tumbledown
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hi all am awaiting new 1.4 lounge and wondered if anyone has tried any of the aftermarket ECU upgrades, and if they had any positive results? many thanks steve....
Technical chipping is it a waste or do they work?
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Technical chipping is it a waste or do they work?
Chipping is rubbish. Remappings the way forward :slayer:
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Wont see massive gains on paper but i would imagine it will greatly improve the power delivery and the way the car drives 
Wont see massive gains on paper but i would imagine it will greatly improve the power delivery and the way the car drives
Whats that Matt? Chipping or remap
i had a induction kit and a remap on my 1.2 sport,, massive difference
Whats that Matt? Chipping or remap
Either.
Remember chipping is usually not done on cars that are mappable. It's used on cars where a remap can't easily be done.
A remap is so much better than a chip:-
-remap the ecu isn't physically opened i.e. warranty issue
-changing the map or fuel ratio can actually help the engine, there is a theoretical optimum fuel to air ratio which the manufacturers don't necessarily abide to due to emissions and catering or all the different altitudes temps in the world the car is sold to.
- a rolling road remap is always the best option as it creates e new map for your specific car for that altitude, temp etc.
- remaps that are bought off the shelf are in my book not worth the money as they usually just add more fuel with no real in depth testing to your specific car and sometimes (I have seen it) less fuel which is very bad for the engine.
- some companies do piggy back boxes which can be good as you can easily take it off yourself and you have you original map working again. But again it is best to do a good rolling road session and taylor the map on the piggy back box.
- remaps are even more important on diesels than petrol
- step up is a piggyback box with a rolling road and a better wide band O2 sensor.
-remap the ecu isn't physically opened i.e. warranty issue
-changing the map or fuel ratio can actually help the engine, there is a theoretical optimum fuel to air ratio which the manufacturers don't necessarily abide to due to emissions and catering or all the different altitudes temps in the world the car is sold to.
- a rolling road remap is always the best option as it creates e new map for your specific car for that altitude, temp etc.
- remaps that are bought off the shelf are in my book not worth the money as they usually just add more fuel with no real in depth testing to your specific car and sometimes (I have seen it) less fuel which is very bad for the engine.
- some companies do piggy back boxes which can be good as you can easily take it off yourself and you have you original map working again. But again it is best to do a good rolling road session and taylor the map on the piggy back box.
- remaps are even more important on diesels than petrol
- step up is a piggyback box with a rolling road and a better wide band O2 sensor.
Minor correction on that point for the 1.4. You have to take the ECU out of the car and solder on some resistors to allow it to be written over. It's not a dramatic procedure and Fiat wouldn't be able to tell you've done it because the resistor is only across two pins for the length of time the remap is done.
maybe with the remapper u used but other places do not need to do that
just an OBD2 port connectionI would also be really interested to learn more on costs here, especially a remap on a 1.2, plus induction kit...
What are the results (ie BHP)? Even thought I know real world driving is not necessarily all about BHP, the torque curve is the good bit.
What are the results (ie BHP)? Even thought I know real world driving is not necessarily all about BHP, the torque curve is the good bit.
I have been quoted many price:
- standard remap off the shelf £300-£400
- rolling road remap £350 from red dot but some people here don't like them and I am not sure why.
Power gain is anywhere between 5-20% depending on how good the guys are and what else you fit.
I've heard the BMC filter made no difference on the 1.4 turbo lump, I reckon a less restricted exhaust will help though.
- standard remap off the shelf £300-£400
- rolling road remap £350 from red dot but some people here don't like them and I am not sure why.
Power gain is anywhere between 5-20% depending on how good the guys are and what else you fit.
I've heard the BMC filter made no difference on the 1.4 turbo lump, I reckon a less restricted exhaust will help though.
I don't have a specific rolling road graph for a 1.2 but attached is a graph comparing my 1.4 in standard and with remap and induction kit. It'll give you an idea. I think Oldschool has a similar image for a 1.2 but he's on holidays until the end of the month.
Attachments
maybe with the remapper u used but other places do not need to do that
Depends on the car/ecu
Magneti Marelli IAW ECU's dont generally need putting in boot mode, Bosch petrol ecu's do, but the diesel ones dont. You achieve this by grounding a pin on one of the ECU connectors whilst you have equipment connected to the cars OBD port.
Bench flashing is better anyway as if there was a massive voltage drop or whatever and the battery voltage dropped suddenly it can effect the write process and mean the whole thing takes a lot longer.
If they really wanted to tell if your car had been mapped, they could, even if returned back to the original file.
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maybe with the remapper u used but other places do not need to do that
Interesting. Was yours mapped without removal? I've seen two different people at different places map a 1.4 and they both had to pull the ECU and do the solder. They tried mine with an OBD2 and and it could read out but not write.
I wonder if there is variation in the ECU's and versions of the same engine that allow or deny this? Your's is Euro spec isn't it? Be interesting to compare ECU's, see if there is a difference.
On a N/A car remapping will give a very limited increase. Do you really think playing with spark and fuel can yield a big advantage over a manufactures map which has taken hundreds of hours to perfect in a totally controlled dyno cell environment where any climate can be replicated in a hour or two on a r/r using a PC or lap-top, no.
And please don't spout rubbish about poor fuels in other countries, anywhere in Europe fuel of a very high standard is available, in fact most have higher octanes available than what we do.
Yes maybe some minor increases can be had, and an improvement on driveability can be had. And maybe if the mappers know what they are doing they can adjust throttle response on the fly-by-wire cars to further enhance the driveability of the car.
Remapping has more benefit when the car has had other work done to it, though even then modern ECU's with knock & lambda sensors and ignition advance etc have more than the ability to take into account induction and exhaust systems.
This is why in general re-mapping companies will not list a bhp/lb ft increase on N/A cars as its not like turbo cars where increases by remapping are much more defined, and by listing a figure and your car doesn't get it you could then say under trades description act that the service they provided didn't meet the amount that was advertised and get your money back, so by saying you will get approx 3-5% they cover themselves. Because lets face it a 5% increase on a 100bhp is not going to be felt by anyone.
I am sure in many cases its a placebo effect more a wanting to feel an increase after shelling out cash on a remap, then truly feeling it.
And please don't spout rubbish about poor fuels in other countries, anywhere in Europe fuel of a very high standard is available, in fact most have higher octanes available than what we do.
Yes maybe some minor increases can be had, and an improvement on driveability can be had. And maybe if the mappers know what they are doing they can adjust throttle response on the fly-by-wire cars to further enhance the driveability of the car.
Remapping has more benefit when the car has had other work done to it, though even then modern ECU's with knock & lambda sensors and ignition advance etc have more than the ability to take into account induction and exhaust systems.
This is why in general re-mapping companies will not list a bhp/lb ft increase on N/A cars as its not like turbo cars where increases by remapping are much more defined, and by listing a figure and your car doesn't get it you could then say under trades description act that the service they provided didn't meet the amount that was advertised and get your money back, so by saying you will get approx 3-5% they cover themselves. Because lets face it a 5% increase on a 100bhp is not going to be felt by anyone.
I am sure in many cases its a placebo effect more a wanting to feel an increase after shelling out cash on a remap, then truly feeling it.
Interesting. Was yours mapped without removal? I've seen two different people at different places map a 1.4 and they both had to pull the ECU and do the solder. They tried mine with an OBD2 and and it could read out but not write.
I wonder if there is variation in the ECU's and versions of the same engine that allow or deny this? Your's is Euro spec isn't it? Be interesting to compare ECU's, see if there is a difference.
Its more than likely the remapping agents hardware that make the difference.
Some companies may use flashing hardware which uses the the same protocol as the official fiat hardware, so it can be done securely through the OBD port (over K-line or CAN)
Other hardware doesnt and uses bootmode. This is a small program embedded in the ECU's processor. It is enabled by grounding a pin and the flash can be written using a serial connection and a protocol defined by the processors manufacturer.
Theres that much different hardware on the market for remapping specialists and they all differing support for different ecus
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double post ooops
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Agree - think of it in terms of pre ECU days where messing about with main jets, ignition timing would have very little effect unless considerable work had been done - camshaft, exhaust manifold, lightening and balancing, compression ratio, bigger/twin carbs. All physical changes.
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