Technical Dualogic Gearbox

Sprite1962 · Mar 9, 2015

Hi All,

I am looking to buy a 500C in Australia. In the local market it is only available with the Dualogic box.

The dealers represent it as an "automatic" so I drove it as such and was not impressed. Having now done some reading on the topic I now understand that it is really a manual with an automatic clutch.

What advice can you give on the correct technique to use to get smooth changes in both auto and manual modes?

Thanks

ahmett · Mar 9, 2015

Sprite1962 said:
Hi All,

I am looking to buy a 500C in Australia. In the local market it is only available with the Dualogic box.

The dealers represent it as an "automatic" so I drove it as such and was not impressed. Having now done some reading on the topic I now understand that it is really a manual with an automatic clutch.

What advice can you give on the correct technique to use to get smooth changes in both auto and manual modes?

Thanks

lift off the throttle when changing gear, thats about all you can do. It's smoother in manual mode generally as you know when it changes gear.

Adzee · Mar 10, 2015

I have a dual logic 1.4 500s in Aus too. It's good in some ways to learn the way to drive in auto. That it requires the lightest pressure (constant) and it will work beautifully for you, however it will take forever to speed up and whilst it's relaxed people behind you will be impatient. So I have found using the paddles to change is the best, and when under reasonable acceleration you just fester of the accelerator to change smoothly.

It's not for everyone, but I hate dealers the way they don't teach you as you drive it. Too much disinterest in education.

I borrowed the car for a few hours and drove freeways speed bumps hills etc, and liked the way it worked.

See if you can get one for long enough to try it out properly. Don't be afraid of it though, it changes the way you drive a bit too. I tend to drive more relaxed and flowing so I change gears less much like when I had a manual, and better fuel economy is a side effect.

If I had the twin air it may be different because that engine is delicious fun! Good luck.

44sunsets · Mar 11, 2015

Sprite1962 said:
What advice can you give on the correct technique to use to get smooth changes in both auto and manual modes?

At first I thought the gear changes were getting smoother due to my driving style, but now I think it's more due to the Dualogic box either adapting to my driving, or it's been "run in" after the initial period.

Over time, gear changes (esp. 1st to 2nd) will become more smooth, and yes easing off the acelerator pedal during the gear change does help.

It's definitely very different to driving a vanilla torque converter automatic. Wait till you have to do a parallel park and reverse into a spot up a sloping hill, good fun and will really challenge your coordination skills

I love my Dualogic Twinair, I use the paddles quite often although it's not really necessary -- I just like having the extra control. It's very responsive and will often hold on to low gears longer than what I feel is necessary, so you'll usually be in the correct power band for accelerating. Put your foot down on the accelerator and it's pretty quick off the mark.

I like slowing down using engine braking and the paddles are great for that.

liav24 · Mar 13, 2015

Ahmett - i honestly dont see any change putting away my leg from the throttle pedal when it needs to change gear (but on Manual mod its better)
The gear change on the 1.4 is faster with Sport's mode than when on ECO

Sprite1962 - you need to understand how to drive the Dualogic, its like driving Maual just that there is a small robot that changes the gears for you, so be gentle with it, take a few days to learn it - it does need learning - the first time i drove it it was weird for me, few days later i really liked it.

santa · Mar 14, 2015

I loved my Lancia Ypsilon 1.3 MJET with dualogic.
I had no issues with it during the two years I had it.
And I would love to own a dualogic again, just so I can get rid of the bloody clutch pedal ;-)

alexGS · Mar 14, 2015

My other car (Giulietta) has a manual gearbox and, as usual for me, it's a horrible experience of difficulty engaging 1st or reverse, jerkiness, frequent stalling, occasional wheelspin. Pity I spent so much on buying a car only to find it difficult and frustrating to drive. V6 Spider was similar, so was my old 164.

I have no problem at all driving my Dualogic 500. I always drive it in manual mode and I get better results than I do with a manual. I time the gearchange and throttle application just as I would in a manual, and I have the engine/gearbox in Sport mode so that the throttle response is unsullied. Dualogic avoids the disadvantages of a manual and also avoids the disadvantages of an automatic transmission, making it the obvious choice for me. I find it an essential part of the 500's 'fun' character. I especially like being able to switch off and get out of the car without moving the selector - there is no 'P' to engage - knowing that it's parked securely in 1st gear.

I don't like conventional automatics, as they never quite give back that control that you have with a manual or a Dualogic, and they are frequently in the wrong gear in typical driving conditions. Some modern autos select N when stationary, and moving off is then no smoother than with Dualogic, as they have to engage drive first. Operating an automatic transmission manually is usually a secondary function on the selector, with an awkward spring-loading and often a delay or even total ignorance of the manual command.

The Dualogic is for someone that wants a more-convenient, easier-to-drive version of a manual transmission. Such a person would only use the auto mode occasionally; the manual control is the primary function on the selector. The usual criticism of the Dualogic ("slow and jerky" gearchanges) also applies to a manual, to a greater degree for most drivers. Therefore, choosing a manual instead of a Dualogic doesn't resolve the criticism.

For those that expect an automatic, a Dualogic in auto mode is not going to be satisfactory. In non-Sport mode, the system feathers the throttle to smooth the (often poorly-timed) gearchange, which makes the car feel unresponsive and unsettles many drivers. In Sport mode, the delayed self-shifting will seem to hold onto lower gears for too long, compared with a regular auto, and the gearchanges will be noticeable as a result. Auto-only drivers expect to take no part in the gearchanging process. That's why FIAT chose to sell the 500 in the USA with a Japanese automatic transmission, which I wouldn't like (I had an Alfa Romeo 159 diesel with Japanese automatic transmission).

Over the years, I've written loads about Selespeeds and Dualogics and I've owned six of them, have worked on a dozen more. In the context of the 500, see my post #2 in the thread https://www.fiatforum.com/polling-station/304889-you-happy-your-dualogic-transmission.html

-Alex

Sprite1962 · Mar 15, 2015

Thanks all, I have driven one again and am happy with it so am planning to order one.

44sunsets · Mar 15, 2015

alexGS's numerous informative posts on the Dualogic gearbox are what convinced me to go for the 500C. I was not disappointed

alexGS · Mar 15, 2015

44sunsets said:
alexGS's numerous informative posts on the Dualogic gearbox are what convinced me to go for the 500C. I was not disappointed

Lol! Well, thank you (blushes)

It is a refined design in the 500 (shared with the Panda and Grande Punto) - compared to the older Selespeeds (156 and 147), the Dualogic is a more efficient mechanism and is proving to be more reliable. It is also a compact installation and does not clutter the engine bay with pipes, brackets, or reservoirs.

Also, this type of transmission (automated manual) seems to suit a smaller engine. I had a 147GTA Selespeed and the ECU seemed to have difficulty controlling the 3.2L engine's torque - gearchanges were often not smooth!

Here is some (hopefully) constructive advice for those who might be worried about the prospect of owning a Dualogic in the longer term.

There is no service schedule for the transmission, but I think it is best to give it preventative maintenance (fluid changes) about every three years. It seems to be quite common for the fluid level to be low in the reservoir (often, only halfway up to the fill mark) and it also takes on a dirty grey appearance. The heat shield must be removed from the front of the gearbox to expose the reservoir. Personally I like to remove as much dirty fluid as possible; disconnect the fluid pipe from the pump (it has a threaded nut fitting near the bottom of the reservoir), then open the driver's door a few times to empty the reservoir, reconnect the pipe and fill up with fresh Selespeed fluid (Tutela CS Speed). Less than one litre is needed. The reservoir has a screwed-on plastic cap (17mm hex I think). Cleanliness of tools, funnels, etc. is essential.

At the same time, I would change the oil in the gearbox-part (about two litres of a full synthetic GL4 - FIAT's specification is semi-synth Tutela Matryx GL4. There is a Valvoline full-synthetic GL4 (not GL5) which I use. The drain plug is at the back of the diff and the fill plug is on the gearbox front, accessed through a cutaway part of the Dualogic reservoir.

Experience with manual versions shows that changing gearbox oil keeps the manual gear shift action smooth and light, and common sense suggests it would be a good thing to help the Dualogic do its job - that's why I change gearbox oil.

I would also do a calibration using MultiECUScan once a year, as I believe some 'drift' is possible in the position sensor readings.

Of course, with the best will in the world, things can still go wrong. Here are my guesses (only guesses...) at likely causes of a Dualogic fault:
(a) battery (voltage dropouts during starting?),
(b) brake pedal switch/driver's door switch/door wiring (do their other functions work correctly?)
(c) fluid level (check for leaks at the position sensor?)
(d) software problem - an update is possible using FIAT Examiner: this update is claimed to cure fluid leaks (I don't know how it is possible for software to cure a fluid leak!),
(e) pump relay or plug,
(f) clutch worn out (I would expect this at about 130,000km)
(g) pump motor (brushes worn out - I would expect this at about 200,000km)
(h) pressure accumulator sphere low on gas - would expect this to be a common problem at ten years old (we'll see) - sphere appears to be the same as Stilo Abarth and other Selespeeds. Symptoms are that the pump runs for short bursts, has a strained sound, and pressure measured by MultiECUScan may spike higher than normal, leading to a fault code "pump driving relay stuck".

I think in the forum we have learned that, if there is a problem, the system needs careful attention by someone who knows what they are doing. For faults other than the above, the likely recommended remedy (by a dealer) is a complete new actuator assembly, which is supplied by FIAT in a giant box (the actuator is mounted on a plastic cradle, like a sewing machine) and includes the pump and reservoir (shipped pre-filled!)

FIAT has designed the actuator to be a non-serviceable item and to be installed as one component. However, a Selespeed specialist is likely to recognise parts such as the position sensor and the solenoid valves, and may be able to strip and clean them if the need should arise. But again, inexpert intervention will only lead to more problems and aggro - so you have to find someone who is thorough. FIAT do not help the cause by providing very little service information as far as I can tell.

I was just thinking today about how many Dualogic Pandas, Grande Puntos, Punto Evos, Puntos, and 500s there must be on the roads by now - generally, knowledge of systems like Dualogic improves as they become more popular. I'm always on the lookout for more information.

-Alex

ahmett · Mar 15, 2015

T

alexGS said:
Lol! Well, thank you (blushes)

It is a refined design in the 500 (shared with the Panda and Grande Punto) - compared to the older Selespeeds (156 and 147), the Dualogic is a more efficient mechanism and is proving to be more reliable. It is also a compact installation and does not clutter the engine bay with pipes, brackets, or reservoirs.

Also, this type of transmission (automated manual) seems to suit a smaller engine. I had a 147GTA Selespeed and the ECU seemed to have difficulty controlling the 3.2L engine's torque - gearchanges were often not smooth!

Here is some (hopefully) constructive advice for those who might be worried about the prospect of owning a Dualogic in the longer term.

There is no service schedule for the transmission, but I think it is best to give it preventative maintenance (fluid changes) about every three years. It seems to be quite common for the fluid level to be low in the reservoir (often, only halfway up to the fill mark) and it also takes on a dirty grey appearance. The heat shield must be removed from the front of the gearbox to expose the reservoir. Personally I like to remove as much dirty fluid as possible; disconnect the fluid pipe from the pump (it has a threaded nut fitting near the bottom of the reservoir), then open the driver's door a few times to empty the reservoir, reconnect the pipe and fill up with fresh Selespeed fluid (Tutela CS Speed). Less than one litre is needed. The reservoir has a screwed-on plastic cap (17mm hex I think). Cleanliness of tools, funnels, etc. is essential.

At the same time, I would change the oil in the gearbox-part (about two litres of a full synthetic GL4 - FIAT's specification is semi-synth Tutela Matryx GL4. There is a Valvoline full-synthetic GL4 (not GL5) which I use. The drain plug is at the back of the diff and the fill plug is on the gearbox front, accessed through a cutaway part of the Dualogic reservoir.

Experience with manual versions shows that changing gearbox oil keeps the manual gear shift action smooth and light, and common sense suggests it would be a good thing to help the Dualogic do its job - that's why I change gearbox oil.

I would also do a calibration using MultiECUScan once a year, as I believe some 'drift' is possible in the position sensor readings.

Of course, with the best will in the world, things can still go wrong. Here are my guesses (only guesses...) at likely causes of a Dualogic fault:
(a) battery (voltage dropouts during starting?),
(b) brake pedal switch/driver's door switch/door wiring (do their other functions work correctly?)
(c) fluid level (check for leaks at the position sensor?)
(d) software problem - an update is possible using FIAT Examiner: this update is claimed to cure fluid leaks (I don't know how it is possible for software to cure a fluid leak!),
(e) pump relay or plug,
(f) clutch worn out (I would expect this at about 130,000km)
(g) pump motor (brushes worn out - I would expect this at about 200,000km)
(h) pressure accumulator sphere low on gas - would expect this to be a common problem at ten years old (we'll see) - sphere appears to be the same as Stilo Abarth and other Selespeeds. Symptoms are that the pump runs for short bursts, has a strained sound, and pressure measured by MultiECUScan may spike higher than normal, leading to a fault code "pump driving relay stuck".

I think in the forum we have learned that, if there is a problem, the system needs careful attention by someone who knows what they are doing. For faults other than the above, the likely recommended remedy (by a dealer) is a complete new actuator assembly, which is supplied by FIAT in a giant box (the actuator is mounted on a plastic cradle, like a sewing machine) and includes the pump and reservoir (shipped pre-filled!)

FIAT has designed the actuator to be a non-serviceable item and to be installed as one component. However, a Selespeed specialist is likely to recognise parts such as the position sensor and the solenoid valves, and may be able to strip and clean them if the need should arise. But again, inexpert intervention will only lead to more problems and aggro - so you have to find someone who is thorough. FIAT do not help the cause by providing very little service information as far as I can tell.

I was just thinking today about how many Dualogic Pandas, Grande Puntos, Punto Evos, Puntos, and 500s there must be on the roads by now - generally, knowledge of systems like Dualogic improves as they become more popular. I'm always on the lookout for more information.

-Alex

That's what I'm getting Alex a complete new actuator assembly at 1200 euros. I hope this finally fixed the problem and the gearbox and Dualogic ecu (the thing below the actuator assembly is ok) my fiat dealer sent pictures to fiat Hq who recommended changing the whole actuator system and gave 10% off.

Annoying for me to wait one month for the part to come from Italy. Needless to say I am not paying them one cent until after I go for a test drive and am convinced the car is ok

Oh and mind you there is exactly the same problem in a Lancia 1.4 in the same dealership as me !

nedro018 · Mar 19, 2015

alex,

incredible technical advice thanks.

1) when refilling the DL gearbox with tranny oil, how do you know when it's full? i havent opened that fill nut yet so dont know what to "envision". up to the bottom of the threads of the fill nut?

2) still having only read your well written post but not having actually seen these "areas" (ie heat shield) yet in my car, question 2 is, and this is because i have no idea of the engine clearances for the hands in this area: is it possible to suck the old dirty grey reservoir fluid out with a turkey baster or syringe/tube instead of removing the nut on the bottom of the reservoir?

thx alex.

alexGS · Mar 23, 2015

nedro018 said:
1) when refilling the DL gearbox with tranny oil, how do you know when it's full? i havent opened that fill nut yet so dont know what to "envision". up to the bottom of the threads of the fill nut?

Thanks - sorry for the delay in replying - I'm overseas at the moment - yes that is correct, fill until the hole on the front of the gearbox overflows. We're talking about the gearbox oil fill plug on the front of the gearbox casing, surrounded by the plastic reservoir.

2) still having only read your well written post but not having actually seen these "areas" (ie heat shield) yet in my car, question 2 is, and this is because i have no idea of the engine clearances for the hands in this area: is it possible to suck the old dirty grey reservoir fluid out with a turkey baster or syringe/tube instead of removing the nut on the bottom of the reservoir?

When I get back, I will be doing this servicing on my own 500 (a 2009 model, so about due for it) - I will take photos and create a guide.

I think the best way to access that reservoir is from under the front of the car - it can't even be seen from on top in the engine bay - so I think you'll have to jack up and place on axle stands and remove the undertray if there is one. Then it is simple to remove the heat shield and get to the Dualogic fluid (Selespeed fluid) reservoir. Because FIAT didn't make the Dualogic reservoir easy to see, I doubt it is checked even when the car goes to a workshop for a service - which is why I think it's a good idea to know how to check it yourself.

Hence the long post in this thread, but I will definitely do something with photos when I get back and do the job myself

-Alex

ahmett · Mar 23, 2015

alexGS said:
Thanks - sorry for the delay in replying - I'm overseas at the moment - yes that is correct, fill until the hole on the front of the gearbox overflows. We're talking about the gearbox oil fill plug on the front of the gearbox casing, surrounded by the plastic reservoir.

When I get back, I will be doing this servicing on my own 500 (a 2009 model, so about due for it) - I will take photos and create a guide.

I think the best way to access that reservoir is from under the front of the car - it can't even be seen from on top in the engine bay - so I think you'll have to jack up and place on axle stands and remove the undertray if there is one. Then it is simple to remove the heat shield and get to the Dualogic fluid (Selespeed fluid) reservoir. Because FIAT didn't make the Dualogic reservoir easy to see, I doubt it is checked even when the car goes to a workshop for a service - which is why I think it's a good idea to know how to check it yourself.

Hence the long post in this thread, but I will definitely do something with photos when I get back and do the job myself

-Alex

yes you have to jack up the car and remove undertray to check the level. In my opinion absolutely ridiculous = ) Technically Fiat dealer can check it easily when changing the engine oil, but i doubt most do so unless you specifically ask them to.

nedro018 · Mar 23, 2015

alex and ahmett,

thanks to both of you.

i tried to check access to the heat shield the easy way, from on top by removing the radiator reservoir. tried this "easy way" because in my apt complex i cant jack my car up in a maintenance posture.

i can go somewhere else to gain access from the bottom. thx.

my 2013 fiat warranty service runs out in middle of april of this year (2 yrs). i recently brought it in to the turkish fiat dealership (im married to a turk) to fix the start-stop problem which had been ongoing pretty much from the beginning when the car was bought new in april 2013. not that i care much about S-S, i was just trying to get my last "chance" at free service.

in a hail mary attempt, i was trying to get dealership to fess up a new battery before final curtain. i had read from this forum that a defective battery can be one (of the many) inputs to cause start-stop to fail. i am an infrequent driver, so i was thinking this (bad battery) could be my problem hence i brought it in. after 2 years, i have only 14,300km/8800 mi on the car.

2 days before my drop off appt for the above problem, the dualogic clutch suddenly started "grinding" in reverse gear, only. no other gears.

the turkish serv mgr writing up my form wrote down the start-stop issue and promptly said, OK we'll check it out...anything else? i casually mentioned the reverse gear issue in passing and he immediately said: OK let's go; show me. he drove it inside the dealership garage and it was making so much noise going into reverse in the garage that tech's were looking over their hoods. he finished the report and said, there are problems with your car, we will fix them.

they changed out my entire "clutch actuator assembly unit" (translation) but would have nothing to do with the battery swap.

not sure what the "clutch actuator assembly unit" is but felt lucky that it was changed, on their dime. since my original unit went bad during my watch, i wanted to be able to monitor the life of the new unit they put in by checking fluid levels on my own.

any ideas what part/parts they actually changed? was it the whole clutch actuator changing assembly hanging in front of the transmission to include the reservoir too? or just some single servo/actuators?

i had read that fiat dealerships often swap out entire units in such issues to "shotgun" the problem.

thanks.

ahmett · Mar 23, 2015

nedro018 said:
alex and ahmett,

thanks to both of you.

i tried to check access to the heat shield the easy way, from on top by removing the radiator reservoir. tried this "easy way" because in my apt complex i cant jack my car up in a maintenance posture.

i can go somewhere else to gain access from the bottom. thx.

my 2013 fiat warranty service runs out in middle of april of this year (2 yrs). i recently brought it in to the turkish fiat dealership (im married to a turk) to fix the start-stop problem which had been ongoing pretty much from the beginning when the car was bought new in april 2013. not that i care much about S-S, i was just trying to get my last "chance" at free service.

in a hail mary attempt, i was trying to get dealership to fess up a new battery before final curtain. i had read from this forum that a defective battery can be one (of the many) inputs to cause start-stop to fail. i am an infrequent driver, so i was thinking this (bad battery) could be my problem hence i brought it in. after 2 years, i have only 14,300km/8800 mi on the car.

2 days before my drop off appt for the above problem, the dualogic clutch suddenly started "grinding" in reverse gear, only. no other gears.

the turkish serv mgr writing up my form wrote down the start-stop issue and promptly said, OK we'll check it out...anything else? i casually mentioned the reverse gear issue in passing and he immediately said: OK let's go; show me. he drove it inside the dealership garage and it was making so much noise going into reverse in the garage that tech's were looking over their hoods. he finished the report and said, there are problems with your car, we will fix them.

they changed out my entire "clutch actuator assembly unit" (translation) but would have nothing to do with the battery swap.

not sure what the "clutch actuator assembly unit" is but felt lucky that it was changed, on their dime. since my original unit went bad during my watch, i wanted to be able to monitor the life of the new unit they put in by checking fluid levels on my own.

any ideas what part/parts they actually changed? was it the whole clutch actuator changing assembly hanging in front of the transmission to include the reservoir too? or just some single servo/actuators?

i had read that fiat dealerships often swap out entire units in such issues to "shotgun" the problem.

thanks.

wow lucky you! yes thats the part i am changing for 1200 euros! the service tech told me also they try to fix it once but in many cases they replace the whole unit as from what i see, many fixes never actually fix the problem.

philshur · Jul 24, 2020

Hi, I'm new to the forum and Fiat 500's having just purchased a 1.2 Dialogic. I am planning to do a precautionary gearbox oil change but am having trouble removing the heatshield, I have removed all four bolts but can't seem to find a way to remove it completely, do I need to remove anything else to give me room?

Thanks
Phil.

alexGS said:
Lol! Well, thank you (blushes)

It is a refined design in the 500 (shared with the Panda and Grande Punto) - compared to the older Selespeeds (156 and 147), the Dualogic is a more efficient mechanism and is proving to be more reliable. It is also a compact installation and does not clutter the engine bay with pipes, brackets, or reservoirs.

Also, this type of transmission (automated manual) seems to suit a smaller engine. I had a 147GTA Selespeed and the ECU seemed to have difficulty controlling the 3.2L engine's torque - gearchanges were often not smooth!

Here is some (hopefully) constructive advice for those who might be worried about the prospect of owning a Dualogic in the longer term.

There is no service schedule for the transmission, but I think it is best to give it preventative maintenance (fluid changes) about every three years. It seems to be quite common for the fluid level to be low in the reservoir (often, only halfway up to the fill mark) and it also takes on a dirty grey appearance. The heat shield must be removed from the front of the gearbox to expose the reservoir. Personally I like to remove as much dirty fluid as possible; disconnect the fluid pipe from the pump (it has a threaded nut fitting near the bottom of the reservoir), then open the driver's door a few times to empty the reservoir, reconnect the pipe and fill up with fresh Selespeed fluid (Tutela CS Speed). Less than one litre is needed. The reservoir has a screwed-on plastic cap (17mm hex I think). Cleanliness of tools, funnels, etc. is essential.

At the same time, I would change the oil in the gearbox-part (about two litres of a full synthetic GL4 - FIAT's specification is semi-synth Tutela Matryx GL4. There is a Valvoline full-synthetic GL4 (not GL5) which I use. The drain plug is at the back of the diff and the fill plug is on the gearbox front, accessed through a cutaway part of the Dualogic reservoir.

Experience with manual versions shows that changing gearbox oil keeps the manual gear shift action smooth and light, and common sense suggests it would be a good thing to help the Dualogic do its job - that's why I change gearbox oil.

I would also do a calibration using MultiECUScan once a year, as I believe some 'drift' is possible in the position sensor readings.

Of course, with the best will in the world, things can still go wrong. Here are my guesses (only guesses...) at likely causes of a Dualogic fault:
(a) battery (voltage dropouts during starting?),
(b) brake pedal switch/driver's door switch/door wiring (do their other functions work correctly?)
(c) fluid level (check for leaks at the position sensor?)
(d) software problem - an update is possible using FIAT Examiner: this update is claimed to cure fluid leaks (I don't know how it is possible for software to cure a fluid leak!),
(e) pump relay or plug,
(f) clutch worn out (I would expect this at about 130,000km)
(g) pump motor (brushes worn out - I would expect this at about 200,000km)
(h) pressure accumulator sphere low on gas - would expect this to be a common problem at ten years old (we'll see) - sphere appears to be the same as Stilo Abarth and other Selespeeds. Symptoms are that the pump runs for short bursts, has a strained sound, and pressure measured by MultiECUScan may spike higher than normal, leading to a fault code "pump driving relay stuck".

I think in the forum we have learned that, if there is a problem, the system needs careful attention by someone who knows what they are doing. For faults other than the above, the likely recommended remedy (by a dealer) is a complete new actuator assembly, which is supplied by FIAT in a giant box (the actuator is mounted on a plastic cradle, like a sewing machine) and includes the pump and reservoir (shipped pre-filled!)

FIAT has designed the actuator to be a non-serviceable item and to be installed as one component. However, a Selespeed specialist is likely to recognise parts such as the position sensor and the solenoid valves, and may be able to strip and clean them if the need should arise. But again, inexpert intervention will only lead to more problems and aggro - so you have to find someone who is thorough. FIAT do not help the cause by providing very little service information as far as I can tell.

I was just thinking today about how many Dualogic Pandas, Grande Puntos, Punto Evos, Puntos, and 500s there must be on the roads by now - generally, knowledge of systems like Dualogic improves as they become more popular. I'm always on the lookout for more information.

-Alex

irc · Jul 24, 2020

Hi and welcome.

Apologies for not answering your question about removing the "heat shield", and please feel free to ignore my advice if you wish.

Would be good to know why you are wanting to do a precautionary oil change... do you mean oil, or Selespeed fluid?

Unless you already have a problem, it might be wiser to leave it alone.

If you do already have a problem, I would be surprised if an oil change (gearbox) or Selespeed fluid (actuator) would improve things at all.

Changing Selespeed fluid is probably only worthwhile if you are replacing the accumulator, as it will retain some old fluid.

It also must be done following the correct procedure, following system depressurisation.

Even checking the level properly requires connection to a computer to depressurise.

Many Dualogic problems I have come across have been caused by well intentioned but unnecessary actions.

Just trying to help out.

philshur · Jul 28, 2020

Thanks for your reply, I was referring to changing the main gearbox oil, not the Selespeed fluid. In my experience although it's not always part of a scheduled service it can be beneficial to change gearbox oil after 50/60 thousand miles. i think I need to remove the heatshield in order to get to the level plug for the main gearbox oil, that is why I was asking how to completely remove it.

Best Regards
Phil.

irc · Jul 28, 2020

It is only the 4 bolts ...although the rubbers do stick, and because the cover is basically thick tinfoil, it often bends before they unstick.

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