Hi, My name is Dago and I bought a Bianco Gelato 500x about a month ago. I'm really liking the car and started upgrading some of the interior bulbs to LED, but i have not been able to get a LED bulbs for my DRL!! Has anyone had any luck getting the DRLs upgraded to LED?

thanks!



D

It's been discussed a couple of times here already.
If you search for DRL, that will show the relevant posts. [emoji106]

Thanks Pedrolami. I did check other posts but i couldn't find the information i was looking for. The only LED bulbs i found are being sold at amazon in UK and they don't ship them to the US where I live


regards,


Dago

I've found what i needed. For those of you that live in the US, search for DM ASTAR 960 Lumens Super Bright 5730 Chipsets 7507 1156PY BAU15S LED Bulbs with Projector,Xenon White on Amazon.

I changed mine the other day you need P21W led lights and they'll pop up on eBay

Thanks Petarfiat500x!

There actually W21/5W 580 7443 DRL Daytime Running Lights 27 LED Wedge Bulbs these T20 bulbs and you need the canbus error free one's or your computer will keep saying check DRLs

I have tried may different one's with no success as yet, I am really want to upgrade to LED as changing the drls and brake light bulbs in a pain...

Marcus

manxman020 said:

There actually W21/5W 580 7443 DRL Daytime Running Lights 27 LED Wedge Bulbs these T20 bulbs and you need the canbus error free one's or your computer will keep saying check DRLs

I have tried may different one's with no success as yet, I am really want to upgrade to LED as changing the drls and brake light bulbs is a pain...

Marcus

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With respect Marcus, if you've itemised the exact lights as above, why are you not having any success? There are a lot of these in various formats on ebay so what's the issue? Also why are you having to change tungsten ones apparently so often?

The tungsten DRLs on the car look like candles next to the LED that so many other cars have. I can't imagine why Fiat didn't put LEDs in there. SMART cars use a 4 light cluster (x2) as bright as headlamps - the 500X one is so dim...

R-V-M

On my UK 500X Lounge, the DRLs are single filament P21W lamps. They dim when the lights are switched on, there is no 5W filament. I think this must be done by pulsing the supply, as others on this forum have used leds, which would not dim if the voltage were simply reduced.
These are error free: http://www.halfords.com/motoring/bu...car-bulbs/halfords-382-p21w-led-car-bulbs-x-2
However, note the last feature, for internal or off road use only. This means, like every led filament lamp replacement I have seem, they are not e-marked and are therefore not legal for use here on UK roads. I confess I've installed one to improve the pathetic reversing lamp, but that's as far as I'm prepared to risk invalidating my insurance by driving with illegal lights.

Useful info but since SO MANY vehicles out there on the road use LEDs in the DRLs surely 99% of them are legal?

TrevC said:

On my UK 500X Lounge, the DRLs are single filament P21W lamps. They dim when the lights are switched on, there is no 5W filament. I think this must be done by pulsing the supply, as others on this forum have used leds, which would not dim if the voltage were simply reduced.
These are error free: http://www.halfords.com/motoring/bu...car-bulbs/halfords-382-p21w-led-car-bulbs-x-2
However, note the last feature, for internal or off road use only. This means, like every led filament lamp replacement I have seem, they are not e-marked and are therefore not legal for use here on UK roads. I confess I've installed one to improve the pathetic reversing lamp, but that's as far as I'm prepared to risk invalidating my insurance by driving with illegal lights.

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Yes, all the original fit led lights you see will have been type approved by the manufacturer and are legal. But you can bet that none of them use a readily available and replaceable lamp - the led array is probably built into the lamp unit. Vehicles that have filament lamps fitted will have been type approved with those lamps, and if a subsequent owner replaces one with something that is not approved, technically they are breaking the law.
In practise, I don't believe replacing the P21W lamp in a DRL with a Halfords led constitutes a hazard - it still won't look as bright as many DRLs on Mercs, Range Rovers etc. and the chances of being punished for doing so are very small. I just have a paranoia of insurance companies wriggling out of payment using any excuse, no matter how irrelevent.

I posted about insurance companies some while ago. They simply cannot refuse to pay out to a third party. That's a mandatory provision. Even if you were racing along the street, which is clearly more dangerous than a LED bulb, they'd still have to pay out to third parties.

They could however refuse to honour the comprehensive element of the policy. However they can't do so just because they found a dodgy bulb somewhere. They'd have to demonstrate a link to that modification to the incident. I'm my opinion, they'd have to go some to prove that a 21w equivalent bulb caused an incident. Their strongest card could be if it set fire to the car but this is hopefully unlikely MN albeit not impossible with some Chinese produced tat. The one thing they may do is withdraw the policy after a claim which could impact on your ability to get reasonably priced cover later on.

TrevC said:

I just have a paranoia of insurance companies wriggling out of payment using any excuse, no matter how irrelevent.

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And you are quite right to do so. There is a difference between driving like a lunatic and causing an accident and withholding / failing to declare a modification which could invalidate your insurance. Insurance policies quite clearly state that failure to declare or get approval for a vehicle modification can/could/will invalidate your cover. There is no such statement or protection for them if you drive like an idiot.

They may still have to pay out 3rd party damages in law, which is good, but as far as the your insurance is concerned you are technically uninsured, can be prosecuted for driving without insurance AND the insurance company can and DO then take you to court to recover their losses and expenses.

Declaring a LED bulb replacement to the insurance MIGHT be quite painless. Not entirely the same but I recently discovered that I was required to declare my towbar as a modification and my premium went DOWN.

So has any UK owner with LED DRL's fitted informed their insurer? If so what was their reaction?

Alanw47 said:

Declaring a LED bulb replacement to the insurance MIGHT be quite painless.

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Was fairly painless for my P21 reversing lamp bulb change to LED. Had to be referred to underwriters who wanted confirmation that it was "a bulb *only* change to LED replacement to the reversing light *only* and that no other adjustments or modifications were made to the light unit to do so".

So I got approval for the reversing light bulb change at no extra cost and it is now listed as modification on my car along with the tow bar.

If I gathered anything from this then it is that they were being very specific about exact details and confirmation of reversing light only which leads me to believe they might take a completely different view on "normal external running lights".

It does no harm to ask one's insurer as the worst they can say in NO or hike your premium leaving you to decide

Alanw47 said:

Declaring a LED bulb replacement to the insurance MIGHT be quite painless. Not entirely the same but I recently discovered that I was required to declare my towbar as a modification and my premium went DOWN.

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This is a classic Catch-22. You can't declare fitting aftermarket LED lamp replacements for exterior filament lamps because no LED replacements are E marked so render the car illegal to use on the road (Insurance company won't say anything if you do but you have given them a get-out if you have a claim) Conversely if you don't tell them you have broken your terms and they can invalidate the insurance. They legally have to pay 3rd party claims but will recover the cost from you.


Robert G8RPI

Nello said:

So has any UK owner with LED DRL's fitted informed their insurer? If so what was their reaction?

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Fitting complete, (E) marked DRLs such as those sold by Ring and Hella is not a problem. Changing a filament to LED in an existing light is.
S130's experience is interesting. I think a LED is technically still illegal in a reversing light, but as they are not a required light and not on in normal driving it's very low risk. The fact the insurers asked the questions would make it hard for them to back down as it (sort of) validates the change.


Robert G8RPI.

g8rpi said:

Fitting complete, (E) marked DRLs such as those sold by Ring and Hella is not a problem. Changing a filament to LED in an existing light is.
S130's experience is interesting. I think a LED is technically still illegal in a reversing light, but as they are not a required light and not on in normal driving it's very low risk. The fact the insurers asked the questions would make it hard for them to back down as it (sort of) validates the change.
Robert G8RPI.

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On changing to complete (E) marked DRLs might be legal but it is still a modification that requires your insurer's approval.

As for my reverse lamp bulb change then yes it is interesting. They know I wanted to change it for the 30% improved brightness and that the existing setup is useless. Like you say the reversing lamp is not a legal requirement and is certainly not obligatory.

From the UK Vehicle Lighting Regulations we have:


SCHEDULE 14

requirements relating to optional reversing lamps

1. Number: Not more than two
2. Position: No requirement
3. Angles of visibility: No requirement
4. Alignment: To the rear
5. Markings–
(a) A motor vehicle first used on or after 1st April 1986 and a trailer manufactured on or after 1st October 1985: An approval mark
(b) A motor vehicle first used before 1st April 1986 and a trailer manufactured before 1st October 1985: No requirement
6. Size of illuminated area: No requirement
7. Colour: White
8. Wattage–
(a) A reversing lamp bearing an approval mark: No requirement
(b) A reversing lamp not bearing an approval mark: The total wattage of any one reversing lamp shall not exceed 24 watts
9. Intensity: No requirement
10. Electrical connections: No requirement
11. Tell-tale–
(a) A motor vehicle first used on or after 1st July 1954, provided that the electrical connections are such that the reversing lamp or lamps cannot be illuminated other than automatically by the selection of the reverse gear of the vehicle: No requirement
(b) Any other motor vehicle first used on or after 1st July 1954: A circuit-closed tell-tale shall be fitted
(c) A motor vehicle first used before 1st July 1954: No requirement
(d) Any vehicle which is not a motor vehicle: No requirement

Given that the underwriters in my case have given approval and reading all the regs above then I have a (E) light/lens/cluster with a non E bulb (not that bulbs are E marked) that is less than 24W and no intensity limit/requirement. On all these points yes I think the insurer/underwriters would have an interesting time in court were they to change their mind as I guess they would have so show that an (E) unit with a LED of power less than 24W exceeded and intensity value for which there is no limit.

HOWEVER when you read the Obligatory lighting requirements you can easily see how complicated it all gets with both statutory E Approvals coupled with minimum and maximum *candela* ratings and *intensity* ratings. This is a completely different ball game which is why obligatory lighting (be they bulb or especially LED) are heavily E regulated/approved.

HI RVM ,

They are the correct type of led bulb for the 500L UK I have tried four so far but each time the canbus says check DRLs. It seems the 500L and 500X are different? 500L has a duel filament bulb 21w/5w as used in by Vauxhall, VW, Chrysler and Fiat.

As to why I have to change the brake light bulbs so often? I do not know! but i can now do it in less than 10 minuets (lol) One thing to watch out for when changing the brake light bulbs is the chrome light unit surround, its just held on with plastic clips and they break very easily !!

Back to LED's I have discovered that the headlight bulbs can be replaced with LEDs without affecting the canbus! Another note, changing the headlight bulbs is so easy, no fiddle clips, just spring clip pull out and push in ...