure in your tank. I did and still get a hissing sound as I undo my petrol tank, always assumed this was normal, as others have commented on this. So should we have no pressure in the tank?
I can quite easily disconnect the vent pipe, so that it just vents to the rear of the car. Undoing the pipe from the inlet chamber is also easy by replacing the pipe with a blanking plug. This I may do just to see if I still get pressure in the tank.

Regarding removal of the separator unit, it is held in place with two nuts that hold it in place. The location of the bolts is behind the black side trim panel that wraps around the hood compartment, undo those nuts and extract the unit from where the fuel tank is located
Dave M
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Old 25-07-2017   #36
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Re: Fuel Smell

Hi Dave


I think some amount of pressure must be normal - whenever I release the cap on other cars there's usually a hiss so I take it that's okay. I can't remember whether there was any hissing with mine before I did the work. Thinking about it, I wouldn't expect mine to hiss now as the vapour pipe just exits to atmosphere with no obstruction from the canister/solenoid up front so I don't see how pressure could build in the tank. Your set-up probably should still give some hiss as the vapour's being fed into the intake via the solenoid which only releases the vapour every now and again (as far as I remember reading). So some hiss should be fine as long as the solenoid is doing its thing and pressure doesn't build too much ?


Next time I have the bulkhead out I'll look at removing the segregator as there's no chance I'll be re-connecting it, thanks for the info on that.
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Old 25-07-2017   #37
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Re: Fuel Smell

Hi, I have been following this work with interest and there is a school of thought on various other sites that the source of the smell is from the seals surrounding the 2 vents which exit to the segregator. These seals are circa 30Euro each. If changing these seals fixes the problem then it negates removing/isolating the segregater and or the carbon filter. It has also been suggested elsewhere that soaking the vent seals with oil helps to reseal them. Now I just throw this in to the mix to see if anyone out there has anything to add.
This winter I will be looking at changing the seals as a starting point then if this fails to stop the fuel smell when my fuel tank is over half full I will progress to isolating the segregater/carbon filter items.
Presumeably if the seals are leaking, by isolating the segregater and carbon filter this would not cure the smell as the seals precede the other items.
Phew got that off me chest.
Taking out the segregater and carbon filter certainly simplifies the system and reduces the areas of possible weakness and many thanks for sharing the different approaches and solutions everyone. Keep them coming.
Regards
SteveD
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Old 25-07-2017   #38
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Re: Fuel Smell

Hi Steve, A few winters ago I had my tank out completely, mainly because of this constant smell. I had the tank with about a gallon of fuel in shaking it and tipping it over to see if I could see any evidence of it leaking either from the pump or the seals. I saw nothing I did consider removing the vents and in fact I did make some attempt to remove them, but boy were they hard to move. As they were proving difficult to remove I tried the dealership to see if I could buy replacement, unfortunately Fiat no longer supply those parts. I understand now they are available via a 3rd party.
I did apply some gasket sealant and applied it onto the rubber vent seals, but this was only to satisfy myself that they were sealed.
When I refitted the tank I replaced all the metal clamps with jubilee clips, come spring I was pleased to say my fuel smell had gone, untill last week when I filled my tank almost to the limit, and then the smell returned, so this time I have adopted Cribus's fix. Not so sure yet regards my connecting to the solenoid, jury is out on that at this time.

Regards Dave M
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Old 25-07-2017   #39
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Re: Fuel Smell

Dave M thanks for the additional info, I may find it impossible to remove the seals with the tank in place and resort to sealing around them as you did. The last time I accessed the tank I checked the connections but I did not check the fuel pump at the top so I will be looking there aswell. Thanks again for adding to the thread.
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Old 25-07-2017   #40
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Re: Fuel Smell

Steve you can access the fuel pump via the aperture inside the hood compartment, but you have to remove the plastic matting first.
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Old 26-07-2017   #41
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Re: Fuel Smell

Yes I read old threads about the seals around the vents and fuel pump, some people reported visible signs of fuel in those areas but on mine they were completely dry, still looked perfect and were still tightly in place. Plus with the intermittent nature of the smell, I just couldn't see them being the issue (I smeared sealant around them anyway, just in case but it made no difference). Hence I went on to try the segregator/canister steps, and it was bypassing/isolating the segregator which fixed the problem completely. But different cars may have different causes of course.
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Old 26-07-2017   #42
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Re: Fuel Smell

Has anybody considered the old fashioned method of having a small vent hole in the filler cap? Old cars always had one to stop pressure build-up and prevent a vacuum forming (causing fuel starvation). I think if I had this problem I would be tempted to drill a 1mm hole in the filler cap to vent the tank. I don't think it would be large enough to allow petrol smell and must be a lot easier than rerouting and bypassing pipes etc.
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Old 27-07-2017   #43
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Re: Fuel Smell

Fair point Dave,
I have always thought that the Barchetta's tank had to have pressure inside it, for what reason I am unsure. And I would think that perhaps your suggestion may well rid our cars with the petrol smell. The reason I removed the separator and carbon filter is because I felt they were responsible for the smell, although once removed I could see no reason why they were the culprits.
I filled up my tank yesterday and I have no smell of petrol as yet, so hopefully I am rid of the smell. Still unsure of my option of connecting up to the solenoid, car does seem to run OK although it has had a few strange instance's on tickover when at junctions etc.But this could be me being paranoid regarding my fix.
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Old 27-07-2017   #44
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Re: Fuel Smell

Hate to say it but I tried that as well. I bought my hardtop from a guy down in Felixstowe and he kindly also sent me a different fuel cap after I mentioned the smell issue to him. The different cap didn't improve the situation so I tried making a small hole in it, but the smell in the cabin and boot remained the same. I suppose even with the vented cap vapour still passes into the segregator and for reasons unknown wasn't being held in it. And I have a feeling most caps have some kind of venting system built into them anyway but I could be wrong on that (as with most else). Oh and I also tried smearing sealant around the fuel pump hose fittings on top of the tank, in case that was the problem area, but again made no difference. And obviously I also tried tightening all the various tank clips and fastenings but all were fine. And I replaced the fuel hose clips at the fuel rail, all the obvious stuff really. Altering the charcoal canister and segregator set-ups really was done as a last resort.
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Old 27-07-2017   #45
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Re: Fuel Smell

DaveM, thanks, yes I am waiting for winter before I attack the problem and will take theseats out, back plate and the plastic cover to access all around the tank. I will re-read thisthread and systematically try all suggestions. I don't fancy removing the tank and if simply re-direclting the outlet from both bents to the rear is a workable safe solution I will probably go that way.
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