Has anyone gone from a TA to a 1.2 engine?
I'm planning to try and get a test drive in a 1.2 just to see whether I should think about compromising on that in my search for a replacement car that's already built and available to buy. I like the nippiness of the TA so wonder whether I will hate having a bit less oomph if you get what I mean.
I'm interested in other experiences though

I've just gone the other way from the 1.2 to 105 TA. Very different driving experience but both good fun.


The 1.2 needs to be revved to get going and you'll use 1st a lot as it doesn't pull in 2nd even if the car is still rolling eg away from a junction or roundabout. Also on the motorway it will not hold 70MPH in 5th up even a slight hill. You have to go back to 4th to keep your speed up. However, it was a pleasure to drive.

Not that I've owned either engine but depending on which TA you owned you could be down on over 30HP which is quite a lot in a small car. Not only that but the 1.2 is not turbocharged like the TA so you won't experience the boost in power when advancing through the Rev range.

FloJo said:

Has anyone gone from a TA to a 1.2 engine?
I'm planning to try and get a test drive in a 1.2 just to see whether I should think about compromising on that in my search for a replacement car that's already built and available to buy. I like the nippiness of the TA so wonder whether I will hate having a bit less oomph if you get what I mean.
I'm interested in other experiences though

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A decent test dive is probably the next step toward answering your question, but if you have any lingering doubts afterwards, be careful - long term ownership will likely reinforce any perceived shortcomings. They're totally different engines for totally different driving styles - I can't imagine that anyone who was properly happy with one would ever be completely comfortable with the other.

I'd say driving a 1.2 for performance is as likely to be as much of a disappointment as driving a TA for economy.

Given the kind of money you're going to be spending, you need to be sure you're getting what you really want. In your position, I'd be looking hard at other marques, too.

Owning the Panda & 500 side by side for six years has taught me that whilst appearance is a strong influence in a new car purchase decision, when it comes to day-to-day use, practicality trumps style most of the time - compared to the Panda, the 500 has barely half the mileage on it.

I think, having driven 500s with both engines (Parents owned a TwinAir 85bhp for 3 years & have had 3 1.2's as courtesy cars), I'd compromise on something like colour or options before looking to compromise on engine.

The 1.2 was a good engine, and some still are, but of the three 1.2s I've driven, only one (a 14 plate Lounge) was driving 'right'. That one drove nicely, but i'd still have taken the TwinAir instead, given a choice. The 14 plate Pop was a complete dog which blatantly had the well known flat spot problem - I had to thrash it everywhere, even on the slightest inclines, and it'd suddenly surge up to 5000rpm when finding the bite point, meaning I got no more than 44mpg indicated over 150 miles (about 8mpg worse than the TwinAir over the same route). The third, a 15 plate Lounge which I had a month ago was somewhere between the two, drove ok on the open road & got mid-late 40s mpg (so halfway between the dodgy 1.2 and the Parents TwinAir) but it'd still suddenly rev out of control when setting the clutch/accelerator at a junction. I nearly crashed it entering a roundabout as it wheelspan, which I've never done on a dry road before!

And therein lies the problem - the dodgy 14 plate was expected, as the 14 plates were when a lot of the iffy ones cropped-up, but then the second 14 plate was perfect and even more surprising, the 15 plate one was different again, but not as good as one of the 14 plates. The 1.2's since 2014 just seem all over the place with how they drive, and even if they do drive well, I think you'll still struggle to equal the TwinAir MPG unless you're content with going quite a bit steadier than you would do in a TwinAir - no mean feat when you can't get up a slight incline without dropping down a gear and flooring the accelerator.

The TwinAir gets a lot of flack in reviews but for me, if you've got the hang of its unusual power delivery & character, you're better of with it than the 1.2 if you don't mind the higher purchase price

Tough one to say really.

My gut instinct is that you probably would miss the nippiness of the TA as you put it. I still really like the 1.2; my wife's 13 plate 500 is great, as was our old 59 plate 500 and 12 plate Panda with the 1.2 engine. And it does respond nicely when you give it some welly too!

But I just read JTD_Liam's post and to be honest it is absolutely shocking to hear experiences like that with recent 1.2s (combined with all the other ones we've seen in the giant Euro 6 thread!).

As much as I have enjoyed driving the various 1.2s over the years, even if I was in a position to buy a new factory ordered one, I wouldn't now. I would only want to buy used, or perhaps a pre-reg car that a dealer has in stock that you can physically test drive it.

JRK and JTD have pretty well summed it up above. All I have to add is that I had a 1.2 Lounge as a courtesy car when my TA Lounge was being serviced. It was a perfectly nice car to drive, smoother than the TA and with more go than some 1.2s (eg Corsa, Clio). However, I was very glad to get back to my TA!
I think it's probably easier to get good economy from the 1.2 than the TA, although I got 50mpg on my normal work run, the same as my TA gives if I drive with restraint.
New price on the TA was about £800 more than the equivalent 1.2, but 5 years on the TA isn't worth any more, so the 1.2 has lower cost of ownership.
As the others have said, go for a nice long test drive on a variety of roads. Good luck and keep us posted!

Prior to purchasing my 1.2 lounge, I had a TA as a courtesy car for a week and prior to this had a 1.2 for a little longer whilst our Doblo was in for repair.

I absolutely hated the TA as I found that it needed to be driven hard to keep the power on, and this then had a big effect on fuel usage as well as the droning sound similar to using an air bed inflator.

Whereas the 1.2 was a lot quieter, more refined and a smoother power delivery (albeit not as punchy as the TA when the power did arrive), but more importantly for me better fuel economy (mid 50's mpg averaged across 310 miles, compared to around 40mpg across an average of 190 miles in the TA) and for me much easier to live with.

Be in no doubt that the later (2016) 1.2 engine is far more responsive and much better than the engine that was in my previous 1.2 Panda.

I think, the answer is as stated above, to compare both engines in back to back test drives, as everyone will have a different perspective of what they want and what they will be happy to live with.

Interesting variety of responses. I've recently changed from a 59 Plate 1.2 69hp Euro5 to a 16 Plate TwinAir 85hp 500 so can give the reverse experience. When I say, "I" what I mean is Mrs Bee made the change.

In the first 500 miles with the twinair, Mrs Bee has managed 49mpg on a motorway run which is way better than I was expecting and pretty much the same as the 1.2 for the same usage. We haven't done an urban run yet but considering I can get 40mpg out of my 132hp petrol BMW 1 Series and 50mpg out of a 1.2 69hp Fiat 500 on a commute, halfway between for the twinair won't disappoint.

In terms of driving, difference in power delivery is immediately apparent and the twinair is much more capable slotting into gaps around town than the 1.2. I also think it's quieter at motorway speeds. It does need to be driven differently to the 1.2 to keep within its rev band so 5th gear at 30mph isn't viable (at least at our current mileage) but isn't as narrow banded as our works' 1.3MJ Grande Punto pool cars which I find a PITA to efficiently drive around town.

Regarding the outlay, depending on how a car is financed, the Fiat APR on the twinair is significantly lower than an equivalent 1.2 so TCO isn't as straightforward as just the ticket price differential plus depreciation.

Good point on the finance, Gazz Bee - I always buy my cars outright so don't tend to look at that side of things.

Lots of useful comments (as always) here, some of which I did already have in mind. I called in at my dealer earlier and have arranged to borrow a 1.2 for a few hours on Saturday so I'll give it a good drive around on various types of roads and make a decision from there.
They have one nearly new TA lounge with the automatic climate control available in group stock but it's not in one of my preferred colours so I'll see what I decide following the 1.2 test.
I was admiring the glam coral colour in person, I've surprised myself as I'm not a pink type person. I think I may actually prefer it to the mint green option. The new style steering wheel isn't quite as horrible as I think it looks in photos either, so that's a positive .

I test drove the 1.2, and then the TwinAir 85 immediately afterwards on the same route.
The route involved driving out of a town centre, along a fast stretch of single carriageway A-Road, winding B-Road, and then a hill climb, before turning around and coming back the same way.
The difference was incredible. The 1.2 required a lot of full throttle during acceleration, whereas the TA was a lot lighter on the throttle, for the same acceleration. I forget what the comparative fuel economy was, as I was smiling so much, I forgot to properly look!
The TA just felt quicker and nippier.
Going from a 1.8 MG TF, this was definitely the driving joy that won me over. I ended up getting a TA 105

bear in mind most test drives are taken in low mileage demo cars, the TA85 is extremely tight when newish and takes considerable mileage to loosen up. The same could be said for the 1.2 I'm sure but I dont think they're as tight.

I've driven a TA for the last 4.5 years so I'm fairly confident about having experience to be able to compare the 1.2 with. I'm getting it for a few hours to go where I want with it

Ooh...one more thing which I have only just thought of!

If you are going for a Pop Star or Lounge, there are now two options; the regular 1.2 and the 1.2 Eco. I had only noticed this on the configurator a little while ago.

I have no idea how the Eco drives, I am assuming it has had a few tweaks to get it below the 100g/km emissions rating. And maybe some eco tyres.

But worth asking your dealer which one your car has got when you have your test drive.

So, TA it is then
And I quite liked the new TFT console so have added that to my wish list.
Now, I've got to try an decide whether to stick with the volare that I know and love or go for the Coral which is an unexpected option but I keep going back to admire the colour. I've decided that the green is just a little bit too pale for my liking (which is as a shame as green is actually my favourite colour!).
I've asked the sales chap for a discount off list price, he moves to one of the carwow branches on Monday so fingers crossed he takes my offer to order this week as seriously as it is intended and can get himself a sale. Otherwise I may try broadspeed out as the discount they offered online is very tempting.

FloJo said:

So, TA it is then

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I'd be interested to hear your honest opinion of the latest 1.2 after your extended test drive.

FloJo said:

I've asked the sales chap for a discount off list price, he moves to one of the carwow branches on Monday so fingers crossed he takes my offer to order this week as seriously as it is intended and can get himself a sale. Otherwise I may try broadspeed out as the discount they offered online is very tempting.

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This is what I found on the broadspeed website just now. In your situation, I'd certainly use that as my guide price.

Go for the Volare again, it's a great colour for the 500's

I've had 3 TAs and 6 1.2s and I really can't decide. I love the nippyness of the TA, but it's a bit noisy, albeit quite a nice noise. I do like the 1.2 but for performance the TA is much much better.

Worse thing for me about the TA is the dreaded reverse gear growl, I've had it in all 3.

I haven't had any 70mph problems in 5th gear at all.

I would really test drive one as others have said.

OK, so the test drive. And I will apologise in advance because I am in no way a technical car person which I'm sure is already obvious. I'm more interested in how able it is coping with the long and winding of steep hill I drive up as part of my daily commute to work every day.
I ended up driving over to my dad's house (25-ish mile round trip). A mix of town 30 and 40, main duel carriageway A roads (which includes an incline) plus winding country lanes; a route that I know very well I found the car felt sluggish at pulling away in town, or nipping through gaps when cars let me though etc. I couldn't get up to speed as quickly as I was used to in my old car, I needed to be heavier footed on the accelerator. Out of town it was fine once up to speed but obviously slower to get up to speed, to cope with overtaking and going uphill I didn't enjoy having to boot it and drop down into 4th to stand a chance of maintaining speed. Someone above did comment about this being noticeable when you go from being used to a higher powered car to the 1.2.
Previous to my TA I drove a 1.4 lupo and I remember not enjoying the 1.2 when I test drove the various 500 engines then. I stick by this sentiment 5 years on and am happy to go for another TA.
Oh yes - engine noise in a TA doesn't bother me, I guess I'm so used to it? Again, not entirely bothered about getting maximum MPG either. I want a bit of vrooom and a cute car